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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to want to push this intern out of the window

149 replies

Rosamund1 · 08/08/2016 12:47

I've got nice shoes older than he is but that's not why I am annoyed.

He is the son of one of the owners friends and he will finish uni next year. This is a small firm so excellent opportunity to get some experience.

I am looking after him and to get him started I asked him to write a couple of pages of the impact a change of legislation may have on our clients. I gave him a full day to produce something. I told him that I acknowledge that at uni you may have days or weeks to write and research, but on the ground clients want answers quickly so it was an excercise in speed as well as content. At the end of the day he said he's not ready. And the next day. FFS.

Then I asked him for a list of for example dentists in a five mile radius because we are going to write to them. A whole day later he produces a handwritten list. My local dentist is not on the list. I told him that the job is not glamorous, there is a lot of admin.

Next, we are having a meeting with a big client. I said he could sit in on the presentation. As preparation please read the file and prepare a one page summary of the background, clients needs & where we are to date. He didn't do it. He just attended the meeting, no prep. Obviously he would not be presenting but come on.

He is scruffy and he mumbles instead of talking. He gives the impression he does not want to be here - forced by parents perhaps. I have looked after other interns before but none like this.

Sometimes I walk past his screen and he has some random internet page open. I ask if he has anything to do and he says no. I told him at the beginning that we can't babysit him, if he is at a loose end he can ask anyone in the team for something.

I'm not going to point out his general lack of interest and uselessness to the boss, who is his mum's friend. I am not going to stick my neck out and say 'You need to stand up straight, tuck your shirt in and look lively.' I will just memorise his name and try and avoid him in a professional context. Or just push him out the window.

OP posts:
OurBlanche · 09/08/2016 14:54

I know, Queen that is why I posted the link, twice!

QueenJuggler · 09/08/2016 14:58

Sorry, Blanche, crossed wires!

I get really mad about companies trying to get away with unpaid/slave labour under the guise of internships. A previous company I worked for used to exploit students so, so badly - I actually left there because I thought it showed such an unpleasant side to the moral character of the people running the business.

OurBlanche · 09/08/2016 15:07

Phew! I got a bit confused, and a bit defensive, then more confused as we did seem to be agreeing... Smile

I have mentored both types of interns, one donkey's years ago in the pre-press industry, not known for its morals. That was an eye opener! But the last one I did was an unpaid one, for a man on a long programme supporting his return to work. He came in irregularly, was often rude, dismissive and, after 2 years on the internship (mainly due to managed relapses in his illness) he was able to work 5 days a week, 9 - 5. The hardest thing for him was the daily routine and every day rules. No one would have paid him or put up with him, it took 4 of us to mentor him effectively!

So I tend to see the other side, the importance of unpaid internships Smile

QueenJuggler · 09/08/2016 15:13

That sounds grim! We don't really get that kind of intern in our industry - just really, really hard-working young adults who are desperate to get their foot on the ladder and will put up with any amount of exploitation to get an internship onto their CV.

We also have strict rules about what interns can and can't do, and what standards of behaviour are expected towards interns. That follows a reasonable well-publicised scandal about a company where female interns were being ranked on a shaggability scorecard, with extra points given to those who put out. Grim.

OurBlanche · 09/08/2016 15:25

It was! But it that was the job, community projects. I still do some work with them, but not that side any more.

And my pre-press days would probably have had something like a Standardised Shaggability Score too Sad

Jayfee · 09/08/2016 17:48

Surely you need to mentor him. Sit him down and talk with him about how he sees things, his reality and yours??

blitheringbuzzards1234 · 09/08/2016 18:46

What a shame. It's always the privileged 'relatives' who don't show any enthusiasm/pull their weight. Why should he get away with it when others would relish this type of work? His attitude and lack of application should be mentioned, especially as his mother is a friend .... or he'll go on getting away with it. It should be explained that he is a waste of space, could you terminate this arrangement?

ForalltheSaints · 09/08/2016 18:47

The window will be with you long after he will. So have some consideration for the window!

joanofgraceland · 09/08/2016 19:11

Tricky situation, but I think some honesty from you is really necessary here. You need to make the Director aware that this person is not pulling his weight. This is because in the future, by saying nothing, it may come back and bite you on the bum. I also think you need to say to the intern that the company expects people to come tidy and ready for work. Instead of saying to the Director that he is useless and lazy why not say he does not seem really interested in the job and you wonder if he has come there under pressure? This is a way of letting the director know that he cannot, or will not do the job, but more diplomatically. By saying nothing you run the risk of, in the future, the Director giving him a job (even perhaps part-time) and if he screws up on that one, they will come back to you to ask why you did not say something. As a matter of interest, my son has just left uni and has not been able to find a job. Every week at his job centre adviser appointment I suggested he wears proper black trousers (and not jeans), a shirt and put the tie in his pocket. That way he is ready if they send him immediately for an interview, which I have heard of before. He has just got a placement at a local company and he went to that interview in a shirt and tie!

pollymere · 09/08/2016 19:24

You need to give him work suitable to his level. If he's obviously not up to what you're giving him, then get his doing useful things, like getting coffee, shredding documents and photocopying. When he's proved he can do this, only then offer more challenging work. Certainly nothing in front of a computer.

Werkz · 09/08/2016 19:37

This is not just a problem with interns. We have it with assistants and juniors on paid contracts.

A few of them have been fantastic, but the majority are shocking. We've had young graduates turn up to work in hiking boots and long khaki shorts and a T-shirt or gym outfits.

We also now have a problem with young employees at their desk with their mobile earphones permanently in their ears. In one case, the music was so loud, I could hear it from across the room. And we are a very easy-going office.

We employed one young woman for three months to do a piece of work. She did bugger all and was horrifically rude to everyone.

I've also noticed that quite a lot of these young people do not know how to work with older people. Half the time they look terrified and never utter a word. I wonder whether it is because they have very little exposure to older people that aren't their parents or teachers.

The girl from who emailed me saying "I don't appear to have been invited to interview. Hello? Surely some mistake? Which bit of Double First from Cambridge did you not understand?"

I had one of these years ago. We ran an internship scheme, only the funding for the department was being pulled after the dotcom crash and we were all being made redundant. I contacted all the interns to say the scheme would not be running that year, and one young woman phoned me back and screamed down the phone at "how I had ruined her life" and how this was "unacceptable".

FFS, we were all about to lose our jobs.

bunnyfuller · 09/08/2016 19:38

I've childminder both interns and apprentices and the lot of them are depressingly monkey toss. Either non-communicative or talking shite and doing feck all. My apprentices couldn't even make a fucking 9am start. Why are all the nasty foreigners taking all the jobs boohoo.

TheEmmaDilemma · 09/08/2016 19:50

You know what this thread shows? Money can buy you shit. Work ethics can get you a lot further.

dementedma · 09/08/2016 21:21

We are involved in offering work placements to armed forces personnel and Veterans, to help with their transition to civvy street. The latest to grab this opportunity and give it his all is a lad who had both legs blown off in Afghanistan. Endless operations and rehab but he's now ready to take up his placement. I asked about adaptations which might need to be made so I could find a suitable placement. " Nothing" was the reply. "I can do stairs if there is a handrail, and if there isn't. I can get up and down on my arse."
Entitled graduates take note!

BestZebbie · 09/08/2016 21:56

Having been an intern and also mentored interns, I must say that I don't think it is very productive to take young people who are already being trusted to work at a certain level (be that to self-manage research for university, do vocational training or have previous paid jobs) and insist that they can only be trusted to make tea and photocopy. All that will happen is that they will feel patronised and resentful, and gradually stop taking you seriously, and you will miss out on using whatever skills they actually have.
For example, a recent graduate is full of up to date book-learning in their field, even though they don't have any experience in a workplace. If they are paired on a real project with somebody who can explain how the project is carried out and how the workday usually runs, whilst being open to hearing their ideas (usually nice and fresh from not having been inside the field for a long time) and input based on their recent education, everybody might learn something.

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest · 09/08/2016 22:06

It might not be productive, but when you've given someone multiple opportunities to prove themselves and given them proper feedback on what they need to do to improve and they are STILL SHIT then sadly you have to go into damage limitation.

For my current intern there's work he can get wrong without it being utterly catastrophic although I'm still spending literally hours a day ensuring he understands the task, checking his progress etc. Other people have mentioned bad interns emailing clients or destroying filing systems through either arrogance or laziness at which point photocopying sounds like the only safe task!

TheCuriousOwl · 09/08/2016 22:20

Yeah well the OP did that and got nothing back so not sure your argument holds weight there.

MrsSchadenfreude · 09/08/2016 22:46

The girl with the double first from Cambridge got pretty shirt shrift from me. The job she had applied for wasn't an entry level job - as evidenced by the salary and the job spec. So I replied, assuring her that we had noted her double first, but that the successful candidate - funnily enough - also had a double first from Cambridge, a PhD from LSE and had written a couple of books on the relevant subject. Funnily enough, we didn't hear back from her...

VenusRising · 09/08/2016 23:43

Maybe the intern is shadowing you OP and too busy writing reports on your management performance for the director.

As you say no good deed goes unpunished. Small companies are very prone to letting people go if they don't fit the ethos. I'd watch my own back OP, unless you're friends of the director too!

The company doesn't pay him, and I think you expect a lot from him.. He's still an undergraduate, and possibly just finding out he hates offices.

Why don't you just accept that he has read the reports, and has had a think about them, but isn't going to actually do anything like write a report about them when you ask him, because he's just treading water until term starts again.

I don't work for free no matter what I'm doing, and it wasn't any different when I was a student. I value my time, and that comes with a number.

I worked every summer throughout my degrees, and saved to get me through the next year. I cleared all my student debts by the time I finished uni.
Amazing how motivating money is.
I'd laugh in your face with your lists and meeting prep for NO money!

Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

I love young people: they're correct to think the world is mostly run on bullshit by old white male rats in the trap.
We need more young people in offices, and they certainly need paying and they don't need to be in at nine, stuffed into a suit if they're not client facing

KoalaDownUnder · 10/08/2016 01:01

VenusRising I sort of hope your post is a joke.

If not, good luck in life with that attitude. You're going to need it, regardless of your age. Hmm

DeclutterQueen · 10/08/2016 08:11

We had a placement student once (when I was still working in the NHS). She was asked to move some service user resources books from one bookshelf to another. She put them on the shelf with the spines facing inwards! She genuinely didn't seem to understand that this wasn't acceptable...

Diverkitty10 · 10/08/2016 13:51

I would sit down with him and do a mid-term 'appraisal' review with him. I would schedule in a meeting, give him a week (v. generous I know) to prepare for it and let him know that the outcome is being fed to boss of firm (the one that gave him internship). Give him a form to fill in with the headings (so he knows what's coming up and how to prepare) of what you'll be discussing eg timekeeping, appropriateness of dress, project/presentation work/report work etc and also ask for feedback from him about how you come across - it could be just a comms thing eg he 'sees' things in language term when you 'hear' things. (Neuro linguistics - made such a difference to my office life!). Prepare a report at end which you both sign-off and with objectives what 2nd half of internship will cover and then feed that back to boss upstairs. That way it looks constructive (and it might help intern pull socks up if he knows formal process) to your boss and that it doesn't come across as a whinge or you not mentoring properly to boss. If emotion taken out of situation then nothing for boss to get antsy with you and up to boss to report back to intern's parents......could well be boss already knows intern is a plonker but there's a bigger 'scratch my back' favour involved than he wants to let on about......

QueenJuggler · 11/08/2016 19:07

Some interesting reading about what good interns expect and receive:

www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/how-ambitious-millennial-interns-are-taking-over-londons-banks-and-law-firms-a3317476.html

VenusRising · 15/08/2016 16:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

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