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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think it's unfair to blame the mother of child hurt by gorilla?

497 replies

pinkladyapple · 30/05/2016 22:02

Yes if she was holding his hand maybe he wouldn't have ended up in the enclosure. But he could have gone over/through the fence in a split second. And the zoo should have fencing which makes this impossible, surely?

The parents aren't being prosecuted for negligence and yet the Internet seem angry at the mother.

But then the people who think that also seem to think a tranquilliser works instantly, and the gorilla wouldn't react to the pain or impact of the dart.

It's sad and terrible though. For everyone.

OP posts:

tiggytape · 31/05/2016 12:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 13:01

It's part of regular risk assessment. Any of the primate keepers should have known there was a breach in security of that enclosure. If a person is harmed at a zoo, legally the zoo is at fault. Even if an idiot scaled a tiger fence. Seriously.

mummytohpm · 31/05/2016 13:24

If anything they should have been watching him in case he got lost or wandered off with a stranger.

They probably didn't think that there was any possibility that he was going to fall in a gorilla enclosure but that's not the point.

The point is they should have been watching their four year old child anyway!!

RedHelenB · 31/05/2016 13:26

Puzzledandpissedoff - me too!

Thefitfatty · 31/05/2016 13:29

Excellent posts bottleofbeer

Thefitfatty · 31/05/2016 13:31

If anything they should have been watching him in case he got lost or wandered off with a stranger.

It would seem she was as eyewitnesses said she began looking for him instantly, but he was hidden in the bushes past the fence.

I remember being at a busy ride at Disney World as a child and grabbing a mans hand that wasn't my fathers. My father noticed before I did, but it was still that instant. No parent is perfect.

Aussiemum78 · 31/05/2016 13:42

It's a weird story because the zoos I've been in have it so you can't access the animals and they can't access you.

Pretty sure most of the dangerous animals at the zoo here have a moat in between that the animals cant access either. The gorillas have a Perspex/glass thing that you look through. There is just no way a child could get in.

The only ones where it would be possible and there's only a fence are animals like goats or echidnas.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 13:46

A low voltage fence behind bushes would have stopped this. Not enough to harm anybody but enough to make them back off it. If a child could be under and over in such a short space of time and into the enclosure who really is to blame?

It simply shouldn't be possible and there are so many ways to prevent it.

Believe me, the bosses of that zoo will be head in hands knowing they're culpable for this. There's no such thing as "should have been better supervised". It should not have been possible and from what I've read it's dumb luck this hasn't happened before.

Chances are a female would have just protected him, sadly it happened to be a male. You can't begin to get your head around an ape's physical strength. A punch from a chimpanzee is seven times that of a strong adult male.

I can't give you an analogy on a gorilla because I didn't work with them. They're just gentler creatures in general.

mummytohpm · 31/05/2016 13:46

thefitfatty if she was looking immediately for him that's fair enough - accidents do happen.

If she wasn't then that's something else entirely.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 13:57

Yes exactly. She was looking for him immediately but couldn't get to him in time before he "flopped over into the enclosure".

He was in way too easily. That's the bottom line here. The zoo failed in its first safety obligation. It didn't in its second. It is shoot to kill in these circumstances. Tranquilising is done to get a dangerous animal to a vet. It's not fast enough in a life and death situation.

Thurlow · 31/05/2016 14:03

YANBU.

We don't know the full story, none of us were there and there's no video footage of how the child got away from his parents. But kids do move bloody quickly sometimes, and most parents have 'lost' their child at some point.

But a zoo enclosure with potentially dangerous animals in should be so well enclosed that there's no way anyone could get in.

It's a tragic accident. I think it's devastating that the gorilla was killed but it does make sense that they were too worried about how it might react to being tranquilized.

The whole thing is very tragic, but it's unfair to blame the parents (and particularly the mother) unless we've all seen exactly how quickly that child got away.

EveryoneElsie · 31/05/2016 14:05

It takes minutes for a tranquilizer to work, and in that time apes frequently get angry, pull out the dart and throw them back.

Kids can dart away like greased lightening if the idea comes into their head, and anyone who doesn't get that has never been the hands on parent.

I'm pro reins, a lot of people are disgusted by them as well. It pays to remember that nasty, spiteful people love to create a culture of blame. It doesnt solve a single problem.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 14:11

I always used reins, how strange that now people think they're somehow wrong.

They stopped my kids running off. Particularly useful when I had a two year old (just) and a new born. The weight of a double pram was far too much after a section. Plus, said two year old wanted to walk.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 15:38

I've watched the video again. And I'm more and more annoyed with the zoo.

Gorillas do have the potential to be very gentle and there most definitely is the possibility that this one would have been too. At first it shows no aggression towards the boy. In fact, seems to be protecting him. This has actually happened before as per the video up thread.

The crowd's screams agitate him and he gets rougher. The zoo should have moved ALL spectators and there is a chance, albeit a small one, that the boy could have been safely removed without the gorilla dying.

Aeroflotgirl · 31/05/2016 15:39

If the parents were being responsible, none of this would have happened.

NickiFury · 31/05/2016 15:46

Oh were you there then aero? That you know this? You sound so positive.

See I read two accounts and there was one witness who says the parents were being responsible and another who said they weren't. So unless you were there, it's really just not possible to know this for sure is it?

Fairuza · 31/05/2016 15:47

So you've never taken your eyes of a child then Aeroflot - never stopped to take a photo or pay for an ice cream at the zoo?

NickiFury · 31/05/2016 15:54

This is a long term couple, both holding down jobs, four kids, made the effort to take their kids out on a family day to the zoo. For me I am just not seeing the feckless irresponsible people and parenting that people seem to be trying to paint this family with.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 15:55

Would you go to a zoo with a reasonable expectation that enclosures of potentially dangerous animals would be secure enough not to allow a child - what appears to be - fairly easy access?

When I go to the zoo, I have to be totally honest here, it's never even occurred to me that it might happen.

Buttercupsandaisies · 31/05/2016 15:59

Bottle

The zoo gave a 30 minute statement this morning highlighting just how dangerous these animals are. He said the videos didn't show hardly anything of what actually happened - the gorilla was pulling him round banging his head against the rock! He said the gorilla could crush a coconut with one hand and that he was in very serious danger. This was from the zoo itself. They said he was very lucky to survive and as sad as it was to shoot, he said he'd do the exact same thing today

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 16:05

They're right. I'm just speculating on the difference between the great apes. Gorillas do have the potential to be gentle and leave you alone if you wandered too close. It also could have ripped the child apart as easily as pulling the wings off a fly. It's just not an absolute conclusion that it will. Obviously this gorilla was spooked and getting aggressive. No option but to kill it.

A "cuddly" chimpanzee wouldn't hesitate. It'd kill you on sight.

Aeroflotgirl · 31/05/2016 16:06

I have a 4 year old boy, and I know he is a bolter, he has a littlelife backpack that I hold onto when we are out.

Aeroflotgirl · 31/05/2016 16:08

They are partially responsible, the question is, how was the boy able to get into the cage, it should have been much more secure.

bottleofbeer · 31/05/2016 16:11

If a child runs in front of a car and is killed do we see it as a tragic accident or do we hound whichever adult was responsible for the child at the time?

It takes seconds. Difference is it's entirely normal to assume a gorilla enclosure is safe and can't he easily accessible by inquisitive children.

Aeroflotgirl · 31/05/2016 16:13

If you know your child is a bolter, and will run off like my ds, we do not go out without the backpack harness thingy. It often looks like I am walking my dog, but i would rather be on the safe side.

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