To move from the big smog to the Highlands?

[Rattusn]

I have lived in London all my life, and it has been a bit of a love/hate relationship. I do love all the local facilities, and rarely for London, we do have some community. We do however live in a very deprived area, and I can already see my primary school age child becoming very streetwise, and being exposed to things I would rather she wasn't. The local secondary options are appalling ( very rough - think heavy gang involvement and frequent physical fights). If we stayed I would be dreading what will happen at age 11.

Our area is very high crime, and has a lot of social problems. Very ethnically diverse without much integration, with the resultant issues.

We have holidayed in the Highlands and it has been divine: Stunning scenery, with lovely friendly people, and altogether much more child friendly. Afaik all Scottish children go to their local school, so no more trekking across London because I couldn't get a place at a nearer school. House prices here are also incredibly good value for money after being used to London prices.

Altogether it seems like a an easy decision, but I'm not sure that it is pie in the sky. Aibu to uproot my dc across the country?

Strathaven? Nice town with a good high school . Fairly central too.

OP, are you in a position to spend some time in Scotland researching possibilities this autumn/winter? If so, I recommend joining AirBNB and booking a few homestays. As pp have said, the Highlands is a huge area and very varied, so you need to get a feel for the different areas. I also second the advice you've been given about considering other parts of Scotland. I moved up to Edinburgh from England about 15 years ago and I love it, so I'm biased, but if it's definitely countryside you're after, it really is worth considering the areas around Perth and Stirling as pp have said, and also the Borders and Dumfries/Galloway. Wherever you decide, I don't think it's necessarily pie in the sky, but do get a feel for the area out of holiday season before making the big decision.

Oh, and I understand exactly what you mean by ethnic diversity without integration. I once lived in an area like that - it was very scary. I've also lived in diverse communities which have been pretty well integrated, so I understand the difference, and I don't think anything you've said is at all racist.

I have lived in a less remote area of the countryside than the Highlands and even that is hard work. Going somewhere for a holiday is very, very different to having to live there. The winters are brutal and you have to be organised with nearly military precision (and equipment) to get through it. Plus, small communities function very differently from city ones, and it's not all roses if half of them are completely off their rockers. Plus, what are you going to do for work? Will your city job move? If not, commuting can be a nightmare outside of London too: many cities are now snarled up for hours at the start and end of the day. Add weather into that equation (not something that London faces) and you have a potential nightmare.

I would look at cities/large towns elsewhere that would give you more access into the countryside as/when you wanted it, and all of the convenience of an established and well-connected settlement with jobs.

I'd go for it. I moved back to Scotland (I'm a native) when I had kids and I'm really glad I did. Yes the weather can be rotten, but the benefits of cheaper housing, easy schooling & better access to properly wild countryside is a winner for me.

If you're regularly driving to / from London then I wouldn't go too far north. The A9 really is a bitch of a road.

We live near Glasgow....train to city centre in 20 mins, wild countryside in cycling distance, easy to get to east & west coasts. Schools are excellent in our area & the kids walk there every day. They have so much freedom. We have lots of English neighbours and as far as I know they don't experience much anti-English sentiment. I'm going out for a drink with 2 of them tomorrow night so will ask them

Be wary of the central belt....lots of the towns look great that they're close to Glasgow or Edinburgh, but some of them are less than picturesque.

Have a look at small towns with good transport links to bigger cities & nice city suburbs: Stirling, Dunblane, Linlithgow, Dunkeld, Dalkeith, Bearsden...to name a few.

I'd do it in a heartbeat! Luckily I live in a very rural area anyway but I wouldn't want my DC growing up in that sort of area. Nothing inherently wrong with it, but not my personal choice. I don't think you would regret it.

OP

I am in the same line of work as yourself (perhaps different specialty though) and am Scottish and have lived in a number of areas of Scotland. I would say Inverness is certainly a nice place and there are plenty of smaller town/villages within easy commuting distance. Yes, it will be colder etc, but it's not the North Pole and I'm not sure where 4 hours of daylight comes from (although days are shorter). As I said in a previous post, it may not have the variety of facilities/activities as London, but it has plenty to offer.

I would also say places like Perth and Crieff are great with plenty to do and beautiful countryside. Don't know the Scottish borders well, but again, it is a lovely area and not far from Edinburgh.

Workwise, if you are looking at NHS jobs in Perthshire/surrounding area there is the smaller district general in perth and the bigger teaching hospital at Ninewells in Dundee (not far from Perth- many trainees work in both locations during training), or Forth Valley Hospital in Larbert, depending on where you were living. Perthshire (and Angus actually) are set amidst beautiful countryside and there is lots of things to do. We are less than an hour from skiing, practically on the doorstep of the Cairngorm national park but just over an hour from Edinburgh/Glasgow so visiting family could fly up, ok connections from Edinburgh by train and also overnight sleeper stops in various places, including Perth. House prices can be a bit higher than Inverness, but still far, far lower than London/South East.

Feel free to PM me if you want.

"The winters are brutal and you have to be organised with near military...."

Up here in the Highlands we have central heating, broadband, cars on gritted roads, trains, buses, a steady supply of wood for the wood burner (option extra as we have electricity and central heating)

Not sure where pp is thinking of (Arctic Circle? Deepest Canada) but that is not a description of the Highlands I recognise and I am more remote than Inverness.

Yes, we have huge storms (I am on the coast so it is wind and rain, not snow) but they are an excuse to stay indoors.

Traffic? Just drove back from a couple of days away in Perth (pp said beautiful city, and they were right) and the roads were busy - it is high summer so lots of tourists and camper vans, but not jammed at all.

I think people are commenting about places they know little about.

Roseformeplease

You're forgetting that to us, winter is a normal occurrence. However I have noticed that South of the border they tend to panic at the first word of "could be a hint of snow".....

Weather is worse in winter up North and in the Highlands, and to people who live there, it isn't a problem. But it is still usually a shock to the system for outsiders. Unless they're moving from Scandinavia/Alaska/Russia....

I lived in the pennines, rose, so I'm just judging from that. I didn't mean to suggest that the Highlands were anything other than modern - they are spectacularly beautiful and, of course, really well equipped. It's just that where I was - much further south - there's only so much that modernity can do. Getting anywhere in a hard winter was really tough without a 4x4, shops could run out of food in bad snowfall so you needed to be stocked up, and you came last on the list of services - so central heating failure once took weeks to repair (in -8 nights!). Many roads were not gritted at all, or gritted only poorly - though I imagine this might be rather better in Scotland! Getting to the cinema, theatre, concerts was a bit of a trek - lots more driving involved!

Being a nesh southerner who had moved up from London, all of the above was something of a shock! The scenery was lovely, though.

oops, x-post with madginger. I am saying exactly that! Winter has teeth up in them there hills.

If you're not set on the Highlands, take a look at the outskirts of Glasgow. I am assuming from what you have said that you and your DH are medics of some description. My kids school is AWASH with the children of doctors, nurses, pharmacists and medical research bods as we are close to several huge hospitals, Glasgow Uni and several medical research places. Many of these parents are from elsewhere in the UK, or further afield. My daughter's best friend's parents are from the Middle East, both are doctors.

From here, I can be on the banks of Loch Lomond in 25 minutes, or in Glasgow city centre in the same time. Stirling is less than an hour, or the Trossachs about 40 minutes. A fast train to London from Glasgow takes about 4.5 hours into Euston. The local secondary schools (Douglas Academy, Bearsden Academy) are regularly in the top 10 schools in Scotland.

The only downside is that property in this part of the Glasgow suburbs is pricey compared with other places (but still cheap by London standards), you'd be looking at around £350k for a 3 or 4 bed in a nice area.

Not sure how old OP's child is except not 11 yet.

1. Moving out of London to wherever in the country is a wonderful idea - but given the usual pattern you'll never be able to move back.
2. Your child will love the freedom and wide open skies until they're 12 (not all of them, clearly) after which they will probably want to access friends, films, theatres, sporting events, whatever. You need to make sure there's public transport or you'll be a taxi driver until they're 17 or longer if they can't afford driving lessons/car.. Will they be able to get part time jobs they can get to easily when they're trying to earn money? If they're at a secondary school in the area, will all their friends be so far flung/no transport links they can't hang out with them?
3. One of the upsides in Scotland currently is free university, but that might not obtain by the time your children get to that age.
4. Writing this as someone who moved from London to small town S England. Drug problems prevalent in naice part of the world and lots of DUIs. Major mistake was not checking transport links.
5. Solution: rent out London home making sure you have reputable agents and tenants.. Rent in Scotland. Decide where you and your family want to be in ten years time.

Oh and also to add, remember the Scottish school system has a different cut of date for school entry so your DD may well have a year longer in primary education up here. Again not sure what age she currently is but cut off date here is end February rather than 1st September - plus a fair number of parents defer children who are 4 in Jan and Feb until the following year so there is a bigger age range in most classes. Most children will be between 11 and a half and 12 and a half when starting High School here.

Op how about perth or oban?? Oban is by the sea but near glencoe and lynn of lorne, mull on a ferry, shops of all kinds, schools, tesco and aldi, Perth inland but stunning scenery, culture etc as well as being quite "naice! "

Or op how about cumbria ? Great rail links, loads of new houses going up, Carlisle is a large town, right near m6 etc plus stunning scenery

I love in a very remote place in the West Highlands having moved in with my partner a few months ago. I used to live in Manchester. I would say move to a town, where there is a community, schools, pubs etc. or your child will be very isolated growing up. You can still benefit from the great house prices, beautiful scenery etc, but will have some potential friends. It;'s easy to get a train to Glasgow, or fly to London, regularly to see old mates, family etc. Definitely worth doing, and forget all the stuff about the Winters- unless you work outdoors, it's just weather and if you have the right clothes you'll be fine. Nowhere is a Shangri-La, with no problems, but as a place to grow up, there is a lot of freedom and beauty here.

Op: Cumbria example www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-54220555.html

Oban example
www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-21805332.html

If you don't mind sharing your budget, that might help op?

I'm keen to move out of England for a variety of reasons.

Our budget is about 300,000 and we would want at least 4 bedrooms, ideally 5+. In Inverness it is doable.

Thank you to the medics who have given advice. A key limiting factor would be whether I can complete speciality training near Inverness. The drive to Aberdeen is 2.5 hours and there is no way I could do that every day.

wankers how does that work with regards to school cut off? Dd is autumn born, so would she stay in the same school year?

yaas no I haven't but that's because I haven't been there. Inverness is absolutely stunning, but we could be swayed by other places.

You'll get something with a huge garden no probs. Try Farr or Beauly.

For example if her date of birth was 1st of October 2010, then in Scotland she'd have started school in August 2015 in Primary 1, we have no reception year. She'd be going into primary 2 this August. She'd be starting High school after 7 years in primary so that would be in August 2022. Hopefully you can work out from that example but happy to work it out for you if you give a birth year.

Its really only Edinburgh and the odd wealthy spots that you wouldn't get a 4 bed home for 300k so you more or less could move anywhere in Scotland. Good luck

The A9 is a shocker. Not only because not all of it is dualled and they are upgrading, but because HGVs are limited to 50. So, guess what, you play chicken with all the other cars desperate to overtake the four HGVs in a row before the dual runs out AND also brake enough not to be caught by the average speed limit.

I like Inverness. East winds are cold, not much between you and Siberia. But the same is true of Norwich. Quite a small town feel for late teens, but by no means so much as on the lovely west coast eg Ullapool. ( NB, followed a Tesco delivery van into badachro last week.) I don't feel it's as sectarian as Glasgow but then I'm not a Weegie and I may be wrong. But it is still a society where the networks are strong and you will always need to be careful in what you say as my aunt Ina will have been at school with your DC's BF's Auntie Maeve or Effie. I don't mind that but it non pluses some people. And Inverness feels like Southampton once you've been to Durness ...and not so insular in some ways as East Angular.

, I'd say two things, from being brought up in the true country, where rural children always get bored. 1It always has been about underage sex, and drinking. The availability of drugs has increased so the desire to do underage tractor driving has decreased as far as I can see. 2 so it's really worth them being able to get out to see friends without you chauffeuring around the whole time. And find a job.

And if they don't do well at one school it's much harder to move them.

To add to what WankersHacksandThieves said, an Autumn born child will be mid/to young in the year (technically mid year as the cutoff is 1 March because of deferrals, the average is shifted).

Like England, we have 13 years of formal schooling - only here, it's 7 in primary (and no Reception) and 6 in secondary. The other difference is that technically, they can go to Uni after sitting their Highers in S5; S6 is more optional, unlike in England where Y13/Upper 6th form is integral to A Levels.

Having read all your requirements, I think a move to just outside Glasgow would suit you really well. It's Central Belt, without being somewhere depressing between Edinburgh and Glasgow (I'm sure there are some nice places, but it seems all a bit bland/run down to me).

I'm from Edinburgh, originally, but I'm could not afford to live where I grew up (Morningside) or in any of the good catchments. Also, the public transport is a bit better through in the West (although I've not lived in Edinburgh since the trams were reintroduced, so this could be a little misleading). Still, there are so many trains that living 'rurally' outside Glasgow still means you can affordably work in Glasgow.

I live in a village to the south of Paisley (hi other Renfrewshire MNers!). There is a train station in our village, and in 20 mins I can be in the centre of Glasgow for my job. In 30 mins, I can be on the Ayrshire coast, and in 40mins or so I can be at Loch Lomond. An hour to Edinburgh as well.

There are a tonne of NHS jobs here, lots of hospitals within easy commute (I'm NHS, but not clinical).

Our house was a smidge under £300K. We have a 4 bed (modern but well done) detached house, with rural views. Primary school within 5 mins walk. High school is not the best, but realistically, probably way better than what you are facing. We can do a placing request when the time comes, or consider other options like moving or private.

We also have an au pair. Apparently, au pairs coming to Scotland mostly look for placements in Edinburgh, but it was no problem finding one that wanted to be near Glasgow. I'm not sure about further north, but I think most big cities would be attractive (and I'm using big in the Scottish sense, so including Perth, Aberdeen, Inverness etc).

Upsides: rural, community feel. 10 mins to our nearest 24 hour store. 15 mins to Glasgow Airport and then the world. Cinemas, culture and any activity you care to name easily in reach. When our kids are older, they can be independent without us running them everywhere. People are friendly, and I have several English neighbours (and being from posh Edinburgh, I almost fall into that category) who are settling in fine.

Downsides: the weather. It is definitely wetter here than pretty much anywhere in the UK. But when the sun shines, we really appreciate it. And it is only a couple of hours to the east coast oasis of sun (if you would believe my mother from Peebles). Winters can be dark and dreich, but summers are so light. And it's so close to the north of Scotland, that you can go on wee holidays up north all year and enjoy the scenery etc. Sectarianism. I've not really experienced it, but I know it is there. Still, any place has it's darker elements, and I certainly don't feel I encounter them on a day to day basis in my little village.

PM me if you want any further details. Sounds like an exciting time in your life