To think swimming teachers are obsessed with putting face in water

[2catsnowaiting]

Here's the thing. All my children love going to the pool and enjoy playing in the water. All of them, at a young age hate or hated putting their face in the water.

The older two taught themselves to swim by using flotation jackets, from which I gradually removed the floats, until they were able to swim without the jacket. I tried the same thing with the youngest, but he has now outgrown the jacket and no sign of any bouyancy at all. He can just about swim with a noodle float but even that is a struggle.

I'm wondering whether to put him in for swimming lessons, however, from my limited experience of it, it seems that swimming teachers are obsessed with making kids put their faces in the water, as if this is more important than actual swimming, and you can't learn to swim without doing so. I know this is not the case as my oldest got her 10m badge swimming with her head out of the water. She then did 6 weeks of lessons with school, at the end of which she would put her face in the water, and then they said she could get her 10m badge, which she already had before she started - how is that progress? I realise that if you are planning to become a professional or competitive swimmer, then you need to learn correct technique, but clearly none of mine are, I just want them to enjoy swimming for fun/exercise. My mum is in her 60s and still swims with her head out of the water, it's never done her any harm.

My worry is, (and the reason the older two have never had swimming lessons outside the very few they had with school) that he will start to hate going swimming because the teachers will make him put his face in the water. I would rather he loved going to the pool and couldn't swim than started to hate it.

Has anyone experienced swimming lessons where they do not insist they have to put their faces in to make any progress? I'm unwilling to pay good money for someone to make my child do something he hates.

I think it's more important that he learns to float.

This made me nostalgic. I remember in late primary school not understanding why my very unathletic mother could float, and I who had swum in races and had various life-saving badges couldn't. It was was a while before I realised that floating isn't really a skill, it's physics. A few decades later, I'm now fat enough to float in the Mediterranean, but still not fat enough to float in a London swimming pool.

In my life I've never known anyone actually fall into water, how likely is it?

Unfortunately I know of at least three teenagers who drowned in the river in the last ten years.

Glad you're coming around to the idea OP.

It's not just a life skill it's a life SAVING skill - saved my life! I fell in a fast moving river aged 11 with sodding wellies on! If I hadn't been a strong confident swimmer I'd have been done for!

My mother had a fear of water after being pushed off a pier aged 5. She learnt at 50 with an instructor trained in dealing with water phones, she loves it now!

As for 'how often does it happen' well the thing is the statistics only state deaths (approx 30 under 16's a year, I know that's not many but I'll be damned if I'll risk it being my dd) and requiring treatment, approx 3 x that many need treatment for near or secondary drowning.

I've 2 friends that are lifeguards one at local pool one at beach where I grew up, they deal with folk getting into trouble most weeks in the summer months.

Also as has been said, poor technique leads to injury, muscle strain and means they're just not as strong a swimmer so if they do get in bother they can get out of it.

Personally I think it should be pretty much compulsory!

Water phones? Where can I get one waterphobes!

OP, my advice would be to book a few one-on-one swimming lessons with a private instructor rather than sticking him in group lessons for months on end(both will wind up costing about the same). It is likely that he is nearly there but has hit a wall and needs a non-parent to give him the push.

Yes, they do need to put their faces in the water. My mum swims with her face out the water and always get neck pain after swimming!

"I teach school swimming - y3 & y4. I can honestly say I (and all the other teachers) find it a little heartbreaking when a child starts these lessons without being able to swim basic strokes with face in. A bit like expecting the teachers to potty train or teach your child to read without any parental input."

Please bear in mind that not everyone has access to free/super cheap subsidized lessons, not everyone can get to the pool week after week, esp if they are a single parent with two or three kids, etc. etc. Swimming is a huge pain in the arse and depending on your lifestyle it can be extremely hard to fit it all in. Esp now that public services have been cut, and there are strict rules about adult/child ratios in most pools.

This made me nostalgic. I remember in late primary school not understanding why my very unathletic mother could float, and I who had swum in races and had various life-saving badges couldn't. It was was a while before I realised that floating isn't really a skill, it's physics. A few decades later, I'm now fat enough to float in the Mediterranean, but still not fat enough to float in a London swimming pool.

I'm not entirely sure about this, I don't think it's to do with fatness rather something else (though what I don't know). I am very slim and can float for ages with practically no effort in any pool, my slim husband can't float well at all. The salt will help you float in the sea though.

RaisingSteam have you been offered any other classes? My DD is very tall for her age, and at her first swimming lesson she literally towered over all the others in the class, the water only came up to her waist
They moved her over into something called the older beginners class, as I was rightly told she needed to be in deep water, if she was to learn to swim properly.
She was scared the first couple of weeks but she is getting more confident as the weeks go on and it's worth every penny if you ask me.
To the people commenting about sensory issues, have a look around your local leisure centre and enquire if they have any experienced instructors.
My DS has sensory issues, etc, and he is on a waiting list for the specific instructor who is specialised in dealing with kids like DS.
I think the reason I'm so for DCs learning to swim is that I'd be as much use as a chocolate teapot.

You have to be able to float to progress through the basic badges don't you? (star float, mushroom float...)

My mother had a fear of water (she wouldn't have a shower and in the 25 years of my life she was alive; I saw her get into any sort of pool once - she certainly couldn't swim). My Dad can allegedly swim although I cannot recall any concrete memories of him doing so; but I do remember tales of him being thrown into the deep end of the pool by my Grandfather (we're talking 1950s here).

I didn't learn to swim until I was 10. That was from primary school lessons. I was (and am still not) a great swimmer although I can now do the basic strokes (head in the water and all) but thankfully my sister was sent to lessons at the age of four or so (she went on to win the inter school diving competition aged about 10 although she was also a gymnast so that probably helped)

One thing my DH (great swimmer - learned in Saudi as a kid, found out a couple of months ago after 12 years together that he can dive like a demon) agreed on was that our DCs would learn to swim. At least until they knew what to do in an emergency and could save themselves.

DD finally started lessons at nearly 5. One of the first things the fantastic coaches did with them was have buckets/watering cans and teaching them to get their faces wet. They taught technique rather than distance. It took a while because she had picked up on my dislike of getting my face wet (I can just about cope with a decent shower now).

We moved abroad before DS was old enough to go to lessons. He taught himself in a paddling pool (ok, quite a deep one). He is at his best underwater although we work with him on knowing how to go on his back and float if necessary (thankfully the time he decided to jump into the deep end of a hotel pool - he'd been told not to - whilst we got towels he remembered)

We are still living abroad and the first thing that both of them do (takes 5 minutes) are to do their lengths. For DD that's all 4 strokes (butterfly without the arms) and for DS front crawl and backstroke (he hasn't quite managed to get the hang of the leg kick for breaststroke). It's exercise, it's discipline (they get plenty of time to play afterwards).

We were staying at a hotel last year some time and the kids were doing their lengths and there was a little girl panicking about going in the water. I spent some time talking to her and getting DD to show her what she could do. I got a message from the mother this year saying her DD was now in swim club, wants to grow up to represent her country, and remembered that time in the pool.

I was in the pool last week watching a teenage boy plough up and down head out, splashing everywhere. Longed to tell him to get lesson and breath properly, he was wasting so much energy.
My ds was an underwater swimmer, natural breastroker , but never had a problem learning breathing for front crawl. He is now a lifeguard and part of his training is to swim head up, which he finds counterintuitive and hard work.
Op
She may have learned to "swim" but she cant swim properly.

I'm not entirely sure about this, I don't think it's to do with fatness rather something else (though what I don't know). I am very slim and can float for ages with practically no effort in any pool, my slim husband can't float well at all. The salt will help you float in the sea though.

It's to do with centre of gravity, which varies from person to person and isn't related to fatness/thinness.

Thank you to the poster who put the link to get people uses to putting their head under. I will definitely try those stages with DS and myself as I definitely have a kind of fear of water, even though I can swim. I know I picked up my anxiety from my mum, who got it from hers, and DS struggles too. It would be great to break the cycle.

OP, people I've known to fall in water:

My childminders daughter fell in the canal when she was walking along the edge, holding hands, and a stone crumbled and she fell in. Luckily she was fine but shaken of course.

A teenager from the college I went to went out one night, fell into a river and his body was not found for a month. His poor parents had to wait 30 days around Christmas time to find out what had happened to him. He was only 17.

I've also heard several jokey tales about people falling into water but as they could swim and didn't panic, the stories are funny rather than tragic, and easily forgotten.

Further to my post at 22:44 yesterday when I posted a link about a 16 year old lad who'd gone missing at the weekend after swimming in the river, very sadly a body has now been found.

OK, OP here, I feel vindicated now in my original post, having put the younger two in for an intensive swimming course this week.

The younger one (6) has now 'learned' to put his face under the water, however, having watched the class I have seen no progress made whatsoever in actual swimming. He has been swimming with a noodle float, which is what he was already able to do. There has been no attempt to get him to try to swim without a float or teach him the techniques to do so. So apparently, it costs £35 to teach a child to put their face in the water.

The older one (8) is much more stubborn and still refuses to put her face in the water. So she was moved from the stage 3 group into the stage 2 group and has been swimming with a noodle float, despite the fact she can swim 25 metres unaided (with her head out of the water). So as far as the swimming teachers are concerned, they will not move her out of the beginners group because she won't put her face in. Apparently how well or far she can actually swim is irrelevant. She is not learning any swimming technique to make her a stronger swimmer, all the activities they are doing are focussed on putting their face in the water.

So I return to my original thought which is that "swimming lessons" should be called "putting your face in the water lessons." I won't be going back for more, I'll just encourage my kids to actually swim when we go to the pool.

My youngest wasn't overly keen on it at first (started age 3) but the teacher made it a fun game. She does little bits of splashing on their heads and gradually they start looking for mermaids!

They also concentrate on proper swimming technique. As such they swim front crawl which you cannot do without face in and proper breathing techniques.

She is not learning any swimming technique to make her a stronger swimmer, all the activities they are doing are focussed on putting their face in the water

Which is a fundamental part of being a stronger swimmer. If she can't master that she's not going to progress.

All front swimming strokes require your face in the water if you're doing them correctly as this is the most efficient way to swim.

Trying to swim without putting your face in the water is like trying to run without moving your arms. It might appear to not be important, but not doing it severely hampers the efficiency of the process.

You have to be able to put your face in the water or you'll just swim upright and not progress.

A pp said something about how many people actually fall in and drown. I grew up near a river with a fast current. Someone drowned every year at my school from falling in, without fail.

Well OP now your 6yo can put his face in the water he will be able to progress to proper front crawl, breastroke, and the underwater skills. So he has progressed in his swimming ability, whether you want to admit it or not.

Your 8yo is still unable to put her face in, so she will not be able to progress in the way that your 6yo can.

When you sign up for swimming lessons, you are signing up to get them taught how to do correct crawl, breastroke, backstroke and eventually butterfly.

If you aren't bothered, and only want them to be able to make their way across a pool any old how, then save your money.

You wouldn't sign up to tennis lessons and expect them not to teach them how to serve.
You wouldn't sign up for piano lessons and expect them to not teach how to read music.
You wouldn't sign up for maths tuition and expect them to ignore multiplication.

OP you seem to be entirely missing the point here. The swimming teachers can't teach your DD any techniques for any strokes until she can put her face in the water! It is impossible that she can swim "well" until she does.

My DS is a trainee lifeguard and is now trying to learn how to front crawl with his head out and it's really difficult.

I can see your point op. If the whole putting your face thing in is putting a child off lessons a more gentle approach should be taken. My ds hated it and the more he was forced the more scared he became. I had to pull him out of lessons and take him myself until he was confident with putting his face in which we achieved through a lot of playful splashing, wetting hair, practising holding breath without submerging, blowing bubbles with mouth and then finally mouth and nose. My ds hadn't managed to co-ordinate holding his breath and being underwater at first so I'm not surprised he was scared when he was getting a mouthful of water every time. Yet at his swimming lessons he was still expected to jump in and put his face in.

Again, I get that to do 'proper' strokes as if you were going to swim competitively you do need to put your head in. BUT I can swim with my head in and can also swim breaststroke perfectly well with my head out. My friend and I swam miles up and down the school pool this way to use it as an opportunity to gossip 5hilst doing PE. It is totally possible to swim with your head out. It may not be the fastest/best/proper technique but it is actually possible and enjoyable. And enjoyable here is the key, I mainly want my children to enjoy swimming and water play. I don't want or expect them to win any medals for it.

As far as the older one is concerned, here is the 'progress' I feel she has made over the years: scared of the water (baby), enjoyed waterplay (toddler) swimming with swim jacket/noodle floats (ages 2-5), swimming 5 metres (age 5) swimming 10 metres (age 6-7), swimming 25 metres (age 7-8). But presumably, by all your reckoning she cannot possibly have made any progress since she still keeps her head out. So if she gets stronger and is able to swim 100 metres, 200 metres etc, that would still be considered not making any progress and she should still be in a beginners class????