to give up breastfeeding after 4 days?

[HeldTogetherByGafferTape]

I had my first baby on Wednesday morning. A little girl. 8’10 was her birth weight and she’s lost a pound since then. She’s amazing.

The birth was a little more traumatic than I’d hoped. 2 day induction, emergency C-section where the epidural didn’t fully work, followed by further complications to my own health which kept me completely bed bound and involved various fairly invasive procedures for a few days.

The midwife came to the house this morning and said that everything looks good, apart from the weight loss which we need to keep an eye on, but as the day has worn on I’m starting to worry that something is really wrong.

I’m trying to breastfeed. It didn’t get off on the best foot due to my own health complications (couldn’t sit up to feed) but she seemed comforted when sucking, and the hospital raised no concerns when they watched me. However after a day of trying and failing to feed her today at home I’m at my wits end. She’s only had one nappy today (wee + poo), she’s been crying a lot and her wee voice has gone all croaky - does this mean she’d dehydrated?

I thought the problem was that my milk just hadn’t come in yet, but have just confirmed that it has by expressing a little. So I think the problem is my technique and her latch.

Baby sucks fine - she loves it in fact, she wants to suck all day and all night. I think her latch is wrong and as a result my nipples are so painful that I want to smack my head off the wall as she gets on. I know this is wrong for a start. She sucks a lot, but doesn’t swallow. She ‘feeds’(sucks) for a only a few minutes before she dozes off which isn’t right either. After a very quick 5 min snooze she wakes again and immediately starts sucking her hands/crying for food again, so something isn’t working.

She’s been up all night for the past 2 nights (and I mean literally all night without at break). I probably tried to get her in her cot 40 times. She’d suck, doze off, and wake again as soon as I tried to move her). I thought this was just newborn stuff, but I’m starting to really worry she’s really dehydrated or Im making her really sick dilly dallying around trying to get her to eat.

When I look at her latch, and compare it to breastfeeding videos on the internet, the only difference I can see is the her bottom jaw is not open wide enough, and instead is clamped around the bottom of the nipple, but no amount of coaxing, reshifting, taking her off and putting her on again, repositions (football, cross cradle, laid back) or pushing her back in towards me will convince her to open wider.

Complicating the issue is that I can’t stop crying. Literally can’t stop. I think it’s hormones with my milk coming in, but it’s clouding my judgement and I’m winding myself into a frenzy not knowing what to do. I’m also sleep deprived - she wont settle anywhere but on my chest, she is either there or on my nipple we tried earlier to have a little enforced break so I could have a nap but her voice got so harsh and croaky with crying that even my ultra-positive husband had to bring her through to me to calm her on my chapped nipple. On top of this I’m also bleeding a lot, my C wound is painful, and side effects from the other complications are giving me vertigo, so Im not feeling great. I also have this growing idea that Im going to accidentally kill the baby either by not waking up if she’s in trouble, standing up and forgetting she’s on my knee or now through this. I am aware that this is unlikely and that it’s really out of character for me to think like this (suggesting hormones might be going wild and potentially a dose of baby blues are at play too).

The question is though, what should I do?

Should I give her some formula in the next hour? Just to make sure she has something in her tum? I don’t even know how to make it, but I could learn quick. Would this mean game over for breastfeeding? Why are you not meant to mix the two so early on when trying to establish breastfeeding.

Should I try to express and bottle feed. Not sure how well this would go with the painful nips but happy to give anything a try. Again might this interfere with breastfeeding

Should I try a few more breastfeeding things to see if I can improve her latch? My nipples really are on another planet of pain (and I say this after a week of quite a lot of extreme pain) but I’m up for trying.

My husband is calling the hospital now? Have I making her ill by delaying?

Any advice would be so much appreciated. It sounds so self indulgent but I feel like such a failure as a mum already. I just want to do what's right by the wee sausage, and I don't know what that is.

Honestly? I'd go and buy a pack of ready made milk in bottles and give the baby some formula. Have a sleep (hopefully both of you) then reassess. Be kind to yourself, you're doing a great job.

I can say from experience that giving one or two formula feeds from a bottle if you're exhausted / worried will not instantly ruin breastfeeding so if doing this will stop you stressing then do so. Send dh for some of the ready made formula and then you don't need to worry if you've made it up properly.

Then try to get some real life advice on your latch / feeding - is there any breastfeeding support available in your area (health visitor or lactation consultant led)? If you can find someone who can support you properly it will make all the difference (if you feel you want to carry on).

And follow the lansinoh advice - lifesaver!

Congratulations on your new baby OP.

The rush of hormones on day 3-4 is no joke. (And mine obviously haven't sorted themselves out 6 months in because your post made me teary)

I can't offer any practical advice unfortunately as I was never able to bf but whatever you decide to do remember that your baby needs a happy mum and she will thrive on breastmilk or formula. You are not a failure as a mum, the very fact that you are so worried about her means you are already an amazing mother.

Oh and give her a bottle and see if it helps get you some sleep. It might make the difference between you being able to persevere with breastfeeding.

OP, here is some immediate advice that worked for me in an almost identical situation. I was not quite as bad as you physically, but all else is the same - induction, emergency C-section, baby loosing tons of weight, baby being awake constantly and crying. It is very possible that your body is not making enough milk yet. I have no idea why maternity ward staff are often so clueless about it, but, having had my own experience and spoken about this to a let of people afterwards, I am convinced that milk often just does not come in after a C-section.

What I was shown by one midwife who knew something was topping the baby up with formula either out of a special cup or just let the baby lap it off like a kitten off a spoon. This works really well if you are afraid of causing nipple confusion by using bottles like I was. After initial week of pure feeding hell, I used this method and it worked very well for me. I breastfed my son, then gave him formula from a cup, then breastfed him again if he was awake. This continued for about 10 days, after which my milk came in properly and my son started refusing the formula from the cup. I ended up breastfeeding him exclusively until 6 months and then only stopped breastfeeding when he was 2.

But while I breastfed very successfully, I was never a very good "milking cow". I could never express very much, never leaked like all my other friends with newborns, and my son could hang on my breast for absolutely ages and ages and much more often than all my friends' babies. But both of us were absolutely fine in the end.

Good luck.

You sound just like I did with my first. In the end, I gave up but I felt disappointed. It's not easy, but I felt stupid for not being able to do it. With my second, I saw a breast feeding consultant at the local family centre and she was great - you can phone LaLecheLeague 24 hours a day, can't you?

There are pluses and minuses with both methods of feeding, and only you know what you're willing to sacrifice.

Good luck, if you can bear the pain for another day and a half then get yourself to see your local breast feeding consultant - your midwife will have the contact details. Ultimately it's your decision - it's worrying when they're so little, but babies are hardy little things. Whatever happens, you tried your best, but traumatic births really take it out of you. You are not alone, having a baby is such hard work and those first few days are just so strange, in an exhausted fog - you mourn your old life but feel ungrateful all at the same time.

Good luck, hope you work it out x

It gets better. It's so hard to explain why it just stops hurting - it's not even that you get used to the pain. It just...stops.

And in a few months, if you don't stop, things will be easier and you'll have more options. But it can feel like things are conspiring against you. I felt like the mass of guilt trip information to get you to bf had the opposite effect - I remember at your stage frantically googling to see if one bottle of formula is the end of the world and it seemed like every thing I found said it was. IT ABSOLUTELY ISN'T. By all means give a bottle of formula or an EBM chaser if you're worried in the early days. But take all the bf support you can find if you want to continue. There will be people who can advise on mix feeding too.

I got readmitted to hospital on day 3 because DS had lost too much weight. I'd been breastfeeding but my milk hadn't come in (EMCS) so he wasn't getting anything. The health visitor had come round at 10am, and after a weird interlude where she basically punched me in the boob and bellowed "it's SUPPOSED to hurt", she sent us straight to hospital. My baby was getting floppy and we hadn't left the house before. Very scared. We had to go to A&E, then wait, then a different waiting room, then a cubicle where we were left alone for hours injecting oral rehydration salts into his mouth. Eventually, a doctor shows up.

"I understand you're keen on breastfeeding. Well, unfortunately you have two choices. We need to keep you and your son in over night. You can either (mumbles) give him a bottle of formula or (brightly) since you're keen on breastfeeding we can put a tube directly into his stomach and feed him that way!"

"What? A tube? That sounds awful. No let's just give him a bottle of formula"

"Really? I thought you wanted to breastfeed but okay".

"Can I have a breast pump please? I want to try and express"

"Fine but don't get your hopes up, you probably won't make anything"

So after hours of waiting my poor DS finally got offered a bottle of formula at 6pm. Meanwhile I hooked myself up to the hospital grade pump and stayed up all night pumping. Happily DS only needed that one bottle of formula and we gave him the rest of his feeds with EBM.

We'd have saved a lot of time if we'd gone to Boots in the first place instead of A&E. It wasn't presented as an option - it was just "GET TO A&E NOW".

Similarly antenatal wards aren't allowed to keep formula in stock as the thinking is if it's offered everyone will just FF instead.

It's a lot of funny messages to send out - in my case I felt like I was determined to breastfeed to spite them.

We're still BFing 8 months later.

I'm by no means an expert (my first baby is now 12 weeks) but just wanted to let you know that when my DS also lost a lot of weight at 4 days old because of my difficulties with breast feeding, the midwives talked me into giving him a few formula feeds from a bottle. I was convinced this would give him nipple confusion, ruin my supply and mean the end of breast feeding, but it didn't - the formula kept him going and gave me a bit of breathing space and he had no problem going back on the breast afterwards. (I expressed a bit too to keep up supply) So, I just wanted to let you know that I don't think it has to be all or nothing- your DH could give your baby a bit of formula (or expressed milk) to give you a break?

Hope you are feeling better now OP. I remember not being able to stop crying when my milk came in, it was awful!! We also had problems breastfeeding. Please see someone face to face, either an NCT or La Leche League breastfeeding group, get your partner to google where and on what days. Also the NCT breastfeeding helpline is supposed to be good. We went out on day 1 and bought nipple shields and I swore by them for 8 weeks as DD had tongue tie and a terrible latch. I liked Medela ones and you can get them on Amazon Prime. Maybe see a lactation consultant? Where are you based? I saw a brilliant one in SE London and even if there is no tongue tie the face to face and phone support was brilliant and I she always made an effort to see me ASAP when I was struggling, even next day. Some do home visits too. Sorry if this is all repetition, don't have time to read all previous posts but wanted to comment! Ultimately if you need to give a bottle of formula for your sanity then i don't think one bottle will ruin your chances of breast feeding, as long as you get some face to face support as well. Also have you tried a dummy for when she comfort sucks? DD had one at 1 week and never got nipple confusion, her latch did improve and now at almost 8 months she rarely has it so don't worry about it necessarily being a battle to get them to stop using it later! Anyway I'll stop rambling now, really hope you're feeling better and keep posting for support if you need it, I know I found it extremely helpful when I was going through this!

Hugs OP. It's so so hard at first. You sound like you are doing so well under really trying circumstances. A lot of new Mum's aren't dealing with the sort of pain and infirmity that you are. And a two day induction - you must be exhausted.
There is lots of good advice on here. Two things I would say leap out at me:

1. Stop trying to put your little baby in her cot. She just isn't going to be one of those newborns (if they even exist) that can be put down like that. Stop putting all of you through it. She will simply cry and cry. Take a deep breath and accept that she will need to sleep on you or your husband, at least for now. She is absolutely tiny and vulnerable - crying is really all she has in terms of survival mechanisms. She doesn't want to be left alone, and for good reason. She is supposed to be attached to you - for now.

1. Nipple shields. Get them. They are not ideal because they can stop all the milk getting through but if it saves your nipples, use them, maybe every second feed, or just for a day or two to give your poor nipples a break.

Good luck. I agree with the PP who says your milk is just about to come in. It's only been 4 days, you're doing fab xxx

Sorry, what I meant to say was not "the milk does not come in after a C-section", but "the milk does not come in straight away after a C-section". Mine took nearly two weeks to make a proper appearance.

Special plastic formula feeding cups for newborns should be available in maternity wards. But spoons work just as well! Just don't poor the formula into the baby mouth. Put the spoon on the baby's lower lip and let her lap it like a kitten (they really do it).

Oh OP! You sound exactly like me when dc1 was born. Haven't got time to write a really detailed reply but I would suggest...

Nipple shields. I used them for months whilst exclusively breastfeeding until one day we no longer needed them and carried on without. I was healed in a couple of days and feeding was no longer painful.

Lansinoh - amazing stuff. Sit on the tube to warm it up and it'll be easier to apply.

Crying and doubting your abilities is totally normal - there's a massive surge in hormones around now. It will soon pass.

Get your husband to feed her some expressed milk with a Calpol syringe while you sleep.

Have a warm bath.

Have as much skin to skin as possible.

If she's falling asleep feeding, strip her down or blow on her cheeks.

Which area are you in? There are some great volunteer led breastfeeding support services in many places. Someone might be able to come round.

Call your community midwife and ask her to come round - mine did and was bloody fantastic.

After 2 weeks I found it much easier, and easier still at 6. At 4 days though I was a sobbing, shaking mess.

You are great and you will be fine. If you do decide to use formula, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that either. Good luck and congratulations on your beautiful girl

pistachio your story is awful. How dare they send a 3 days post partum mother to sit in a waiting room for hours. I would not even have been able to sit in the seats. You should have been at home in bed - what were they thinking?

Oh OP

I found the first bit of breastfeeding really rough too. And baby blues are awful.

If you do end up giving a bottle of formula it doesn't mean you can't continue breastfeeding as well. I know several people who had to mixed feed their newborns for various reasons and then went on to successfully breastfeed for many months.

I topped up with formula for a week or so (between days 3 and 10) as my nipples were to painful.

Once they healed a bit we went back to exclusive best feeding and she still feeds aged 20m.

I expressed my milk for the feeds I used formula albeit not that many feeds as she was a bottle refuser so getting formula or expressed milk into her was hard

Do what you have to do and do not feel guilty.

You'll always have someone who says "my baby chewed both my nipples off and still I ebf for 8 years"

It's not a competition, formula is not poison.

Congratulations :)
Nipple shields worked for me with my first my second never got the hang of it and had to go on to formula.
Whatever you decide don't let it be about anyone other than you and your baby.

Don't assume that the latch isn't good because it hurts. It does bloody hurt and then sooner or later it stops. Lansinoh is really really useful, slather it on.

If you want to give formula do, if you don't that's fine too. Just be easy on yourself. Hormones are buggers.

I was in a similar position to you and gave up trying to breastfeed after 4 frustrating, painful, horrible days. I felt incredibly guilty but sooooo relieved when I made the decision to stop. Do whatever makes you happy. My 4 year old son is now perfectly happy and healthy!

deadgood - thanks! Up all night on a camp bed after an EMCS is not what you want - but it did at least make me think "I'll show those fuckers". What's astonishing is I don't think my story is unusual at all :(

I'm having / have had major problems breastfeeding that i won't get into because that's my issues.

I think you should ask your husband to go to the shops and buy those expensive premade new born bottles (aptamil do some if you don't know what brand to look at). Give the baby some formula, you will both get some sleep and get your strength up then try again tomorrow preferably with a nipple shield. Try to express as much as you can also onto a spoon for baby as this will help with your supply.

The early days of breastfeeding suck. They are awful, and you're doing wonderfully to get this far.

Firstly, the best bit of advice I ever read (think it was on here), was don't quit on a bad day.

The way you're describing her feeding pattern seems completely normal for a newborn. She has a very tiny tummy and is trying to build a supply, she is also very likely to be very sleepy from such a traumatic labour, it's tiring for them too.

Get some lansinoh, it saved my sanity in the early days, and if you're nipples are really bad get some nipples shields (I can't comment on them as I never used them, but heard good things).

Personally, I would get someone to be on food duty. Bringing you snacks and drinks in bed (please keep hydrated), and plan to spend the next couple of days in bed with the baby - lots of skin to skin, lots of feeding, lots of rest when you can. Have a Google for the LLL helpline/ search Facebook for your local LLL group who can offer massive amounts of support and advice at all times of the day and night. I promise it does get better.

You have been through so much already and given life to this baby, every single mouth ful she has already had even if there are weight issues, you have still pumped her full of anti bodies and all kinds of goodness!!!

So dont beat yourself up!

I only replied as this comment stood out due to my own health complications (couldn’t sit up to feed)

I had a section and fed on my side lying down to begin with, then I had a v pillow to lift baby up to me, when in bed, then at home I had an arms reach co sleeper cot, so again, in the night I didnt have to sit up, just lay on my side.

Good luck and dont beat yourself up!

Iv fed both ways.

Having baby fall asleep during feeds is completely natural. For first while I had to strip mine to their nappies to feed then pop them down when they fell asleep on boob. Usually ended up doing this a few times to get a big enough feed.

I also had to gently pull baby's chin down with my finger to get a wide mouth then flip nipple in.

Dot be afraid if formula. Tbh if I were going to bf again and introduce a bottle of formula for one of the evenings feeds. That way dh can feed and you can get extra sleep as bf babies do tend to wake every 2/3 hours.

Breastflow bottles are great for keeping latch.

As others said lasinoh is going to be a huge friend

I can only tell you my experience. We had a v tough 4 weeks of trying to get bfeeding going and it was the worst experience of my life- but now my DD is able to bf and it is amazing. So if you want to battle through you almost certainly can, especially as it sounds you are producing milk. Your experience sounds very similar to mine, actually almost exactly except that my DD ended up completely refusing the boob for several weeks as she had an undiagnosed tongue tie.

1- get to a lactation consultant pronto, Monday if you are mobile enough to get out of bed. If you can afford to go private (£50-100ish) then do as it will be quicker.

2- get checked for tongue tie, especially a hidden one in the back of the mouth. Get a consultant to do this as midwives etc just don't have the training. My DD had a posterior tie that about 50 people missed.

3- if your baby is damaging your nipples with a poor latch you may be better off pumping and bottle feeding, I did this for nearly 4 weeks and my DD went back to the boob after her tie was cut instantaneously. nipple confusion is possible but there are bottles that have slow release that are supposed to help. Get an electric pump not a hand one or you'll be exhausted. If you go down the pumping route, you must pump at night as well as day or your supply will reduce, so don't skip a night pump by giving formula instead!

Whatever you do, don't beat yourself up about it. It is tough, your emotions are all over, you're sleep deprived and frankly in the shittiest spot, but it will get better!

If you end up stopping breastfeeding then that is absolutely fine too!

Hope you've been able to get some help, loads of good advice above. Another contributing fact to your newborn being sleepy is that the peak of normal newborn jaundice is generally around day 4-5, and that can make babies a bit more sleepy. If jaundice is really pronounced then might need checking, but doesn't sound likely.

Hang in there one way or another and you'll be amazed in a week how much better everything looks.