To think boys should be able to do Brownies?

[PrinceCharming7]

I'm a bit confused why they don't? Girls are allowed to do Scouts/Cubs/Beavers, so why can't boys do brownies?

Rather than mothers of boys clutching their pearl at the thought of their Princes being anything other than completely wonderful, how about you realise that toxic masculinity is drilled into males from a very early age, and in spaces with girls this does have an affect? And rather than sulk about people's valid views of girl spaces, help to erase that toxic masculinity which will negatively affect your sons?

I do get sick of this "what about the boyz" attitude.

I have no idea what your second sentence means, Striped but as has been stated upthread, there are girls who would not be allowed to attend a mixed Brownies group.

In much the same way that many parents don't want their daughters educated with boys.

Stripedsock you are being ridiculous. For starters there is no dancing around a mushroom and hasn't been since the early 90's unless the girls want to participate it a guiding history activity. Secondly as has been posted numerous times on here Brownies/Rainbows and definitely for Guides it is very rare for it to be all about crafts - baker Ross or otherwise. Your post shows up your own ignorance rather than adding any valid debate to the thread

Guides decided to be girls only. There are many girls world wide who would not be allowed to join a mixed organization. You may not like it, but it's true.

we often have boys in our brownie pack. The condition is " if they want to do brownie things" there is normally one or two in the pack, sometimes none. But we are in a tiny village with no cubs or scouts, and it may well not be "official"

yabu. My oldest goes to Rangers (guides) and loves that it's just girls. She wouldn't go if it was half populated by boys. They do tons of stuff, not just crafts.

Both my daughters do sea rangers. That's also girls only. Sea scouts is available for boys. They thrive on learning how to canoe, kayak and sail in a girl only environment. If boys were there then I'm not sure either would go. Girls need a space of their own.

how about you realise that toxic masculinity is drilled into males from a very early age

I find this attitude disgusting.

Out of 13 90 minute meetings this term, we spent 30 minutes doing a craft. Though you're right that it was Baker Ross.
We don't own a toadstool.
However, the girls in my group and in Guides do benefit from 90 minutes a week being leaders, doing den building, campfires, circus skills, wide games, and fundraising with a group of female friends. Much as I benefit from time with my girl friends, working in a male dominated environment.
I'm assuming from your post stripedsocks that either you or your daughters have has a poor experience at Brownies, and from your segregation comment you don't see the need to ever have a female only occasion for anything?

2Stripedsocks I will bite and repeat myself. There has been research done with the girls who say they like the girls only space.They want it. They are not anti boys but they like the space without them.

It sounds like you had a bad experience with Brownies - downside to it being volunteer led we all do our own things. I couldn't trll you when I last did a Baker Ross craft with my unit.

It's not about wanting girls only spaces. It's about many girls needing them.

Girl guiding is one of the largest female organisations in the world. It creates a safe space for girls and women regardless of race, age, religion etc. They allow male volunteers but GG members have repeatedly said they'd like to keep Guiding a safe space for woman as full members and at its core GGUK tries to be as girl led as possible. So if that's what they want, then that's what they get. I love Guiding, it is very much what you make it and I love that it's a female dominated space. Some units are 'girly', some are not, there are no set rules as each unit is different. The waiting lists around here are also huge, we could open up more units if only we had the adult volunteer ratios.

Are there any boy only groups at all, where girls are actually not allowed rather than there just not being any?

DD goes to guides and DSs did scouts. As it happens, the scout troop was boys only when they did it, just through chance not rules.

As has been noted upthread, Boy Scouts sort of, er...relaxed their rules when their numbers dropped while those of the Girl Guides rose.

Funny, that.

I guess safe for me means somewhere they can be themselves, not have to feel self conscious or worried. I run a Guide unit and right now it's all hormones and exams etc. But Guides for them is a space where they can just come and do the things they enjoy with people who are going through the same thing. For example, Free Being Me in Guiding talks a lot about body image - I don't think my guides would be comfortable talking about their body issues and insecurities if there were boys present. But that's just based on what I know my unit is like. That's what I mean by safe and also it's why I think they need it.

Girls should be allowed to have some things that are boy-free and Brownies is one of them.

I'm really disappointed that Scouts decided to start taking girls as I think boys should be able to have things which are girl-free too. Luckily in our area, no girls have joined the Beavers/Cubs/Scouts and numbers are very healthy with boys alone.

"And why do girls "need" it,why? You keep saying it but give no reason."

I think it's more important that Muslim girls worldwide are allowed to join the international scout and guide movement than a middle class boy from Islington is allowed to exercise his right to be a Brownie...........

So you don't value female friendship at all stripedsocks? And you've never been in a situation growing up where you might have tried something or put yourself forward more but the boys got there first? Good for you if so. But for many girls, while they are perfectly capable of doing den building and whatever else with boys, they choose, for a small amount of time a week, to do this in a girl only environment.
What is your issue with this? That girls have the choice but boys don't? Or that there is a choice at all?

"I'm really disappointed that Scouts decided to start taking girls as I think boys should be able to have things which are girl-free too"

They should have joined, then.

Safe space means being able to have half a unit consisting of very modest, young Muslim girls, with space to dance, play games, chat to friends, laugh, cook and grow up whilst being part of something they enjoy with no problems at all.

An old unit I had a few years ago was like this. Very very poor area, piss poor in fact. No subs money ever appeared, borrowed uniforms and I paid as much of the costs as I could. Church gave me the hall for free and the old ladies who helped with the church hall used to help me bake cakes and pancakes with them.

This is safe space.