To think he should reimburse me?

[RoyalBlue]

ExH works like a dog, when we were together he was gone by 5am and home by 9pm most nights and would still do work.
It was the major reason we divorced.

He's a nice bloke, but trying to pin him down is practically impossible. We have 2 DD together, 10 and 8 and if he's going to show up, I get a phone call or a text a few hours before hand and then he whisks them away for the day, which they love but is honestly annoying. He does this at least once a month.

We've only been divorced for 2 years, so this is only our second summer.

Last summer the girls were in play schemes/camp and with grandparents and he took them out a handful of times, I assumed this summer was going to be the same but without any warning whatsoever, DH has taken 2 weeks off work. This is the same man that went to work half dead with a cold, shivering all over the place.

I was delighted, asked for the dates so he could have more then just a day with his Daughters and surprise surprise he's booked them all a holiday without asking/informing me that clashes with camp and a play scheme

The Camps cost a little over £600 per child and the playsheme is £35 per child per day for 6 days, that's £420, all together that's cost me a little over £1600

I said that it was fine if they went but that he would have to reimburse me the money for the camps and playsheme that they would miss as it's too late to get a refund, he argued that I should take it out of the Child Maintenance he pays

He pays £500 a month, £250 per child, that's all he financially contributes, it would take months of his CM payments to cover the loss!

AIBU to think he should reimburse me? And if I'm not how do I get him to do it?!

Margaret, he makes a shit load but over the past 2 years I haven't needed more then £500 a month, I work full time and earn enough so the money is just for extras, days out, holidays, hobbies etc so I've never asked, I was sure that if I did ask for more it wouldn't be an issue but this really has me rethinking.

My ex was like this. Was.
He would just rock up and want contact. Thing was though dc had made other plans and I have taught him from an early age to think about invites. Do you want to go etc cos once you say yes, that's it.
So of course ex wasn't happy and resulted in many texts.
My last reply was
Look you can say whatever you want. However don't expect dc to sit day in, day out for you to materialize. That might work on whatever planet you are on, here on planet earth however you make plans and stick to them. So either you act like an adult now and sort this, or walk away. Obviously u have the third option, take me to court. I welcome it because I actually want stability not this rock up when I can be bothered thing that you want. Because be honest with yourself, it ain't working. And please don't insult our intelligence and say you work 7 days, 24/7, 365.

Amazingly. Went from never having any time off when he wasn't at school to suddenly having time off. Which I am not rigid and it is flexible but notice has to be given and if it clashes with something else. Oh well.

What I am trying to say until you get tough he will continue to take the piss. Be the still has time at weekends etc to go out with the mates. Persue his hobbies.
Spend time with the new person...

hotdiggedy ffs the OP is not "lucky" he pays her maintenance. That is the very least he should be doing for his children

OP get contact formalised otherwise this pattern will repeat itself for years. Also sort out maintenance - I suspect on the info you have given he is underpaying you significantly. As an example if he's earning (conservative estimate) £100k then you'd be entitled to double the amount you currently receiving.

I know you say you don't necessarily need the money now but it would make sense to save especially since the more senior you get in these types of roles the less secure they can become.

Random days out with very little warning seems to be the best he can offer and I feel that if I stop those, he'd never see them at all.

No, that is not the "best" he can offer. He has you dancing to his tune. Get contact mandated for set dates (and if he can't make it, then he organises the child care that day). You are making him the priority and he only sees his children as an option when he has nothing better to do. And make sure he is paying you the CM that he is actually required to pay.

An executive at a computer tech company is quite capable of understanding that he has dinner with his children once per week and takes them every other weekend and arranging his schedule accordingly.

Stop enabling his behaviour. Your children certainly won't thank you in the future.

Sorry, internet glitch. I've reported the double post.

Why is he paying so little maintenance when he has such a well paid job ?

I don't understand what you mean about " needing " it . It's not about YOU, it's about his kids. What if your circumstances change and you do " need " it ? You won't be able to just demand it then .

Besides, he really needs to start contributing to his children's lives . Clearly he doesnt care enough about them to make time for them , the least he can do is contribute financially to their upbringing .

Get a proper agreement in place about contact and money . If you don't need the money on a day to day basis , put it in in a savings account for their university education. Tell NO ONE that this exists , especially your children or your ex .

I think I'd stick to the original plans and send the children to their camp and play scheme. Although he's worded it cleverly to try and take control, the nature of the current contact arrangement that you have means that what he is actually doing is asking you if he can take the children. He should have done this before he booked, not after.

I don't agree with others who have said to let him take them for the children's sake. Although it would be nice for them to go, I think it's a short term pain/long term gain scenario. If you let him do this now then you set a precedent. Do you seriously think he will be considerate next time? The way he has told you to just take the cost of the activities out of your CM (which is already allocated to your children's everyday needs) says that he doesn't care at all about how his actions have affected you or the kids. Presumably they were looking forward to the camp too? But he had his holiday booked and decided to just do what was convenient for himself. He wasn't thinking about them at all.

OP, you need to say to him sorry, the children already have plans and in future he will have to give you more notice. Then next holiday period explain the playscheme booking deadline to him and say he has to pin his dates down properly well in advance like all the other parents do.

Op is not "lucky" that she gets this much maintenance, it's the very least he can do if he can afford it. Parents who pay the legal minimum for their children are a disgrace in my opinion.

I too think that you shouldn't just be going along with whatever he wants to do or you will be doing it forever. For the children's sake as well as your own he needs to stick to some agreed contact. This is less about the money spent on the clubs and more about setting the tone for your future contact. If there are financial consequences from his lack of planning or consideration they need to be his so that he gets that he cannot just do this.

You have my sympathy dealing with a thoughtless entitled ex is hard.

I would send them to the camp and playscheme.

If you bow to his wishes he will do this again.

Then I would contact CMS - get the correct amount of CMS established (putting surplus into kids savings if you want). I would put in writing that you are offering EOW plus dinner mid week. Strangely some men up contact when CMS are involved you may find their involvement increases overnights - and as he has already played the 'take it out the maintenance card' he may be one of them.

Oh and of course he can make time to see them regularly at a set time - he chooses not to.

Whether you need the extra child support or not is not the point. It's for your children and it's the legal minimum. If you don't need it, you should be saving it for them for when they do in future - sort of compensating them for having such a useless father they rarely see who doesn't prioritise them.

The fact that he's not even paying what the CMS says he should be paying, and still won't reimburse you after HIS cock-up

I think you have two choices to offer him: he either reimburses you, or you go through the CMS for maintenance and you'll recoup the extra money that way and that will cost him a lot more.

Although you should be doing that anyway.

did you consult with him before booking the camp and play scheme?

Have you asked for a refund? Can you pass the places on to someone else.

To be honest, you paid for childcare for those two weeks, and you are getting child care for those two weeks, you haven't lost anything

I know you didn't ask about the maintenance money but it is somewhat interrelated.
You might think he respects you for being able to provide for the children yourself with minimum input from him ( in both financials & effort )
But he probably looks down on you as too weak to ask for what you're entitled to
I agree with PPs suggestions to get the correct maintenance & put it away in a secret account
He may well switch to doing his job on a self-employed / consultant basis, at which point your maintenance may vanish
If not, nest-eggs for the DCs, win-win

I actually think that you are doing your children a disservice by allowing this to continue.

You're basically telling them that they are only worth contact when he deems it necessary.

I would not allow him to dictate when he sees them or that they go with him on holiday when other arrangements have been booked and paid for.

Sorry to sound harsh but if you're going to put up with this treatment why did you get divorced? Doesn't seem that you are any better off

Stick to your original plans. If he ends up out of pocket, he might think again before rocking up to be "Disney Dad".

Your children need stability. My ex's holiday was "rostered" so we couldn't book until we knew the roster yet once we separated he was magically able to book holidays whenever he felt like it. It's a form of control.

Don't give him the power to swoop in and disrupt plans.

No, do not consider accepting the loss as a deduction from maintenance!! It would be a shocking waste of your money. The only person who should be out of pocket is your XH who made all the clashing arrangements without checking with you first. It's up to him to take the hit and reimburse you if he wants to continue with the holiday. If he doesn't, it's up to him to reschedule the holiday for an alternative date. If he gets difficult, remind him that he does not get to call all the shots. You could (if this is an overseas holiday) withdraw your consent to him taking the children out of the country and make it very awkward for him, even if it is almost guaranteed that he would be granted legal approval in the end.
As a separate issue, he is dicking you about on contact. It's very controlling behaviour and you need to draw the line by insisting on a mutually agreed, regular access schedule for the sake of your children. Access is about what's best for the children, not what's convenient on any given day for the parent.

I'm not sure the OP can stick to original plans. What about when her ex turns up packed and ready for holiday? There is going to be a horrible scene in front of the kids. He doesn't sound the type who will just accept being told "they're not coming"

OP I think you might end up having to swallow this one (you can't force him to give you money) but I would take this as a trigger to take him to court and formalise access and maintenance

If he's an executive in his company, of course he can manage more than random days if he has to. You can bet that if someone at works asks him to arrange a regular meeting, or he needs to visit a client on site, or go to a conference, he can manage to plan that. Therefore he could perfectly easily arrange to take a regular day off once a week or once a fortnight to see his children. He just has to block it out of his diary and learn that he is not indispensable. Tell him that that is what is going to happen from now on, and that if he wants them in the holiday then again he must arrange it well in advance and check with you what your plans are.

You are also very lucky to get that much money in maintenance assuming it is paid without fail! oh yeah don't forget to bow down to him for doing the bare minimum he should be doing for his children. Ffs I hate thats this attitude exists.

Op it's really shitty of him and I bet he could have more regular contact than he's letting on. It comes down to the fact that he prioritises work over his kids. Yes he should reimburse you as it's money down the drain. But, I would ask the kids first what they want to do and let them decide.

I'm actually suprised at all the people who've said not to let them go. Their's one pp that said that that would be evil, I honestly assumed the majority would say the same.

I want them to go on the camp/playscheme, I don't want to run around trying to sort out his fucking mess when it's his fault, but I thought it was worth it as DDs get to see their Dad.

I don't want to enable his behaviour, I want him to stop randomly showing up and I want him to actually be a part of their lives, know the name of their friends, what they like, where their school is, but I do believe that if I stop the random days, he'll stop all contact, which is why I've allowed it, but the cons out way the pros, I don't want to teach my DDs that they have to drop everything because their Father chose to show up that day

Start how you mean to go on - they're not going on this trip and I plan to apply for CM, I don't need it but if DDs are entitled to it then they should receive it, although from what my friends in similar positions receive, I do think £500 is the minimum that they're entitled to.

I've emailed him both news so it's too late to change my mind.

I'm confused. Did you wait for him to confirm dates before booking the camps and clubs , or just go ahead anyway. Or did you think he'd be happy to take them there during his holiday. Requesting a date transfer is probably your best bet, even if full there may be cancellations.

She'd already book med the clubs LIZS. She needs childcare during the summer so she can work.

"I do believe that if I stop the random days, he'll stop all contact, which is why I've allowed it, but the cons out way the pros, I don't want to teach my DDs that they have to drop everything because their Father chose to show up that day".

Exactly. You don't have to put up with this from him, for all the sensible reasons that have been put forward on his thread. It's not to your DCs' benefit long-term. If he does decide to stop contact in a strop because you've started to insist on him behaving like a reasonable human being, that's his choice, and the consequences will fall on him. Did I see your DDs are 10 and 8? So they are getting old enough to grasp what's going on. They will certainly see that YOU are the parent who is there for them, doing everything for them, every day. They will see you making genuine efforts to come to sensible arrangements with their father that are to their benefit, and which work for you - because you're entitled to his respect as well, as the mother of his children. Again - if he doesn't feel able to go along with that approach, that's his choice. Well done for initiating the process of making all this happen.

I can't stand the "just take it out of the maintenance I pay you" approach. That's like he sees a few hundred quid a month as some sort of fee he pays for the privilege of being able to dick you around like this whenever he feels like it. No. Just no.