To move from the big smog to the Highlands?

[Rattusn]

I have lived in London all my life, and it has been a bit of a love/hate relationship. I do love all the local facilities, and rarely for London, we do have some community. We do however live in a very deprived area, and I can already see my primary school age child becoming very streetwise, and being exposed to things I would rather she wasn't. The local secondary options are appalling ( very rough - think heavy gang involvement and frequent physical fights). If we stayed I would be dreading what will happen at age 11.

Our area is very high crime, and has a lot of social problems. Very ethnically diverse without much integration, with the resultant issues.

We have holidayed in the Highlands and it has been divine: Stunning scenery, with lovely friendly people, and altogether much more child friendly. Afaik all Scottish children go to their local school, so no more trekking across London because I couldn't get a place at a nearer school. House prices here are also incredibly good value for money after being used to London prices.

Altogether it seems like a an easy decision, but I'm not sure that it is pie in the sky. Aibu to uproot my dc across the country?

Waverly thank you for your message. I'm not sure how I feel about living in the outskirts of Glasgow, as I feel like it might be too much of a big city for us when we are looking for a change. Admittedly this is just an initial reaction, and I haven't been there.

What is sectarianism in Scotland?

sectarianism is (theoretically) to do with religion - it's between the Catholics and Protestants. Mainly comes out over football where you have a team in Irish colours versus one in the colours of the union Jack fighting in Scotland It is not unique to Glasgow but I'd say it's more prevalent there than anywhere else, probably due originally to the Irish influence. There is still a bit of people checking what school you went to to work out if you are Catholic or protestant. There are things like Orange walks which inflame things as well as the general football rivalry. I don't and never have lived in Glasgow but my gut is that it isn't such a big thing anymore. You used to get a small bit of it when I grew up in Edinburgh but that was eons ago and was never a big thing.

I can't be doing with religion at all so maybe my view is skewed a touch. :)

I'd still push for the north central Belt rather than the outskirts of Glasgow. You basically have the same advantages in terms of accessability but with more of the country feel. It just feels more "highland" though I am sure there are lovely countryside areas on the outskirts of Glasgow, as there are around Edinburgh. Obviously I am biased in terms of stirling but Perth has a similar thing going on I think though it's handier for Edinburgh rather than Glasgow whereas Stirling area is handy for both. Scenery can be more dramatic up the west though but Loch lomond area feels busy to me (obviously not compared to London) even the Trossachs feels a bit quieter. If you need access to a major hospital then you probably have your pick of a few withing easy travel distance.

Meant to say that maybe a starting point would be to find out where your specialism can be done and then narrow it down from there?

wankers has given a good summary of sectarianism. I have only experienced it when living in Ibrox and have been boxed in by an Orange walk. Nothing since.

Also remember that your idea of a big city and Scotland's are poles apart. Glasgow is the largest, but from where I live 15 miles south of the city centre, and on a clear day, I can see Ben Lomond to the north of Glasgow. I can see the Campsie Fells to the north. And drive a little bit up the hill behind me, and I can see Arran.

It is a city, but you only need to see as much of it as you want, or need to for a job.

This might not mean anything, but I grew up in Edinburgh and the East coast. Praise for Glasgow isn't a natural state

Also, the North, and Inverness, are lovely. We have friends in Dingwall and Elgin and used to visit the Black Isle all the time. It is just a bit too cut off for me (the A9 nightmare). But I have family in the Borders, so 1.5 hrs from Glasgow vs. 5/6hrs from the north....it would be too much for regular trips.

Waverly - I grew up in Oxgangs - poles apart from Morningside but i used to spend a fair bit of time there - coming through Braid burn Valley. Loved the Super Saturday club at the Dominion when we could afford it. We used to get Chinese takeaway from the little restaurant up beside the cycle repair shop as it was the closest one at the time. Them being a bit of a novelty back then :)

wankers thank you for the summary. That is what I understood sectarianism to be, but I only thought it was relevant to Ireland.

We are neither Protestant nor Catholic. (Non-practising other religion) I hope that wouldn't be too strange!

I did notice an absolute glut of churches in Inverness!

Now I want to move to Scotland all over again!

"We are neither Protestant nor Catholic. (Non-practising other religion) I hope that wouldn't be too strange!"

No, if you're not involved in it - it is fairly easy to ignore other than having to be aware that there may be trouble around certain football matches...or that towns are shut down for orange walks.

I don't think being non religious would be weird, I think that goes for the majority of the population nowadays - we are an atheist family and manage perfectly fine :) We have an Irish surname that people assume is Scottish and I have no idea what side of the fence it sits on. DHs mum came from Glasgow, from Catholic stock (also has an Irish surname), married his Dad who's family also originally came from Glasgow but now lived in the borders and when she moved there, there wasn't a catholic church so DH and his siblings were all christened in the church of scotland (protestant church) as that's what they had in the village :)

Moving from London to Inverness would maybe be a bit too much. Personally I would choose the central belt as others have suggested. My kids are in a lovely school with 20ish per class where most kids walk to school, but we are 20 minutes away from Glasgow.

We ski so we can be up at glencoe ready to ski at 9am having left our house st 7.30.

I was born and bred in a town not far from inverness. The area is lovely. It has its good and bad sides like every other place.

We dont have 4 hour days in winter. We dont actually have that bad winters really. It might get a bit cold but put on a coat, hat, scarf and gloves and you will be fine. Scotland doesnt come to a stand still when it snows. We just get on with our day as normal.

Food in supermarkets is not expensive. 90p for 4 pints of milk or 1 pound for a normal size loaf of bread. That isnt expensive.

Ds and i love going into inverness for day trips because there is a lot to do there.

Moving from london to the highlands is a huge change. Is there any way that you can come for a few months trial first?

There will have been a few churches as you have all the different types of Christian that apparently don't mix :o

Church of Scotland, Episcopalian, Catholic, Baptists, Free Church then you get your Jehovahs witnesses etc etc etc :o It's a complicated business.

Too much IMHO.

Also where i live, religion is not really a big part of our lives. The children say a prayer in assembly and that is about it.

I haven't noticed sectarianism in the east.

If you want a rural feel but an easy city commute then west might be best. I'm guessing roughly where Waverley is and it is lovely. Warmer in the winter too!

I am further east and it is definitely less rainy!!

If I had my choice in Scotland and wasn't worried about a long commute to Edinburgh or Glasgow then I would choose Dunblane. Brilliant schools, nice town, easy access to Stirling for older teens.

Or the Black Isle.

Nearer Edinburgh, the Scottish Borders are hugely underrated. Would give you the rural peace but close enough to Edinburgh. But a daily commute to Edinburgh, whilst do-able, would be a pain unless right on the new Borders line. I always like look of Stow!

It's a massive change, I did it in the opposite direction, and the cultural shock (either way) is difficult to cope with. Have you read 'The Outrun' by Amy Liptrot? Don't think your children won't access drink and drugs in the Highlands.

"I haven't noticed sectarianism in the east."

It's alive and well in the eastern central belt...

But I once tried to teach a poem referencing orange walks in stirling and the pupils all looked at me blankly, lol...so even just that little bit more north makes a difference.

Sadly sectarianism is alive and well in the central belt, thank goodness marching season is over and done with again the divisions make me sad and angry all at once. Twats the lot of them, both sides!

Sectarian does exist still - but many people like me manage to avoid coming into contact with it most of the time. I hate Marching Season and Orange Walks though.

There is still apparently a small cohort of bigots who care whether or not someone is Catholic. I was blissfully unaware until I married dh (a very lapsed Catholic) - I was brought up in an atheist household - and he explained about the school thing ("which school did you go to?" to identify which religion you are). I've never come across it myself though except the occasional Orange Walk

Villages to the North of Glasgow could suit you: Drymen, Strathblane, Balfron, Killearn, Fintry. Lovely countryside and close to the hills if you like walking or climbing. They're also close(ish) to Stirling. You'd definitely need your own car though as they don't have trains - although some commuters drive into Milngavie and get the train into Glasgow from there.

Not sure if it's still the case - and it might depend on the speciality - but some hospitals have limits on the distance you can live from them. My dad was a radiologist though and I don't think that he had to live too close (in fact, for a while he commuted between Stirling and Glasgow).

Know lots of medics from all over the world - either via my dad or now various friends and neighbours.

tabulahrasa I am from Stirling and definitely saw Orange Walks there as a child. Hopefully they have died out now though.

OP it's important to be aware of the concept of sectarianism just so you can understand the cultural context in which you live (most reasonable sized towns in the Central belt will have a large state Catholic secondary school for example) but it's unlikely to have a direct effect on your life.

As others have said, it sounds like the key may be to look at the hospitals and work from there. Dunblane and Stirling are an easy train and road commute to the big hospital in Larbert, if that offers your specialty.

Sorry if I misled. There are Catholic schools etc in the east. It is bizarre when you think about it rationally.

But there is zero impact on daily lives. I know folk at the Catholic schools and vice versa. Everyone gets on fine. As it should be! The main relevance is that the Catholic schools seem better just now than the horrendously busy state schools so non religious folk ponder sending their kids there....

I did see an Orange march in central Edinburgh as a kid - I thought they all seemed a bit crazed.

I have no doubt that your area of London is crime ridden OP, but I wanted to speak out for the many areas of London that are pleasant without having to be Maida Vales or Kensingtons.

We live in a deprived borough - in an area not far from Kilburn in fact and not too dissimilar from it . My 2 eldest go to an ofsted rated good secondary school which they walk to in 25 minutes. We have a park close by and can get to the centre of London in about 25 minutes on the tube. Where we live is very diverse and it works - everyone gets on with their daily lives and is tolerant of the other as far as I can see.

It feels a bit like a village in a way, and after many years here we often bump into people we know if we go out locally. Yes at least half of our high street is not very attractive, but I can live with that...

Just wanted to right the balance a bit as I felt that London has got slightly bad press in this thread when in fact it is made up of countless different areas....

A lot depends on whether you want to be part of a community. Where we live is very diverse and it works - everyone gets on with their daily lives and is tolerant of the other as far as I can see. That sounds as though there isn't much actual intermingling in terms of people socialising outside their own ethnic groups, but maybe I'm misinterpreting.

It feels a bit like a village in a way, and after many years here we often bump into people we know if we go out locally. Yes at least half of our high street is not very attractive, but I can live with that...

Not having a go at the area of London described, but the difference between that and a village only 35 miles west of central London is that, within just a few weeks of moving, we'd made friends who we're still close to 17 years later - people would knock on the door with a bunch of flowers, invitation to join the cricket team, or offer of help with finding local services for the first week or two of our moving in. It isn't at all diverse (my husband's the only black man in the village!) but we've never experienced any racism whatsoever here. The village school has been rated Outstanding, as have the local grammars for many years.

Yes, all the local teens have gone through the drinking cider in the bus shelter phase, but they've all emerged unscathed, gone through Uni and are now getting their first jobs so it doesn't seem to have damaged them too badly!

crossroads I think you have perhaps misinterpreted me. My intention is not to 'bash' London, but I was just saying why I would like to move out of my neighbourhood in particular. I don't know where you live as your description is extremely generic, but I'm guessing it's not near me, and very likely is an area we couldn't afford to live in.

In terms of ofsted ratings, parks, transport links and community, I could say all the same things about my area. They aren't the be all and end all though, and there are far deeper issues, which I believe do not make my area an ideal place to raise children.

I'm not saying there aren't nice parts of London, there are, but buying a family size home in them is out of reach for us.

I also agree with mumblechum in that your description does indeed hint at a lack of social cohesion in your area too.