To ask that people consider giving up leather?

[Breadandwine]

I’ve been a vegan for 13 years. My concerns are animal welfare and global warming, plus I feel it's good for my health.

With regard to animal welfare, I have issues with every aspect of animal husbandry - but I have to be honest, until now, I haven’t given much thought to leather. I avoid it, certainly - it took several years of delicate negotiations before I persuaded my wife to accept a faux leather suite instead of the leather one she wanted - but I’ve always thought leather to be a by-product of the dairy industry.

Not so. An article by Lucy Siegle in this morning’s Observer Magazine brought me up short.

Leather production seems to be worse than other forms of animal cruelty in that humans are suffering too:

"Finally the animals are skinned (in front of each other) in the back streets of Dhaka. The skins are processed in makeshift tanneries with workers, including children, knee deep in toxic chemicals."

I own 4 pairs of shoes that cost about £5000 I all. The oldest are 12 years old and the youngest 4. They were all made in Italy by craftsmen paid a wage and the leather is from a group of farms that can be traced. I never buy shit from Primark or New Look and rarely at all. Its the cheap throwaway crap culture that means a lot of stuff is dog skin from China now. I don't boycott leather but I do my absolute best to boycott China wherever possible which is bloody hard.

OP you sound familiar. .do you have an interest in yoni per chance?

I am a vegan (but not yoni just to be clear)

Do you only drink vegan wine?

Yup - I make my own. And my own homemade stout.

But what's that got to do with anything?

YANBU to wish people would give up leather.

YABU to post this in AIBU and expect a reasonable response though! Lots of people here just want to pick a fight. Many won't read the article or engage their brains at all.

People, did you actually read the OP? So you're happy with the child-labour and exploitation of people side of it, then?

Also, no one worried at all about deforestation and the eventual destruction of the habitat that we and our DC rely on to survive?

Or is the survival of the species - our species that is - that just too fucking boring?

YAB naive, interfering and self-righteous more so than U.
HTH

I am a vegan but not yoni

I'm trying very hard not to make a joke around veganism vs eating yoni

took several years of delicate negotiations

This just brings an image of a woman crying into wine saying to her pals 'The best years of my life, Marion! The best years.'

YABU though. I have two pairs of leather boots, one for work and one for at home. My home pair are 6 years old and replaced a pair that had lasted over 10 years. Day in day out wear.

I'll pass on the pleather, thanks.

YABU and YANBU.

Everything we consume, use, buy will be somewhere on the spectrum of ethical resource. We make decisions everyday as consumers which benefit us in many ways - best for family, cost, beliefs etc. Whilst most of us would prefer our consumption to be ethical and fair, it can sometimes be a conflict of interests to opt for the more favourable path.

I detest the farming of palm oil. I avoid buying where possible but if my options of peanut butter is a palm oil free £3.50 option or £1.59 for Tesco own and I need to think about the implication of the cost on my family's finances, it becomes a conflict of interest. (I normally wait for the more expensive palm oil free option to go on offer)

Leather is a great material for hard wearing, long lasting clothes and shoes. in one breath we are told that purchasing cheap is harmful to our environment as people are more inclined to throw away rather than mend and the people paid to make these cheap clothes are paid pittance. I agree with your sentiment; I don't expect the animals are treated very well and the practice may well be dubious.

Whilst it would be great to have a society in which we can purchase everyday things without worrying about the ethical sources of its creation, we are very far away from that.

OP is not wishing people would give up leather, though.

She is asking that we do.

And not telling us quite what we are supposed to replace it.

The alternative to leather, plastic, is extremely bad for the environment. Made from oil, does not biodegrade, will pollute our planet for millions of years. I personally think that plastic is the most unethical substance you could choose for a product. Leather is natural, biodegradable and if treated well can last for years.

If you want to highlight an issue, it's that People should check where the leather comes from and campaign against parts of the industry that are poorly regulated. Not just stop using leather and swap to the environmental disaster that is plastic.

Now that I could really get on board with tootheside.

How did I know the poster would be vegan

Obviously you've not RTFT, StillaChocoholic.

In fact you haven't even read the first sentence in my OP!

She (he?) was asking that we consider it.

I'd also be interested in knowing what we can replace it with, and having an actual discussion about the issue, not just piss-taking.

It's timely for me as our family are pescetarian (veggie + fish) but we do wear leather.

DS asked me what leather was the other day, and when I explained I felt I should really do more to find alternatives.

I had no idea about the exploitation of people side of it though, and I suppose I was still kinda kidding myself that it was a by-product of meat, although tbh I knew this wasn't really true.

Does anyone know any decent alternatives?

Are you not going to answer about any of points about leather alternatives not being great for the environment?

since one of your concerns is global warming?

Where dud you get the faux leather suit, OP? I've been looking for one for years, but most of them are only part faux.

"The alternative to leather, plastic, is extremely bad for the environment."

Is that the only alternative? Are there others?

Does anyone know any decent alternatives?

That's one of the issues. As I said I wear a coat everyday that my dad gave me. It's leather. How many cheaper non leather versions would me and my dad have bought between us in the last 30 years.

I love the coat and feel keeping it and wearing it is far better for the environment (& more ethical) than buying a cheap coat that falls apart within months and needs replacing a lot. Or is out of fashion next year and doesn't see the light of day again.

"People should check where the leather comes from"

According to the article above, even leather labeled "Made in Italy" , maybe only be processed in Italy. It may still have originated in Bangladesh or India and have been produced in exploitative conditions, or in Brazil where the scale of deforestation is a threat to the global environment.

I didn't know that before.

Do plastic sofas last as long as a leather one?

Never liked leather sofas so not looked into it.

curren I don't think there's any issue with wearing second-hand leather, is there?

The way I see it, it's disrespectful to the animal to just bin it.

I think vegetarians and begans are right, and it is good they bring these issues up.

I guess ultimately I am selfish and prioritise my comfort (sheepskin boots) and greed (meat) over animal wellfare and the planet.

Knowing I am wrong, doesnot change my behaviour though. Is it just too ingrained?

I wonder if future humans will look back in horror at us eating animal flesh and covering ourselves in dead animal skin...

I'm vegetarian for various reasons and one of my gripes with the meat industry is how many animals are raised, slaughtered then go to waste because there is too much meat being thrown away. The message I took away from the article is that leather isn't a life-lasting investment piece any more, it's treated as disposable. Same with plastic products, same with lots of other items that we consumers want to see lots of in the shops. The issue isn't giving up leather items that will be used for years and years, it's not treating a product that takes so many resources to produce as disposable and a fad.

curren I don't think there's any issue with wearing second-hand leather, is there?

I don't thinks it's 'disrespectful' to wear leather at all.

But my point is that a leather coat has lasted years, which has less impact on the environment than a non leather coat that doesn't last. Since the op is worried about global warming, that's need to be a consideration.

YANBU to ask - but I wont - Thank you for your concern.