Another buggy in wheelchair space thread

[MsAR]

I got on the bus at the same time as a wheelchair user was queuing to do so. The driver told the wheelchair user there wasn't room, so I quickly checked and saw it was a buggy and a shopping trolley in the space.

The driver told the wheelchair user there would be another bus in a few minutes and they didn't seem to mind and weren't particularly insistent about getting on.

Was I being unreasonable to step in at this point and tell the driver that the person with the buggy should get off as wheelchairs have priority? He was pretty annoyed when I did, and kept repeating that there wasn't space.

I'm in London, and there are clear signs on every bus stating this is the case. I've often had to get off a bus when a wheelchair needed to get on and would never question if asked to do so.

Would it also be unreasonable for me to complain to TFL? I know I'm being a busy body but the driver's attitude really irritated me! I'd like the mumsnet jury to help me decide what to do, if anything.

My child and I don't use a wheelchair user and we have no wheelchair users in family BTW. I have been a parent who couldn't fold in fact.

Just know what is right.

Perhaps it's high time that buggies should be required to be folded before accessing a bus.

People requiring the wheelchair space because of their disability take precedence, both legally and morally.

Obviously SN buggies excepted.

The buggy-basket is loaded up with his nursery things, my work bags etc. Folding it really isn't an option

And of course it is an option for a wheelchair user or other mobility impaired person.

The selfishness and sheer ignorance on this thread is so depressing. Again.

When people say "Oh ever since having children, I feel so much more strongly" it's rubbish - this thread is evidence of how selfish parents become.

I never encountered a wheelchair user needing the space

I wonder why?

Although on the evidence of this thread, it's pretty clear ...

Of course a wheelchair should take priority.

Out of interest however, would the bus driver issue a ticket for onward travel if a parent got off the bus to allow a wheelchair user on? I don't live in London and to get from the small town where I live to the next big town is about £6 return. I don't use public transport, but I'd be mightily pissed off if I did, and I got off a couple of stops into my journey to allow a wheelchair user on and then had to pay another £6 to carry on my journey.

But you could, you know, fold your buggy and sit in an ordinary seat. No need to get off.

The person in the wheelchair said they didn't mind

Of course they did. After all, people in wheelchairs just love hanging around at bus stops every time they want to use public transport.

More likely they couldn't face yet another sit down row with someone who thinks it's just so unfair they have to be considerate to these damned wheelchair users. When you spend your whole life being seen as an inconvenience pretty much everywhere you go, sometimes you decide not to pick that battle.

If I had been the OP, I would have got on the bus and asked the passenger if they would fold their buggy. If passenger and driver got arsed about it I'd have loudly pointed out how wrong they were, got off the bus and chatted with the wheelchair user whilst we both waited for the next bus. Then reported the driver to TFL. I'm not going to put the wheelchair user in a position where people are angry at them, but I am going to make the point to other people how shit they are for treating someone that way. Especially when they have the most spurious and entitled excuses for they their life is so much harder.

I know in London the driver should issue a transfer ticket and I assume that goes for the rest of the country

You can indeed say it's always morally right.

What if someone is on the bus with 2 small baby's there's no one to help. Because people are staring out the window pretending not to see. You have a hospital appointment for one of the baby's. If you get of the bus you will miss that appointment. Would that be ok? Or even school runs would be late picking child up from school. And not everyone has a friend they can ask to get kids from school.

What if the wheelchair user is also on their way to an urgent hospital appointment and this is the 3rd bus in a row they haven't been able to get on due to buggys?

I do disagree with the sleeping baby thing. If they are that tired they will go back to sleep.

Is it morally right to question a wheelchair user about why they need a wheelchair so you can make some sort of moral judgement? No it is not.

I'm in London and I have a non easy to collapse bugaboo (frame and separate seat unit) and I do use the wheelchair space on a bus.
However if a wheelchair user needs to use the space, I get off and let them have it as per the signs that are plastered all over the bus wall reminding passengers that it's a WHEELCHAIR space and prams can use it ONLY if it's not required by a wheelchair.

DS is 1, not very confident on his feet and frankly a nightmare unless restrained in the pram, it's easier all round to get off and get on the next one.
I think since I've been taking the pram on a bus, I've had to get off maybe 3 times, it really doesn't happen that often.

If you don't collapse your pram or don't get off to let the wheelchair user on, you're a dick.

(On a separate note when DS was very very tiny and it was dangerous to get him out, I used to get annoyed by the space being taken up by umbrella fold prams that were in the space and the older toddler 'owners' of said buggies were sitting in a seat. We couldn't get on because there were empty buggies there that were not folded, surely if you're removing your child from the buggy that's easy to fold, you would collapse it? )

I think they should still get off. And am quite sane, thank you.

I would not agree that a sense of decency dictates that someone in a wheelchair ALWAYS morally takes precedence over someone with a buggy

you're wrong: a wheelchair space is a wheelchair space, for people who have to use a wheelchair to get around.

And if you start with that sort of bullshit: well, shall we ask all the parents with buggies they won't fold, whether their child was conceived from a drunken one-night stand?

As stated before someone could be in a wheelchair bc of a broken leg on their way to the pub and someone else could have floppy newborn twins which they can't carry on their own and fold a buggy and be on their way to a hospital appointment

Utterly ridiculous.

Those of us fortunate enough to be able-bodied, to have choices about how we get around, whether we fold our buggies - remember! TYou're all only TABs: Temporarily Able Bodied.

God, Im so bored with this. I am one of twins and do you know what, despite the fact that I am a wheelchair user (my twin is hanging about, but she will be one by the time we're thirty) my mother used to manage absolutely fine. Not only did she get twins on a bus but she managed my brother too and he was 18 months when we were born, ghostspirit.
KP How would you feel if I got on the bus with my wheelchair and stated that I didn't give a flying fuck about your babies because that's what you've just done to me. You see, your babies are wrapped up warm and snuggly and have waterproof covers. They can be picked up and held, and at 5'7", a good three inches taller than my mother, we can't manage that. My condition also means I'm liable to hypothermia, oh and I may even piss myself if it's cold. I'm 19. Can you imagine how that feels? Can you imagine, as you shift me out of the way because your babies are more important than me and my welfare, how it feels to be constantly marginalised. How it feels for the bus driver, when I get on, to ask my mum/friends where I'm going? To be ignored in shops, towns and cities. Fuck, I can't even get a coffee/coke/glass of wine without someone about because people are frightened they're going to catch what I've got. I'm 19. Give it a bit of thought. Just for one second, imagine how you would fight tooth and nail for your children if it were them, yes I know that's scary but I'm also aware that's what prevents (young mothers in particular) from engaging with us: the fear it may happen to their children. I deserve that sort of consideration, I can't do it so have to rely on others to do it for me.

Thank you.
Dawndonna's dd.

I think people with temporary mobility problems choosing to use a wheelchair to access a bus are pretty rare.

In essence I agree with fanjo and I still think that your buggy should be folded before you get on a bus.

ica I have no idea. There's probably not an answer that would be good for everyone. But like others have said it's not often a wheelchair does get on. Depending on the bus there is often still room for a buggy as well. And if there's not just have to fold or get of.depending on driver they sometimes let you have buggy in ile if it's only a couple of stops

I haven't RTFT but my pram is a carry cot type one and baby is 12 weeks old. Although I can put the wheels down its the carry cot thay takes up the space. I also have a 2 under 8s I would be annoyed at being made to get off a bus. We live somewhere buses are very very frequent so if I was already on the bus I wouldn't want to get off. If that makes me a twat I don't care.

Words fail me.