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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to ask EU citizens living in the UK (who do not have a British passport) how they feel about the UK post Brexit and whether they plan to stay in the UK if allowed?

120 replies

evilcherub · 22/07/2016 18:06

Speaking to friends who do not have British passports a few have told me they feel uncomfortable here now, like they are seen as "other".

So, if the Government announces with certainty that EU citizens who have been living here and fulfilled the requirements to stay here will be allowed to stay, will you want to stay?

Do you feel differently about the UK since Brexit and do you feel unwelcome in the UK now?

OP posts:
geekaMaxima · 23/07/2016 15:02

Trust me the UK is one of the more tolerant countries out there.

Was, maybe. Not any more.

mortgagefreesoon5 · 23/07/2016 15:15

"I live in the southeast with a high population of immigrants and although some are happy to adapt and embrace British culture there are many that are very closed of-refuse to learn or speak English and will only mix in their own communities."

Happyandsingle, unfortunately you'll find some of your fellow countrymen do exactly that. Except they call themselves "expats".
Trust meWink
For what it's worth I believe that everyone should embrace the culture (and language ) of the country they are living in. I also believe that everyone should live in another country at some point in life, but that is just my view.

popmimiboo · 23/07/2016 15:16

When I moved to France from the UK, aged 20ish, a million years ago, I was shocked by the racist attitude of many, particularly older generation. I was horrified to see the National Front given airtime and addressed as respectable politicians.

In 2016, we seem to have done a u-turn. UKIP has been around 5 minutes but has gained more political respect that le Front National have done in 20 + years. The 18-24 year old students I teach are horrified by Brexit and are unable to see it for anything other than xenophobia or out and out racism. They equate it to Marine LePen winning a general election. Their perception of the UK is tainted and most of them are trying to organize internships in Canada, the States or other European countries, rather than England (-last year they nearly all wanted to go to London.)

Very sad days.

mortgagefreesoon5 · 23/07/2016 15:21

Piglet,
It is awful what happened in that restaurant. I really hope it's not the beginning of the things to come

Headofthehive55 · 23/07/2016 15:35

mortgage I have no interest in embracing another culture. I have lots of other interests and enjoy visiting other countries but don't want to live there. Both DH and I have lived abroad. It reinforced my desire to stay in the U.K and never live abroad again.

happyandsingle · 23/07/2016 15:57

mortgage not everyone can afford to uproot and live in another country just to try it out.
you can still travel and learn about other cultures without needing to live in another country.

mortgagefreesoon5 · 23/07/2016 16:37

Heado, I meant embracing the culture of the country you are living in, and by culture, I include the language. Speaking the language of the country you are living in, enriches the experience.
Happyandsingle, I totally agree, and everyone has got a different path/story in life.

pointythings · 23/07/2016 16:43

I've been here 19 years and yes, I do feel unwelcome. If you were to speak to me in the street, you would not know that I am not British and yes, I've had the 'oh, the immigrants are bad but we don't mean you' spiel from people I know.

I'm not leaving though. My whole life is here - job, pension, my daughters were born here and do not speak my original language (because my DH is American and doesn't speak it, and because frankly it isn't a very useful one). If I need to naturalise, so be it - though I would lose my original nationality, but that is down to the intransigence and unreasonableness of my own country, not the UK's fault. My DDs would be allowed to keep their (my) nationality because they are under age so they at least would have an EU passport.

It makes me sad that racism and xenophobia have now become so much more acceptable, though. Fortunately I work in a very pro-remain place where I do feel welcome and appreciated.

JassyRadlett · 23/07/2016 16:59

What you are seeing is a country that has become overcrowded in certain parts. Not surprisingly people want to stop the overcrowding.

The trouble is, you are going to need more people of working age coming in if you want to maintain public support for people over 65 over the next few decades.

The demographic double of the baby boom retiring at the same time as life expectancy significantly increases (meaning both extra pensions and higher NHS costs as the result of age-related conditions) means that without an expanded workforce, either pensions and the NHS would have to be cut or public debt would have to increase significantly.

Workforce members whose education has been paid for elsewhere and are more likely to spend their retirement elsewhere (the latter being particularly true of EU immigrants) are better choices in pure economic terms.

Happy, out of interest, is Britain your home country?

Laquitar · 23/07/2016 18:31

I want to leave - dh wants to stay for now.

The reasons i want to leave are not emotional reasons i.e. feeling unwelcoming etc. I don't feel that way in Londo and with my British friends who are all Remainers.
I want to leave because i feel that the economy will go very bad, i hope i am wrong but i can not feel optimist.
Also the political situation will go shit. It will be grim.

Tbh i don't think it is only a problem for EU migrants. I think that this is trying to make British people -who didn't vote Out- to brush off their worries and fears. 'oh well at least i have British Passport, those poor people fear that will be kicked out'.
When in fact it is the British people who voted In -my lovely open minded, intelligent, friends- who will suffer due to not fault of their own and they don't even have another passport or speak another language or have family in other country waiting for them with open arms.

I think all the talk about the uk migrants fearing and losing out does devide. Them and us. When in fact we are all going to be in shit here.

esornep · 23/07/2016 18:51

Workforce members whose education has been paid for elsewhere and are more likely to spend their retirement elsewhere (the latter being particularly true of EU immigrants) are better choices in pure economic terms.

Indeed. And, if we introduce a points system such that all our immigrants are highly skilled, a chunk of the UK population will find themselves being forced to do the less skilled jobs (with better qualified immigrants taking the highly skilled jobs they had hoped to do).

There are tens of thousands of agricultural jobs done by immigrants and seasonal workers that UK workers have not wanted to do for decades, due to the hard manual labour involved.

bigbluebus · 23/07/2016 18:52

I was chatting to a woman the other day who from Roumania. She said she had been in England for 3 years. I asked her if she was intending to stay or if she would return to her native country. She replied that she would probably move on at some point but that it had nothing to do with BREXIT. She just felt that she would like to see other parts of the world before probably eventually returning 'home' and settling down.

We also had a friend to stay this week who lives in Denmark - he is English but has lived over there for over 20 years. All his friends and colleagues in Denmark were aghast that Britain had voted to leave but he had travelled the UK visiting friends and relatives and had yet to find anyone who had voted leave. He is seriously thinking of applying for Danish Citizenship though - so it also affects British people living in EU countries too.

twistgreen · 23/07/2016 19:21

DH and I are both non EU migrants. We live in London and haven't experienced any change in attitudes here. I don't feel any less welcome since Brexit, although I think I've always felt more of an outsider when I visit less metropolitan areas in the UK. London is much more diverse though and I feel like we both fit in well and never worry about racism here. I was naturalised as a British citizen decades ago, and DH got his citizenship a couple of years ago. We have no plans to leave, we have discussed the idea of moving to DH's home country but that would be more out of curiosity/for the experience, than to escape any negativity here.

SomewhereAway · 18/09/2016 16:13

Eu citizen here/DH is British, both with degrees (in two different fields).
Thinking to leave after I was attacked twice and received death threats online, after nearly a decade here.
Unwelcome/unwanted doesn't cover it.

To be honest I'm looking forward to leaving, not sure when it'll happen because of the house market slumping down at the moment.

Copperas · 18/09/2016 17:15

Somewhere, I am so sorry - and ashamed for this country.

FarAwayHills · 18/09/2016 17:22

I am an EU citizen and have lived here for almost 17 years. DH is English, we own a house and our DCs go to school here. The result left me shocked and full of uncertainty. In the days after the result I actually felt physically sick and couldn't think of anything else. I've never felt like an outsider or an foreigner here but suddenly I was acutely aware of being exactly that.

I'm not so frightened now things have calmed down although the uncertainty is there in the background. I'm not convinced that Mrs May will round up all EU citizens and chuck us out - they can't even keep track of or deport those that are here illegally at present.

BillSykesDog · 18/09/2016 17:40

My DH is an EU migrant. He was entitled to vote though, he voted out mainly because he is angry about the way the EU has treated his home country. He sees the EU as a Ponzi scheme which exploits poorer countries mainly for the benefit of Germany.

He hasn't really ever experienced predjudice against him here (although apparently his parents did when they lived here for a while in the 1970s) and that hasn't changed since the vote. None of his extended family or other people from his home country have experienced any problems at all since the vote either, despite the fact we live in an area and he works in a profession where it would be expected to be most prominent. He is dubious that there has been any real increase in predjudice at all and suspects much of the anecdotal 'evidence' has been produced for politically motivated ends.

He feels as welcome as he ever did and he has no intention of leaving. It's his home and he is settled here.

lasttimeround · 18/09/2016 17:57

I'm an EU national. Been here since I was 18. I'm in my 40s now. I feel sad and confused and like something I always relied upon has just gone snd I don't understand why. I've no where else to go. My qualifications training and experience are all UK derived. Going 'home' would be like starting again in foreign country. My dh is an EU national from a different EU member states - we can't even speak each others first languages well enough for jobs in either one. So we are trying to make sure we get to stay. It's a pain though. I hsve lots of work travel but will need to send in my passport to apply for permanent leave. Dh just got his. Then there's the fees and test for citizenship. Makes me tearful just to think about. I know from Facebook that some people I know supported snd voted leave. They tell me it's not about me. I find it hard to maintain contact as I feel hurt and annoyed. One got all annoyed telling me of course we wouldn't be kicked out. I wanted to say how about you give me 700 quid and sit the stupid test then.

BarbarianMum · 18/09/2016 18:17

My parents are both EU nationals, they've been here over 50 years. Both want to stay in the UK because that's where their children and grandchildren are and because the UK has been home for so long.

Both have been on the receiving end of some rather nasty comments since June - they haven't had these since the 1970s ironically. My mum is thinking of applying for citizenship but my dad has dementia and couldn't pass the test now. Fuck only knows what we'll do if he has to leave. Sad

RachelRagged · 18/09/2016 18:21

My DH being half German voted Remain as did I .
His Mother (the German half of the marriage to a Brit) came here in 1950 as the wife of a Brit and it was not altogether too pleasant for her , at that time . However she is now settled and, as she was a mere 20 in 1950 has actually spent more of her life here than she ever did in Berlin . She doesn't even have that much of a German accent . Oh and she is staying Put .

PinkSwimGoggles · 18/09/2016 18:25

the 'I don't mean you' is really grating tbh.

frogmore · 18/09/2016 18:31

Parents moved here years ago during Apartheid era. The united voices in GB against the racist regime in South Africa was what gave most of us hope.
Even during the days of Margaret Thatcher, (who notoriusly supported that regime), UK stood with us to demand the release of Neslon Mandela- we felt welcome, safe and supported.
It's all changed now- there are so many Brits in South Africa, settled and are all welcome there- it is sad that the same can not be said for South Africans who come here be it for Education, work or visit.
Quite sad really.

Evergreen17 · 18/09/2016 18:34

I am so sad Sad
I am EU married to a Brit and expecting our first. I have been here for 11 years and I am sure I have contributed to this society hugely.
I am now to bring a child into a world where I know they don't want me.

So sad. I have received nasty comments in the past but I always felt well, this is a minority. Now I know I was wrong and my world has collapsed.

I am from West Europe and look from East Europe and I have been told oh!! I thought you were...! Oh but I see you are ok!
It hurst more to think that however much people dislike my origins they have found others they dislike even more. Makes me sick in my stomach.

But lots of love in this thread.

Lillagroda · 18/09/2016 18:35

The 'I don't mean you' is unbelievably grating.
I don't feel better for the fact that someone thinks I am a more acceptable brand of foreign than others.
The rules don't apply differently to me for it, so the impact remains the same.
And I can't hear that without hearing even more xenophobia, when it's intended to have the opposite effect.

KentishMama · 18/09/2016 19:00

I'm an EU immigrant and I've lived here for 14 years. I've spent my entire adult life and career in this country. I've always been proud of the open-minded, multicultural society that I considered myself part of. Like many others in this thread, I feel like I woke up in a different country and suddenly feel very unwelcome and somewhat uncomfortable in Britain.

I'm not sure what we will do. My husband in British. My child is British. I work for a huge American company whose EU headquarters are (currently) in London. My husband works for a Swedish company. We could both work from anywhere in the world. My husband is adamant that we should leave sooner rather than later, whereas I'm nervous about a move...

I may well apply for British citizenship, even though it's ridiculous that I'm supposed to pay over £1k for the 'privilege' when I have been paying a lot of tax etc for many many years - considerably more than the average Brit!