To think most people don't believe their diet will have an impact on their health

[Notcontent]

This is just something I have been thinking about recently. There has been so much in the news about the damage sugar is doing to us, the number of people with type 2 diabetes is rising at a huge rate, more and more kids are becoming fat and having their teeth pulled out, etc.

And yet - I get the feeling most people think it's "nanny state rubbish". On mumsnet threads people always say "children need treats". I was talking to a work colleague about sugary drinks and her view was that water is too boring so she was quite happy for her kids to have juice and cordial with every meal and snack.

I am not sure what the solution is - maybe proper food and health education at schools.

Helena I think kids have too much homework and too many outside activities. People disagree with me, but I don't think an hour at Brownies (driven there and back) in any way replaces the 2 hours playing out after school I used to do. There are hours and hours of activity lost and much less nutritious food going in a lot of the time.

I'm in my 30s and i find the changes quite scary. I got absolutely slated by other mums recently because I "made" my DS (he's 8) walk to school, alone, in the rain. It's a 4 minute walk and people genuine think I'm mean not driving him (& that's before they start about him walking himself). He's got a dreaded project at the moment and the hours he's spent on it should have been spent outside playing imo.

By outside activities I meant after school things rather than just out playing.

Healthy snacks - fruit, chopped salad veg, full fat plain yogurt
If my DD doesn't eat much of her sandwich at lunch I'll give her that back in the afternoon.
Very young/ small children who are very active can struggle to eat large enough quantities in one meal to stick to a 3 meal only structure. Observing my DD she really only eats to her appetite- naturally self regulating. I think people who are naturally slim are often very in tune with their appetite. My DH was always made to finish everything he was served as a child and feels guilty about leaving food. As a consequence he often overeats and struggles a bit with his weight.

Best healthy eating tip is porridge. It has got my cholesterol level down to 4.8

And it's cheap. And satisfying

If everyone ate porridge Britain could be great again.

The root of the problem lies partly with the power of the sugar industry. People have been force fed sugar and have become addicted. It is probably harder to avoid and give up sugar than smoking and hard drugs.

Also portion sizes and general unhealthiness of food on the run. It is quite hard to find something healthy amongst a sea of fatty carby sugary crap, especially if you want something hot.

Omelettes or beans on wholemeal toast are cheap, quick, healthy and easy to prepare. carrots are a good cheap snack. However I remember the outrage when someone suggested that people could have porridge for breakfast.

It is all very complicated and I don't know the answer.

I think the first step is to reduce (ideally remove, but people's taste buds will freak at that) the sugar from the savoury stuff. Bread, cereal being 2 massive culprits, but, and this is crucial, not replace it with artificial sweeteners. Everything now a days is tooo sweet. If savoury became truely savoury, without adding any more salt, the sweet stuff would taste sweeter, so then we can cut sugar out from that.

For me, the worrying thing is sugar is being replaced by sweeteners, when it should just be cut out. And I say this with a massive sweet tooth.

What I don't know is how we keep food affordable, and remove the fructose syrups and other cheep fillers that are used.

We also need to stop the school nonsense that cereal bars are good, but a homemade flapjack or banana muffin is the devil's work.

And try to stop 5 yr olds coming back from school with "vegetables are good Mummy (great), I want to eat nothing but vegetables so I'm super healthy " Que me saying you need bits of everything to stay healthy, and actually if you eat just vegetables is not a great diet for a growing child.

i posted on the overweight kids thread about how primary school kids have lots of homework now and they didnt used to and got my arse handed to me on a plate by certain posters

from what I remember you weren't handed your arse at all. Everyone pointed out that their primary school children (which is who we were discussing) do not get anywhere near enough homework every night, to account for them being sedentary.

My Dd (now is secondary) never got more than about 30 mins, twice a week at primary. Neither did any of her friends that go to other schools. She gets more now but still manages to fit after school clubs (mainly sports ones) and her hobby which is a sport.

We used to live on a very limited budget. Until recently. I can honestly say I found it cheaper to eat healthier. Cakes, biscuits etc are something we buy in when are a bit more flush. I work full time and dh does. We are time poor and have been money poor.

We aren't perfect we do eat crap food now and again. But when we were skint, £1 on donuts was a waste of a pound.

If you choose to spend £3.60 on apples that's your choice. Most people are not making the choice between apples that cost £3.60 and junk.

Desert that is a very good point about added sugar to things that simply don't need it. I am a HCP. It's not the main bit of my job but I do sometimes talk to people about their diet - eg person found to be borderline for diabetes. I ask the question 'do you have much sugar in your diet?'. The answer is often no - I am guessing meaning they don't add sugar to their tea. I then go through what they eat and a lot of the time they are eating things like sugary breakfast cereals, white bread with jam, fruit juices, jarred pasta sauces. They are usually totally amazed to learn those things have a high sugar content. These are generally reasonably intelligent people, they've just never thought about this or they've heard so much of the 'low fat' is good message. I think unfortunately the NHS hasn't always given the best nutrition advice eg low fat everything.

I think it's wrong to assume people make unhealthy choices because of lack of knowledge or understanding.

I think many people know fine but just prefer to eat the crap.

I know about sugar as much as the next man. Still prefer a cake to an apple

I think people struggle with balance. We want our kids to eat healthy, but we don't want them to be scared to have the odd treats as well. My DS's school has banned the kids bringing in cupcakes to celebrate their birthdays. I'm not sure what this is supposed to be teaching them but it certainly isn't balance or a healthy attitude towards food.

Also, sometimes you need to have convenience food, and I say this as someone who loves to cook. And the problem is how much sugar is jammed into any kind of convenience food, be it yogurts or pasta sauce. It's everywhere.

Also, when it comes down to it, there's a lot of conflicting science about what exactly is causing the obesity crisis. Many studies show that as a culture we are actually consuming less calories then 50 years ago, but yet, we continue to get fatter. Putting the blame entirely on individuals is exactly what the food industry wants you to do, so they can keep putting sugar in food as a cheaper way to make it taste good.

I think the biggest issue is moderation, or rather lack of . Overly large portion sizes, with too much carb and protein on the plates in proportion to veg, fizzy drinks throughout the day, reliance on processed foods and sauces. Also the marketing of "diet" and "organic" products as better choices when they contain hidden sugar/substitutes and preservatives. Not enough activity during the day.

Was about to say pretty much what fanjo said.

It's not that Mumsnetters, or others, don't believe it, they are saying 'sod it, life's short, I'll take my chances'.

There is a well known poster here who suffered a terrible bereavement, I always notice her posts as she is very 'your body, your life, you never know what the hell's round the corner, do what you want to do'. Which has always struck me.

Personally I'm somewhere in the middle. I drink a bit too much, I am a bit overweight, I 'treat' myself a bit too much but I eat healthy 80% of the time, excerise and try and avoid processed crap on the whole.

I don't understand the sense of denial though, life's too short I'm going to eat cake! Life is too short but I would prefer an apple! Why not enjoy fresh natural food if you can afford it and it is available? I was really struck while in Amsterdam that the supermarkets were full of fresh fruit and veg and much less bread etc so there is a cultural difference too.

I need to go on a diet. Am about 2 stone overweight.

But what diet do you do? The industry confuses the fuck out of me and I am capable of googling the shit out of stuff.

Lo carbon high fat? Low fat low sugar? But high in carbs (free pasta etc on sw). Count calories? Count points? 5:2, 16:8, paleo, primal, juice diets, meal replacements, cabbage soup.

The list is endless. And you can find positives and negatives for all of them. People that have lost 3 stone in as many months compared to.people who platau at 3 months.

An apple is healthy. Unless you are low carbing. Bread is the devil. Unless it's your healthy b choice. Eat lean meat. But not red meat. Unless you are low carving when it should be a steak with an inch of fat.

It's confusing and contradictory. And that's without trying to work out how much exercise you should do.

A high street fairly local to me in a very poor are has:

Iceland
KFC
Numerous kebab/chip shops
One of those corner shops / supermarkets (McColls, not sure whether it's a national chain or not)
Farmfoods

Quick, cheap, frozen rubbishy food for people likely to be shopping most days and who don't have a car.

It's also an attitude thing - what you're raised on becomes the norm.

People need to stop blaming each other and start blaming food manufacturers who are filling normal food with crap. "Healthy" food has over the years grown and grown and grown in added sugar to the point that it's junk.

It's not so much about education. A person should be able to make the choice to have a bowl of all bran without ingesting 1/3 of their daily sugar limit.

It's the same as anything where the affect is not immediate- smoking, drug taking, global warming, lack of exercise, world resources. You name it. If it doesn't immediately cause an issue people fail to believe it will, or that they have time to do something about it.

I agree. And people seem to be in denial about what damage the lack of activity will do to them. I don't blame people for eating junk comfort food when they're exhausted and stressed through. Menu planning and even batch cooking takes its time.

I just want to take issue with the 6 apples cost £3.60 example. It's up to that poster if she wants to be fussy about her apples but then it's really not fair to use it as an example. (I'm sur if you were fussy about cakes you could find very expensive cakes to prefer over the 6 donuts for £1)
A bag of six gala apples in the sort of tesco yiu find in most town centres is £1.50, £2 at the most. That is not the cheapest option. The same apples in the huge supermarkets are a bit cheaper still.

As a pp said I do think a lot of it is to do with hidden sugar an dd portion size. It is such a complex issue though.

People aren't naturally exercising the way they used to imo. I live in London so rarely take the car and have a ridiculously big pram that's not good for buses but great for the school run. I'm surprised at the amount of my neighbours who drive to school. It isn't the closest school but it's definitely walkable and dd1 has been doing it 4 times a day since she was 3 with the cm (drop to school nursery, collect then big kids school collect)

She has just been weighed by the school and is on the 11th centile. She eats good and bad food.

Sugar may be a killer but our sedentary lifestyle definitely is.

Why blame the food manufacturers? They are not, as someone above said, force feeding us sugar. Very simple - don't buy it! ANY manufactured food will be compromised. Pre-chopped veg and fruit are less nutritious than the whole veg or fruit chopped up and they taste much worse.

The problem is not with food manufacturers - they are simply trying to sell a product and the way to make something which does not intrinsically taste good is to add extras which don't belong there. The problem is a loss of food culture. The loss of the ability to cook basic meals from scratch and the loss of the idea of food being a pleasurable social experience to share. Too much eating-on-the-go and snacking. I have no interest in eating ready-meals or the fake food sold as convenience products because my taste buds have been shaped by eating fresh food. Why eat All Bran? There are many non mass-manufactured foods which can be purchased and made which are just as easy to prepare.

My world view is not of people who don't think diet affects health, but the reverse. It seem to be filled with people who think of food in a Gwenyth Paltrow-esque way - extreme food fads and demonising whole groups of foods. It is equally as unhealthy in my view. Food should not be demonised or sainted, this is a path which will lead to unhealthy relationships.

I think sugar and portion size are the main issues.
My dh has weight issues as do his whole family.

The minute he stops eating sugary snacks and cuts back his portion size the weight drops off him. He doesn't follow any strict diet, just those two things.

It really is that simple, the problem is keeping it off. If he starts eating sugar again, he's back eating far too many calories and the weight creeps back on.

I think most people know really, whether they choose to believe what they know and act on it is an entirely different thing.

I also agree that whilst yes everything in moderation is my motto. My idea of moderation maybe once or twice a week, Is very different to someone else idea, which could be a couple of times each day.

""Young ppl coming out of care are having problems even being housed let alone accessing proper cooking facilities.""

That's a fault of individual SWs and workers, because the Law is clearly written and the budgets are there.

I was discussing this with an former collegue, from when I worked voluntary with people with HIV.

She was saying that the stigma is still there. When people have Cancer their surrounded by family, friends. HIV patients are comparatively unsupported. When collecting for HIV/Diabetes charities, people say the most shocking things about responsibility etc, but attitudes towards Cancer (and other) illnesses, is different.

You could state publicly that you have Cancer, but HIV (and other conditions, Diabetes etc) are still harshly judged.

Even though a lot of Cancers are lifestyle related, so can be Heart Disease, Vascular Issues etc.

I lost five five stone last year, I was continually stopped in the street and told not to over it etc, by neighbours. They seemed shocked that I wanted have the body size that really, I should have.

I don't want to be one of the 50/60 year olds that I see, who are having health/mobility problems, that have been caused by bad diet, lack of movement and smoking.

People don't want to accept the link between their own behaviour and their health, unless it's extreme ie addiction.

We've lost sight of what we should be viewing as everyday food and what is only very occasional, if at all, edible goods and make excuses for doing so. The same applies to activity.