Another buggy in wheelchair space thread

[MsAR]

I got on the bus at the same time as a wheelchair user was queuing to do so. The driver told the wheelchair user there wasn't room, so I quickly checked and saw it was a buggy and a shopping trolley in the space.

The driver told the wheelchair user there would be another bus in a few minutes and they didn't seem to mind and weren't particularly insistent about getting on.

Was I being unreasonable to step in at this point and tell the driver that the person with the buggy should get off as wheelchairs have priority? He was pretty annoyed when I did, and kept repeating that there wasn't space.

I'm in London, and there are clear signs on every bus stating this is the case. I've often had to get off a bus when a wheelchair needed to get on and would never question if asked to do so.

Would it also be unreasonable for me to complain to TFL? I know I'm being a busy body but the driver's attitude really irritated me! I'd like the mumsnet jury to help me decide what to do, if anything.

I'm hiding this thread now. People are getting too aggressive.
Fwiw I always fold DS's buggy down when a wheelchair user wants to get on. Always have done and will continue to do so. Yes I am glad at the thought of having no buggy next year because there will be no faffing around, and not just on buses. I'm allowed to be glad about that.

Can't hide from disability if it's your life, sadly.

When the going gets tough and you're losing the argument, hide the thread. Good move MeAnd Sorry your poor ickle feelings are hurt by decent people getting angry about this issue and challenging the ignorance of others.

rolls eyes

When I broke my back - well after!! - I would have to say "I'm recovering from a broken back, is anyone able to stand up for me" in order to get seats.

I also had to ask when I was on crutches (more annoying but some people think crutches are substitute legs).

If you have IBS and need to get home you could lie and say "I've got back problems, could someone help with my buggy".

I just don't understand the lack of respect for a wheelchair space.

This is so easily solved: no unfolded buggies allowed on. While you're at it, get rid of P&C parking bays. Turn them into blue badge spaces.

These threads always go round in circles but the bottom line is that having a baby isn't a disability.

Fuuuuucking hell people, it's a wheelchair space. For wheelchairs. Not buggies. Not scooters. Not pregnant women. Not children. WHEEL CHAIRS. WHEEEEEEL CHAAAAAIRS.

This is another reason I think we need bus conductors, I wish they'd never done away with those.

Genuine question, why does a wheelchair have priority

because people CHOOSE to have kids and do NOT choose to have a disability.

For goodness sake.

Why does a wheelchair have priority? Are you serious?

Because as pp said, you don't choose to be in a wheelchair!!! Sweet Jesus there's some dindongs on here today.

I agree with you expat

In my town, the spaces aren't designated as 'wheelchair' spaces, but as 'pushchair and wheelchair' spaces. They have little symbols on the windows to make sure you know what a wheelchair and a pushchair look like. Is that the case for all buses, or are ours odd?

FWIW I have a pelvic condition which means I can't walk very far. If I was asked to get off the bus with my pram for a wheelchair user I would, but I'd be stranded where I stood, living a few unwalkable miles away from the town centre. Buses here run once an hour. It would be pretty awful. But I'd still do it. I really can't imagine the kind of brass neck required to go 'nope, not budging, off you fuck' when asked to move...

Many wheelchair users already don't use buses because of entitled parents

This.

One of the first threads I ever read on MN (lo, those many years ago) was about precisely this subject. It is beyond depressing to see that there are still so many selfish people who genuinely believe that they are entitled to a wheelchair space simply because they want one. All these posts saying how hard it is to fold a buggy, even how impossible it is, how they have a right to that space because they happen to have children and chose to buy a particular buggy, etc. Honestly, words fail me. Do the right thing FGS. Fold the buggy. Or yes, get off the bus if you really can't fold it.

I was in London last week. It must be an extremely difficult city to navigate for people who use wheelchairs. It must be soul-destroying to have to fight for a space on the bus that you have the right to use, while selfish people challenge your right (despite the signs everywhere stating clearly that wheelchair users have priority).

Well done again DawnDonna'sDD for managing to remain civil when engaging with total fuckwits.

First come first served
The first wheelchair user is entitled to the first wheelchair space, everyone else can fold or fuck off.

In the US, it would be illegal under the Americans With Disabilities Act to ask a wheelchair user to take another bus because non-disabled people were already occupying the wheelchair spaces. Does anyone know the exact state of the law on this in the UK? A court case on appeal was mentioned in earlier posts.

I posted up thread about my experience but can I just say something to everyone who keeps saying 'just buy a pram that folds'.

Sometimes it's not just as simple as that. I was in a woman's refuge after leaving an abusive marriage exh punched me full in the face while I was bathing my newborn and I was gifted a double buggy by a charity. I couldnt just buy a new one, I had £40 a week to live on and the clothes I stood up in. I had to take what I was given. That £4 return bus fare was a huge deal and I couldn't just write it off and pay out again. I wish I'd had that luxury.
Again, I agree that the majority of the time the spaces should be given to a wheelchair user but sometimes allowances should be made. It's not all about entitlement.

No. In every case the wheelchair user has priority.

You shouldn't have had to pay again but you needs were secondary to those of a wheelchair user.

Unfortunately Seneca, Mum spent many years (back in the seventies, before I was born) fighting for access in so many different places, buses included. She's a Londoner, although not living there now, but could not access so many places with her uncle or her friends. She and a whole bunch of others fought so hard for blue badges, blue badge spaces, access to public transport, access to public buildings, etc.
She tells me she didn't think in a million years that 'some entitled wanker would come along and demand what she'd fought for as their right whilst simultaneously dismissing the rights and needs of others' Had she done, she insists she'd have had it written into the equalities act!
Dawndonna's dd.

Again, I agree that the majority of the time the spaces should be given to a wheelchair user but sometimes allowances should be made.

No they shouldn't, it's a wheelchair space. The driver should issue a ticket you can give to the next bus driver if you can't fold.

I'm genuinely sorry that you've been through hard times TheTart and hope that life has has been kinder to you. However, it is still a wheelchair space and it's very offensive and rude to say "it's not about entitlement". It is; a disabled person has a right to access the bus without you blocking it. Whilst your personal circumstances were horrific, they do not entitle you to obstruct the space in this way.

if these buggies don't fold how the hell are they even delivered?

you have to fold them. to get them.in the box. ...

don't see many cars driving around with pre assembled buggies tied to the roof.

I have fucking ibs and wouldn't use that as a reason!!
Are you kidding me?
I realise now why i struggle to get seats on the bus ( invisible disability) because people are fucking ignorant.
I hope i don't end up in a wheelchair as it would be even worse.