To think that people who worry about gender stereotyping their kids are a bit OTT

[ilovemonsters]

I've Nc'd so if I get flamed/biscuits the shame won't stick

So I know this is a hot topic and I might get slandered here but I've seen a lot of posts in threads where parents are worrying about gender stereotyping their kids and I've just seen a post on a Facebook page saying "my daughter loves playing with a scratty old hand me down doll at my parents house, is it appropriate for me to buy her a nice new doll or am I gender stereotyping her?"

I really want to post and say "oh FFS your kid likes dolls let her play with a damn doll!! Not every frigging toy has to be rainbow coloured and gender neutral for goodness sake!!!"

Or am I horrendously out of date and crushing my daughters' souls by just letting them play with whatever they like playing with whether it's a doll, a ball or a tea set?!

I think people worry too much about this. Dd has a doll's pram and she also has a tool bench. She plays with both and ds plays with both.

I let them get on with it. I only restrict toys that are not appropriate for ds because of his age.

The people who get flustered if anyone dares to refer an unborn baby's gender rather than sex also get on my nerves. Sorry, but if the scan shows it's a boy, then it's a boy

What do you mean?

Yes, the scan shows the sex, in that case that it's a boy, with male genitalia. Whether he'll conform to gender stereotypes is a different thing.
Because gender is a social construct, and it varies according to the society the boy is born into.

if you have girls who are quite girly

But what does this actually mean? A girl who likes what exactly? And how can they be girly if some boys like it too? And what about girls that don't like these things, are they less female?

I hear what you are saying but IME what you describe is much rarer and less of a problem than parents who tell their little girls off for 'being rough and tumble' or get angry when Johnny age 3 wants to try on the princess dress.

Yanbu op! I let my son play with whatever toys he likes. He has all sorts. Trucks, tools, jigsaws and a doll which he mainly likes to poke in the eye. I don't care as long as he's happy.

I do think this is more of an mn thing though. In haven't met anyone in rl yet who talks about gender stereotyping in this way. My son isn't at school yet though, there's still time!

Yes of course he can do whatever he likes when he's old enough to have or express an opinion, but surely until then, a boy is still a boy.

the whole subject of stereo gender typing can fuck off along with the idiots who get wound up about it, their little snowflakes should be able to be kids and enjoy their childhoods without this shite.

Apart from there being no need to write like a prat, you are missing the point around the issues of gender stereotyping.
Gender stereotyping is definitely a concern in today's society, in that it prevents boys from happily joining ballet, or girls playing football. Yes, it exists. Yes, it can be damaging for children.

The people who get flustered if anyone dares to refer an unborn baby's gender rather than sex also get on my nerves. Sorry, but if the scan shows it's a boy, then it's a boy (prepares to be flamed)

There are people who announce that their baby is...say...a girl...and then get annoyed that other people say the baby is a girl?

I have never ever heard of that!

At Christmas MIL told DH to take off a gliterry Santa hat because 'it's for girls' that's right DH, not DS.

My DS is only a baby but when he gets bigger I'll provide him with a full range of toys. I have a DBro and we shared, so sometimes I'd play with the construction trucks and sometimes he'd play dolls.

I have to admit I really don't like all the negative messages on boys clothes 'messy' 'cheeky' etc. He has a few 'girl' clothes because I liked the pattern in the shop and they weren't too obviously for girls...eg stripy leggings.

Annoys me too. Just let them play with whatever they like!

Reminds me of one mum I know who was determined not to 'gender stereotype' her daughter, to the extent of not approving of Disney princesses etc. My son, aged three, had ask for Cinderella Lego for Christmas, so we got him the one he chose (he could have had any of a few sets and he like that one) When he told his non-gender-stereotyped friend (of this mum) she said 'you can't have that, it's for girls!!' Mum was mortified

Helmet I meant people who get worked about the terminology of the scan. Yes we all know the correct term is sex not gender but it's hardly crime of the century to refer to a scan using the wrong word

To be clear, I don't like either extreme, and agree with letting them play/do/wear whatever they like.

I was also 'advised' that my boys might 'catch the gay' as I put them in woolly tights when they were tiny (navy blues ones - just to be safe!) - I could NOT get baby socks to stay on their feet, where I grew up tights for babies/toddlers of both sexes was the norm, so I did not even think about it much. Mother care did lovely sets of three, navy blue, red and white.
Well, the reactions I got!

Gender stereotyping is alive and well and really quite scary.
I don't think it does any good to pretend it is not an issue.

I almost suffered apoplexy when even Lego started having gendered kits.
And KinderEggs.... FFS.

I've heard "You can't play with kitchen, that's for girls" far more than "You can't play with that football, son, it's too rough and tumble." but I suppose it very much depends on the area you live in.

^Gender stereotyping is alive and well and really quite scary.
I don't think it does any good to pretend it is not an issue.^
Yy I agree with this. It's everywhere from adverts to other parents and I think it's damaging.
DS has always played with whatever he wanted and I dressed him in bright colours when he was a baby which meant some people assumed he was a girl.
But even at nursery, there were DCs saying 'this is a boy colour' and 'that's a girl colour'. Fast forward a few years and DS got into an argument with a friend about whether boys could watch Barbie cartoons or not. Friend's dad had told him that it definitely wasn't for boys. It was only for girls.

I too was very upset about the kinder eggs, they used to be my favourite treat as a child.

i think that a fair number of men think their sons will catch gay if they play with girls toys.

And a fair number of women who think their daughters will turn into vacuous airheads if they play with girls toys.

So, unsurprisingly, it's the stuff that's aimed at girls, mirroring traditionally feminine pursuits, that's derided. In 2016.

I agree with what you're saying OP - but this fun quiz for kids has just appeared in the fricking "Science" museum in London so I'd say that gender stereotyping is alive and well.

A couple of parents being OTT might be annoying, but when you see how insidious the other side is... well, it doesn't really compare.

How do you define 'worry'? Gender stereotyping is a real thing, and i say that as someone who still remembers not being allowed a Scalextric as a kid because it's a "Boys Toy". Even when I had my eldest 9 years ago, I was berated by family members because she played with trains, not dolls, and wore clothes from the "Boys" section of shops (she still does the latter, as their Tshirts are more interesting, though she has finally moved on from Thomas the Tank now ).

I bought my ds a baby doll and he had my old toy buggy to push around when he expressed an interest in doing so.I also didn't bat an eyelid when he wanted to dress up in Disney princess stuff occasionally. However, his major love is trucks and dinosaurs and superheroes and now he's at school the boy/girl divide has really taken over.

My dd loves super heroes and trucks and dinosaurs too...but her favourite play is with her baby doll. She dresses very boyishly at times but loves dresses too and of course pink.

I've never actively discouraged any interests, stereotypical or non.

I think they need the chance to explore it all, to play FFS, before what the world outside thinks encroaches too much on them. Any deliberate influencing of that, whether it is buying a truck for your daughter who wants a doll, or telling a boy who wants a doll he can't have one, is unnecessary and a bit sad.

A lot (not all) Dad's don't like to see their sons playing with dolls etc. Also a lot of mums (again not all) of daughters encourage pink and glitter etc. However, I see a growing number of parents going to the extreme in avoiding stereo typing. For example two of the mums I know well from the nursery run insist that their little boys where something obviously feminine. I overheard one of them, whose son was wearing a pink dress over his jeans, say when asked if he had chose it, no it is his sisters old one and I thought he would look cute in it.

Sorry but we do need to keep challenging it. Some of the messages in the pink and Princess stuff does risk damaging girls. I've had to ban the Disney princess magazine because I'm sick of stories about Belle or Cinderella planning a lovely surprise for their prince / cooking a cake or dinner etc. Or else they are being sweet and kind princesses by putting up with horribly abusive behaviour from evil stepmothers etc.

Maybe this is 'PC gone mad' but I don't want my daughter to grow up thinking that this is what being 'a good girl' means. Whilst boys get taught to be reckless and aggressive in the name of brave adventure.

The mild end of gender stereotypes seems harmless but at the outer edges I think it really does harmfully perpetuate negative gender ideas.

I type this with a copy of 'sparkle girl' magazine in my bag for DD so I don't deny her the pink glitter obsession that she shares with her friends but I do temper it a bit where I can.

Thinking about stereo typing...

The idea is not to stop girls and boys playing with stereotypical girl and boy toys, it is to make sure that a girl does not stop playing with 'boy' toys and boys don't stop playing with 'girl' toys because of gender stereotyping.

My DD was quite happy playing with any toy until she went to nursery and was then told by the other children (4 year olds!) that she could not play with 'boy' toys. She is now an old hand at saying 'there are no such things as girl toys and boy toys, only toys'. If necessary, she also says 'How can it be a 'boy' toy if I am playing with it?' I feel sad that she has to defend her choice of toy at only 6 years old. However it does mean that she still has a mix of girl and boy friends as she gets to play with 'boy' things at school.

What starts with the sorts of toys boys and girls are encouraged to play with, goes on to the sort of subjects they should study at school, the sort of jobs they should have, the split in housework when they are in a relationship. I don't want to narrow my daughter's sights down due to passive stereotyping.

And the boys / girls clothes thing pisses me right off. In some shops it's a real struggle to get comfortable girls clothes. My 3 year old struggled with skinny jeans as they were too tight and skirts were cold. To get a pair of comfy trousers I often ended up in the 'boys' section. A 3 year old just wants comfy (& ideally indestructible).

I agree.

It's just as counterproductive as forcing the stereotypes IMO. I don't get the angst with baby clothes either, how many adults do you see wandering around in clothes of the opposite sex ?

The blue/pink is too much but obviously someone's buying them! I try to buy as many different colours/styles as I can but it's still obviously a boy's wardrobe.