To think we need to get a grip about SATs and stop the drama

[PeaceLoveGonk]

DD(11) has to work very hard just to be average academically. None of this SPAG bollocks comes naturally but she just bloody well gets on with it.

She came out of school yesterday, said test was hard, she didn't finish it but did her best. We then went for ice cream and when we got home she went on the iPad.

No one in her class had hysterics, went into meltdown, cried or did anything other than try their best.

I've read a thread on TES forum describing the test as 'brutal' and there is much talk about ruining our children's lives. I think it's just 4 tense days before they start the wind down to summer.

We're not doing our kids any favours with all this anger, breast beating and angst. They're not working in clothing factories in India, trying to make a living from a rubbish dump or facing death on a dinghy trying to cross the sea to escape persecution. It's 4 days of tests!

givepeas

It would have been kinder to offer help rather than criticism in the first place. You have had access to this stuff. Most people will never have heard of it.

Your child may be resilient and indeed you probably are too after studying all of this. But I think the next step in your learning is to study empathy.

I will have a look at these links now. Thank you.

You've got to work with your DC to raise their self esteem
Couldn't agree more, it doesn't come naturally to some kids, you have to work at it over a long period of time

YANBU

My (low achieving and emotionally immature) DD was OK after yesterday, quite possibly because the nuances went over her head, but I'm fine with that.

I do think the posters talking about resilience are spot on, and that is something that DD has matured in this year. It is something we consciously work on with both our DDs.

Those with 'perfectionist' DC do need to try to find ways for them to learn it is OK not to be perfect. Otherwise at some point in the future they may decide they can't be perfect so stop trying (which is a danger of labelling a child as 'bright' as opposed to 'hard-working', or rewarding results rather than effort).

We have explained to DD she should not expect to be able to answer every question, and to either put down her best guess or move on. We made a deal early in the year not to worry about subordinating conjunctions etc, just listen in lessons, and try her best, but don't worry if it's too hard. We talk about trying her best, but we will love her even if she gets zero.

Luckily our school has also been taking a sensible approach, preparing them well but not going over the top on homework or pressure. They had a whole day off timetable last week, which I'm sure many schools wouldn't have dreamed of.

Personally I feel this year has been beneficial to DD, as it was to her older sister a few years back. Apart from the grammar (which is OTT), she has been able to consolidate her maths and her English. They have plugged holes from previous years. She has learned to have a go even if something is hard. She has learned to read questions carefully and not just answer what she thinks they asked. All of this will stand her in good stead for progressing to secondary.

So PeaceLoveGonk, if you had a boss who gave a talk to the workers every week explaining how it is absolutely essential that you meet x targets and how if you don't it will ruin your employment chances forever besides letting the company down, and you knew you hadn't the faintest chance of meeting those targets because they were totally unrealistic, that wouldn't mess with your resilience in any way? Or if you did get stressed, that would be the fault of your parents for failing to bring you up resilient?

Add to that the fact that you could always leave and take another job, whereas a child (unless parents are willing and able to homeschool) usually has no choice in the matter at all.

Some kids don't ever care that much, and that's great, though what looks like "resilience" now may actually be a disadvantage come GCSEs.

Some will cope with pressure up to a point then crack, dramatically. And you may not know until it's too late. My apparently "resilient" teenage DD - bright, not easily stressed, does best when under pressure, actually enjoys tests - ended up with MH problems last year, and unnecessary pressure from school was IMO at least partly responsible.

Yes, they're two separate things, but still largely assumed to be down to amazing parenting, but both still largely determined by nature.

My son was resilient, he had it by the bucket load, but his experience of the last year in school has severely knocked this. Depending on who you are, you cannot keep up flawless resilience when life is constantly knocking you back telling you you're shit.

I took part in the MNHQ quick survey about SATS. I said that I would scrap SATS for Year 2 and rely only on teacher assessments, but would keep SATS for Year 6 as I agree that kids need some form of testing before High School.

I took that survey at the weekend - BEFORE my DD took the first test. I had no reason to believe that she would totally meltdown during yesterday's test. All the sample papers she has done she has never scored less than 96% - It wasn't good enough for her, but I was able to get through to her how wonderful it was. She had a brilliantly relaxed weekend, slept well on Sunday and went into breakfast club on Monday with a spring in her step.

She came out of school on Monday pale, pasty and red eyed. She was hysterical during the test and had to be calmed by the HT. She didn't want to eat her tea, wanted to revise and had a screaming match with me because apparently I should have MADE HER REVISE over the weekend rather than FORCE HER TO PLAY - because the test was nothing like the work they previously did and it was MY FAULT because I must have missed out a test, or purposely hidden one "The school wouldn't have tested us on something we weren't taught"

Except they did.

She barely slept last night. I had two parents approach me this morning asking if she was ok because their children were worried about her. One child has been taken out of school, another didn't complete any of the 2nd or 3rd sections. 5 children were in the playground clinging to their parents this morning.

I still support the school. I don't think they have put any more pressure on my DD than she has put on herself - but that doesn't matter. She's still suffering.

I think my dd is about as resilient as they make them: she is doing a demanding physical job despite having a chronic pain condition, she is applying for the second time (and getting ready to apply for the third time) to some of the most prestigious performing arts schools in the world, auditioning and having her performance shot to bits, being rejected and trying again. I can't see any failure in building resilience there.

But I do remember the time when the selfish hysteria of her primary school nearly broke her resilience. And it was so completely pointless: cheerful encouragement would have got exactly the same results out of her as the hand-wringing.

'massive lack of empathy as usual from those with resilient children who breeze through anything life chucks at them'

I would add that my dcs have not been without adversity, quite the opposite.

But this sentence shows that there is a misconception that resiience is a 'natural state', you've either got it or you haven't and you can't change that. THere is nothing further from the truth than that. Anyone can learn it. And would you believe it that Eton have it on their curriculum because they know it's value. And that it can be learned. Back to my previous point that it should be on the NC.

Of course resilience can be taught. So can mathematics. Doesn't mean that parents have failed if their child is less resilient than somebody else's child, any more than a teacher has failed if not all his students get A* in maths. And it certainly doesn't mean that the teacher has been undermining their maths ability in any way.

Actually resilience is the new buzz word in education at the moment (Senco told me this last time I had a meeting with her).

When I visited school the other day they had posters up on the wall about it. So in our school it is being taught.

Yabvvvu you cannot compare your child against others. Yes it is stress for the teachers and tge students. Some are not average, but have difficulties academically, and might be demoralised by it all. I especially disagree with SATS at Y2, totally unesessary and unacceptable. They are all so very young and beginning their learning.

Cory
At no point have I said a parent has failed if their child is not resilient

I have said these tests are unintentionally revealing low levels of resilience in some children.

Ds is likely a child who won't stress SATS. His self esteem is high, he is not easily rattled and his feathers are usually unruffled. He's also quite bright - not exceptional, but interested and interesting. Maths and literacy do not float his boat. I know they're essential life skills, and will do all i can to help him develop them, but I also think our education system does our children a huge disservice by focusing so heavily on maths and literacy. I'd like to see tomorrow's scientists, musicians, artists, engineers, oceanographers etc equally supported in their strengths and interests and there is no chance of that with an education system predisposed to focusing only on traditional academia. Many children are not unintelligent, or below average, but their way of learning does not fit the traditional mould - they are less comfortable with the theory and are far better experiential learners. Putting our children in boxes and making them sit tests at such an early age, and within such limited scope, is completely ineffective and turns more children off education than it benefits. Britain has produced some amazing explorers, inventors, scientists but I would argue that's in spite of, not because of, our incessant need to test them and push them down roads that simply do not engage them.

I have nothing against tests per se: what is wrong with these tests is precisely that they judge the school, which in some cases causes the very people who should be calm and sane and rational educators to panic and start piling their angst on young children.

A test that was only about establishing general national level but where the results of individual schools were not published in the national press might be less harmful. We had those tests when I was at school. Didn't stress anybody out.

My son personally hasn't uttered a word about SATS, he went in yesterday with a book to read in between and I told him that he just had to try his best and whether he gets 0% or 100% I was proud of him.

He shrugged and said it was ok although he couldn't finish the last question be issue he ran out of time.

The school really haven't made a big deal out of it at all.

Ds has missed so much school I don't imagine he'll score well but so what? He'll try his best and that's perfect.

I agree with testing, it's essential for teachers to know how their pupils are doing. I'm not out for a SATs ban at all.

Ds kept his resilience through bereavement, family ill health, a whole load of shit. It has been this last year at primary that has stomped on it.

And would you believe it that Eton have it on their curriculum because they know it's value.

And....

There are many things on the curriculum in Eton both of past and present that would or could not really be on the NC. Not to say that 'resilience' shouldn't be.

Whilst some may have resilience it would seem that empathy is lacking.

Dd somehow by passed SATS by moving in year 6 to a school that didn't do them. DS did them and got a level 2 or 1 in everything. He started Secondary school in the September and was told they took no notice of SATS results as they preferred to test everyone with their own exams in the first few weeks of starting. I know several schools do this. I don't know of any that did actually take any notice of SATS results.

So if SATS have no bearing on the child's future and is more about the ability of the teacher to teach then if this years test didn't relate to what was taught what bearing had they on the teachers ability to teach.

Dd is starting her GCSEs today. She breezed in and she will breeze out. She knows she will probably fail, she is dyslexic and ADD. So if she passes anything she will be over the moon but she doesn't think the stress of revision is worth trying to get a D rather than a U or E. She is very pragmatic about everything. Academics is something she is not going to pursue. She already has scholarship offers to colleges that don't care what GCSEs she gets.

Ds has missed so much school

Not meaning to be rude but maybe that could be why you don't believe the school have 'made a big deal out of it'. Hope your DS is ok.

It would be very very unusual for a school not to be focused on it or for children as has been previously suggested, not to know they are taking them in Y6.

Re the empathy thing........sometimes being too empathetic does not help people (ruinous empathy)

I would rather you hated me but looked at something in a different way because I have been "harsh" than be overly empathetic and in doing so not alert you to a possible problem.

This is only words on a screen after all, I don't actually know you so true empathy is very difficult.

Oliversmumsarmy

This year's SATS are nothing like previous years, including last year's. They really aren't comparable.

Resilience is NOT taught by throwing children - or anyone - in at the deep end and hoping they can swim. It does not make them any better at swimming. Indeed, it makes them (properly quite rightly) shit scared of swimming.

Resilience comes over time, and it is individual. A child with SEN is very different to a very able child. Making them sit the same test is fucking ridiculous, quite frankly. It is to our children's credit that they want to do well, and natural that they will be upset that they can't complete the tests, even if they weren't expected to. Making children starkly aware of their limits is completely demotivating.

I hate this government. And YABU.

My dd is fantastically resilient, breezed through the 11+ in the September, came out happy and smiling because we had all kept calm, worked hard on the relevant stuff and came out feeling she'd done her best. Not one tear shed, lots of ice cream.

She then had to endure the school's hyping of SATS for the remainder of Year 6 in which she started to experience self-doubt, stress and generally her lovely calm demeanour was eroded by daily assemblies about how crap their last results were, constant taking home of practice tests, pressure and so forth.

It is perfectly possible to test children and have a pleasant experience: schools and SATS can't do this in my experience.

It's an utter waste of a Year and the best thing about Year 6 is that next year is Year 7 and they get to leave it all behind- except now they won't with retesting.