To think that the Jobcentre are absolutely taking the piss?

[BumFunHun]

A bit of background history first of all:-

My dad, aged 60+ (keeping it vague for the purposes PC/data protection/fear this post may backfire to his detriment) moved in with my DH and I approx 3 years ago, after finding himself a little bit homeless, and a lot unemployed and skint.

Anyway, moves in with us, and starts the painful process of 'being a doley' (his words, not mine) for the first time ever in his adult life. He's worked previously since he was 18 in a manual trade.

This is where it gets all kinds of long...so apologies in advance - and congratulations if you read this without falling into coma:-

So, resigned to the fact that at 60+ he's not going to really have too much joy in finding manual work he has experience in, he signs on. Eventually his £76.whateveritis, starts filtering through on a fortnightly basis. Since January he has had to take part in compulsory work placement to continue receiving his pennies. Fine, no biggie, he gets on with it - has attended Every. Single. Fucking. Day since January. 10-4 pm, Monday to Saturday in the charity shop he's been assigned to. Mundane work, where, when asked how his day has been, he considers it a promotion to have been assigned to 'pressing' rather than 'hanger sorting'

Whatever, I digress, he today receives a letter telling him that his benefits are at threat of stopping as the Jobcentre in their infinite wisdom believe he did not attend his placement on 26 April (he did) and hasn't been completing his mandatory hours of 9-5pm (impossible, as the shop he has been assigned to opens at 10 and shuts at 4 - hence him taking it upon himself to do the Saturdays instead to make up the time)

I'm furious for him! I get that they have to enforce these mandatory placements to make working seem a better option for the few that choose benefits as a lifestyle choice - but the man is over 60 (although not quite entitled to any form of pension); has knackered knees; no relevant experience for less exhausting work; and his age against him when it comes to applying.

I'm also mad because (albeit slightly unrelated to the above):-

1. They (JS) made him attend a test to assess his English and Maths levels, despite him being grammar school educated, with exam passes clearly on the CV they made him rewrite to their standard precedent format (which ironically, is pretty crap)
2. The letter inviting him on the course was littered with the most basic grammar and spelling mistakes, he actually red-bic'd the whole thing and handed it in when he attended, joking that he'd completed the English test.
3. He's previously had letters demanding he attend course/appointments with them that are post stamped AFTER the date of said appointment, then been threatened with sanctions for not turning up
4. The most recent letter re the supposed 'failed attendance' was signed off 'Regards [initials, rather than name], so he can't even address a response to a person
5. They didn't check their sodding facts in any way before sending the letter.

Am I being unreasonable to think they are a bunch of penpushing wankers over there, and perhaps they should just give him a nice paid job in the HQ somewhere, proof-reading letters before they're sent, rather than making him work 30 hours a week for 76 quid a fortnight?!

Hit me - I can take it if I am BU.

I can also accept that my post could probably be a fuckload more concise - but I'm in rant mode, and my fingers of fire just won't stop typing....

Ironically, he couldn't give a shit. He's penning a letter addressed "Dear [initials]
[insert required written explanation required no later than 17 May]

Lots of love [his initials] x"

Perhaps I'll just not give a shit too, although his £40 a fortnight contribution to his food and the bills is actually quite needed. Feel better for offloading anyway.

The job centre staff may not make the rules but they're the ones who refer people for sanctions. So in this case the staff would have referred the OP's dad as they seem to be under the impression he didn't turn up that day. Whether they believe that is another matter.

I think it needs to be pointed out that job centre staff do not right the policy. I used to be one of them and have many friends who still are . Most are horrified at the way older claimants are treated.

Sorry don't agree with what you are saying. The woman who I dealt with didn't not administer a policy, it was clear she wasn't remotely concerned whether she embarrassed or upset anyone as she knew she had the threat of stopping their money to back her up. I sat in that queue and heard her speak to client after client like they were dirt, all of whom barely said a word in return as they were made to feel ashamed.

A policy, however tough, can be administered without the unnecessary vitriol.

I read dad some of these replies-he thanks you all for your kind wishes, and reciprocates for those in the same, rather unfortunate, boat as him.
He is going to get his letter sorted tomorrow, and arrange for his supervisor to also sign a declaration at the end, verifying that he has indeed been there hanging/tagging/pressing/sorting since the placement started back in January.

I know you don't want to give your Dad's age, but it's just worth checking he isn't eligible yet for Pension Credit Guarantee - for example, someone who will turn 65 on 10th May 2018 will be eligible for PCG at 63.5 years old, so Nov 2017.

If your Dad was born before March 1953 he's eligible for it already, so wouldn't need JSA.

Another MNer set up a website where you could contribute with tales of JC awfulness. I can't remember what it is called though.

Yanbu, that's awful.

YANBU.. Your Dad should be treated with far more dignity and respect.

Yes it is government policy however the staff are frequently rude, speak down to claimants, report for sanctions...I had to sign on twice and was told off for approaching desk ( to ask where to go) standing on carpeted area.. I felt like an angry naughty child by the time I left.. They did nothing to help me become employed.

YANBU

My DH had the same trouble for 3 years, absolute arses.

::This is unfortunately what people who choose to be on benefits as a lifestyle choice have done to those who need help.::

Bull. This is what the government have done for purely ideological reasons to remove the social safety net and shrink the size of the state. Don't swallow that Daily Heil, divide and rule crap.

Fucking Tory party scum undermining people every step of the way in their hour of need. Just look at how they've treated disabled people. The average out of workie doesn't stand a chance .

My son with was sanctioned for being on a course that the job centre sent him on. He was sanctioned again for not applying for enough jobs in a week, he applied for 40 and the final straw for me was when he was sanctioned for not signing on on a Wednesday when they had written Friday on his card.
It's policy he is on the autistic spectrum and an easy target so that they can reach their targets. They expect your dad to not know the system

Your Dad sounds awesome :)

There's a blog in this, if he likes writing.

It's a revolting system set up to humiliate and grind people down.

minsmum - that's unspeakable

We or rather I complained and insisted on a meeting with the job centre manager. His benefit was reinstated and he was moved to a different advisor. Poor thing has been looking for work for years but all he ever gets are 6 month placements and offers of voluntary work, unpaid naturally

The irony is if everyone on jsa managed to find work these very people would be out of a job themselves.

I know this is ageism but if I owned a business I wouldn't take on people close to retirement especially with Heath problems.

Luckily, the loathsome Iain Duncan Smith has had a sudden Damascene conversion.

He now says that his reason for wanting us to leave the EU is that it is good for the rich, and we should leave so we can be kinder to the have-nots.

What a shame he only realised this week where his sympathies lie.

The job center staff may not write the policy.

But the policy sure as shit does not say lie to claiments, set them up to fail by intentionally not notifying them of appointments, set up for sanction by telling them to apply for jobs they are not qualified for use sanctions to prevent attendance at interviews, nor does it say anywhere that it is acceptable to lie about them or send them on a placement for set hours then say those hours are wrong.

I know this because ive read every page of every welfare benefits legislation and DWP guidance and official training manual written in the last 20 years.

I went to the job centre when I came back from abroad and was struggling to get back on my feet. The woman who dealt with me was openly vile and told me she couldn't really help me as I'd probably never get back into my career (that I'd been doing really bloody well for over 15 years) and should retrain. While applying for every job under the sun. I was really at a low ebb and I left in tears. A really good old work colleague skyped me, made me laugh, helped me get some work and I went back in to the job centre. It wasn't enough apparently. My industry does freelancers, short or long term contracts. I'd got work but none of it was acceptable as I was getting bits here and there at the start. Finally I had extreme pleasure telling her where to stuff her attitude. And her so called help. And that I'd sort my life out while she'd always be there, being nasty and mean to people who were vulnerable. We had bugger all money for a few months but I couldn't face the bastards again.

Years and years ago job centres were to help you get work. Now they just treat you like lying thieving scum. I'm forever grateful that I got out of it quickly. Because they would have ground down any self esteem I had left if I'd had to deal with them for longer. I'd been working since 18 and had never, ever been unemployed.

I'd employ your dad - he sounds great. And yes, their CV's are crap. Mine was way better and she had the fucking temerity to try to bland it down. The job centre's not in my town any more. Otherwise I'd be tempted to dance past with a super enlarged image of my current contract, in the industry I've been working in all my life. You know, the one I had no hope getting a job in. Fuckers.

I've just realised that this was five years ago! It's probably way worse now

YANBU - and your dad sounds lovely!

I'm speaking as a former Jobcentre employee, I left when it was becoming clear that the policies dictated I was no longer able to actually help people. Unfortunately, the wanker jobsworth staff seemed to be the ones getting the promotions.

My son with was sanctioned for being on a course that the job centre sent him on

How does that work then?

YANBU, most people get sanctioned at some point. they dont believe he didnt attend, they are trying it on.
A percentage of people sign off in disgust.

There are plenty of people here who support this kind of bullshit as they believe people like your Dad are sponging off the poor tax payer, while ignoring the fact he has paid in plenty over his long working life.
Tell him to keep his chin up,

It wasn't that long ago when job centres were hopefully places. I'm 40 I remember going in at 18 seeing actually proper bone fide jobs on post cards you took the card off wall waited to see adviser.

They then asked you about skills or qualifications then said right let's give them a ring. Would ring up employer arrange an interview then and there and pass the phone onto you if any questions.

Result people got really chance of getting a job and advisers could say no don't think that place is right for you. None of this hundreads of jobs online and all vague about pay hours and what the actual blimey job is in the first place.

Do they still make you use universal jobmatch?

eveonline seriously? and why not? I'm kind of hoping you aren't an employer of any kind as your attitude is, frankly, appalling and illegal.