Is it fair to be expected to pay half her Mortgage?

[Tophat72]

Hi there. I'm looking for some impartial comment on what has become a huge issue between my partner and me.

We are both divorcees but although with similar salaries, have very different financial commitments. I have two children I am financially responsible for while she is childless and comfortably well off. She has her own large home and only has 5 years left to pay on her mortgage. I lost my house in my financial settlement with my ex.

I live with my partner in her home. Before moving in with her, I had to sign a legal agreement acknowledging that I have no claim whatsoever on any percentage of the house in the event of our separation. The house is hers and hers alone. Furthermore, I am not catered for in any way in her will. Should she die, the house and her entire estate goes to her sister and nephew...

My partner believes that all the household expenses, including her mortgage payments, should be split 50-50 between us. I however am adamant that given the circumstances, I should not be contributing towards the purchase of her house and I am only prepared to pay for my share of the other household bills (utilities, council tax, groceries etc)

This has become a huge bone of contention between us and sadly things are looking terminal.

Her position is that paying half of her outstanding mortgage should be looked upon by me as paying a modest rent as if she were my landlady. She also quite rightly points out that I am still living very cheaply and if I were to get a place of my own my monthly outgoings would be well over twice what I currently pay her. She feels that I earn the same as her and live under the same roof so I should pay the same.

From my perspective, I have absolutely no objection to going 50-50, but only if she is prepared to afford me some kind of proportionate security or stake in the house in the event of our separation or her death. I don't see why I should contribute 50% towards the ongoing purchase of a capital investment that I have a 0% share in. I feel as though she wants to have her cake and eat it, keeping everything to herself while expecting me to pay for an equal share of, well nothing.

I've tried to write this as objectively as I can. Obviously her friends and family support her position and my friends and family mine. For my own peace of mind, I would be really keen to read the thoughts of a truly neutral observer. Cheers

"I can see how it could grate with you to be paying off her mortgage with no interest in it, but that's exactly how it is if you rent - paying the landlord's mortgage."

Yes, but I'm not in love with my landlord. If I were, I'd expect a different arrangement such as my paying a contribution for my keep, rather than him making a profit out of me (which is what rent is).

Actually, buying into half of the house would be a possibility too, but I really wouldnt advise getting into finances with this woman.

OP sounds like your getting shafted. You mention you have already been paying bills and rent for 4yrs so that means at the end of the mortgage you will have paid 50% of it for 9 years not 5years. 9 years is a big chunk of most mortgages given the norm. them Is only 25years.

I personally wouldn't pay someone else's mortgage and have absolutely security from it. However I'm not sure it's correct that you would leave with nothing.

A friend of mine was in a similar situation as you, moved in with a partner and lived and contributed for 5 years then it went pear shaped and she left his house however she has sued him for all her money back out of the house and she won her case. The part of law she used was under family law section 28 whereby a claim can be made if any economic advantage or disadvantage gained or suffered by either party. "Economic advantage" includes gains in capital, income and earning capacity and "economic disadvantage" is to be constructed accordingly.

She won because the other person was economically advantaged because she contributed to his property, garden and the fabric of the house and left with nothing when he effectively threw her out. She had to provide a copy of all her bank statements etc. showing everything she had paid for the upkeep of the house and the 'rent' she was being charged, how she contributed to all the bills including council tax etc.

I agree with her. Why did you move into their marital home and not somewhere new for both of you to have a fresh start?. I would never feel at home in a place where my partner shared with his ex.

I think the situation is complicated by the fact the OP could buy on his own, so if he wasn't living with his DP, he wouldn't be renting, but paying off his own mortgage. He has none of the rights of being a tenant, all of the downsides, and if he was single, would be in a better long term financial position.

OP - in your case, I'd look at buying a house on my own. This probably would mean moving out unless you can get a buy-to-let (with the rent covering the mortgage repayments, not just interest), so you have your long term security covered - if she complains, point out she's not prepared to give you any financial secuirty and so can't expect you to therefore go without any financial security. (If you have a rental property, make sure if you split up with your DP and moved into it, you'd be able to cover the mortgage yourself).

Your DP doesn't see you as her long term life partner, she sees your relationship has having a 'shelf life', you might as well start planning for the end, as she's already done so. If this means you end it earlier than she'd like, so be it.

You should be paying the equivalent of local market rent for living in that area - i.e. what you'd have to pay to rent a one bed flat, which may be less than half her mortgage, but is fair

Well for it to be fair the OP would then need a rental agreement giving the same protection that tenants get, which isn't much is better than the OP currently has. He would also need to have the benefits of a 1 bed flat - i.e. a lot of space to himself. Again, he isn't getting that, he's getting shared living space.

I'm just puzzled. If you love someone enough to live with them, then why leave them so insecure? And if you can help them out, then why not? I don't mean help out by giving him a stake in her house, but help out by making life a bit easier financially than it would be if they weren't together.

Once the mortgage is paid off they'll both benefit from reduced living expenses.

I think part of the issue that makes it hard to find a fair position, is that there is no genuine pooling of financial resources as you would normally see in a long term relationship. If there were a genuine pooling of resources then it does not matter who pays for what as any surplus goes into shared savings.

In the circumstances that you both find yourself in, both coming to the relationship with vastly different assets, the only way you can determine a fair position is by negotiation and it may help you to get some external mediation to work through this.

I don't think it is fair for you and your children to live in her house without making a contribution to housing costs but can see that measuring this contribution by reference to her mortgage does not feel fair either.

Might it be possible for your housing contribution to be paid into a joint account to be used to fund holidays and/or other treats? So it seems less like her benefiting directly but rather both of you building up some genuinely shared financial resources?

She sounds very sensible to me, and why don't you use some of your money to buy something as a buy to let and build up wealth if that's what you want to do?

You are paying rent, not contributing to the mortgage, you've signed a legal agreement about it - and contributing to your own cost of living. If you don't like it anymore then move out.

OP, stop living with her, offer her chance to buy a new place 50:50 with you and rent out her own place. Why should you get a share of her property because you're currently in relationship with her? Why should you live rent free? Much better for your relationship to both have equal standing, isn't it?

I've seen this the other way round - man asking woman to pay towards mortgage with no benefits. The answer's no either way.

You pay 50% of bills and house maintenance (within reason) - ie not half of an extension.

I would call her bluff and tell her you'll get your own place with a mortgage.
It's irrelevant that costs would be higher because you'd end up with something to show for your investment. Don't throw money away on 'rent'.

Bottom line is what would she be paying if you weren't there. She shoudn't be profiting from being in a relationship with you.

Maybe she doesnt want her asset to be ultimately inherited by someone else's dc rather than by her own family. In paying less than market rate, he could at least save some money for his future but seems to be choosing not to have the financial hardship and sacrifice that would entail, while still wanting a share of hers.

You haven't said how much you are paying towards the mortgage and if its a reasonable amount as compared to a house share in your area. However, if I were you and in a position to buy something little then that's probably what I would do so that hopefully, at the end of the day, you have something to leave your children and a place they can come to more than 2 days in 10 rather than contributing towards something someone else's sister and nephew will benefit from.

I can see why she is protecting herself but you need to wise up and think things through.

I meant to say I totally agree with Bogeyface.

It sounds like you are in a crappy relationship with a mistrustful commitment-phobe, OP. Personally, I would leave her and find someone else, so that she can enjoy her property all by her lonely self.

You pay a bit extra to cover the costs of your children's food whilst they are staying with you and your DP?

Bloody hell.

You may love her very much, but I'm sorry OP, it sounds as if she has thought about this coldly and in a calculated way and it stitching you up. Either that, or she is so damaged by a previous relationship that she is unable to trust others.

My mum's partner - now husband - moved in with her after they'd been together a very short time. Once they were married, she had a legal agreement drawn up staying that if she were to die, he could live in the house until he died, but it would then pass to me and my siblings. Their situation was/is a bit different, because my mum's house was mortgage free so he didn't pay "rent", just a share of the bills - the mortgage was cleared when my dad died - but is something like that an option? My mum's husband also covered things like holidays, dinners out and so on because he was effectively living rent-free.

if you can afford a place and you said you can just, then buy, rent it out and you will have security if this relationship fails

if you got married and she died would the house still go to her relatives - or would you get a % of it

i think you both need to talk to an ifa and see what they suggest regards to you paying towards her mortgage and you get a % if you split up

fairest way is probably for her to rent out her home and it goes to her family as and when

and you both buy together and start again

or she sells her home, puts in deposit on a place but if you split and sell then she gets the % deposit back and then remainder is 50% split to you both

Yes I do think she is being very mean if she expects you to pay more to cover the cost of your dc visiting.

I honestly think you would be happier if you moved out and got a smaller place of your own.

I agree with you OP

I think this is all about terminology.

You are actually a lodger in her house. You're contributing to the household 'bills' - not one specific thing e.g the mortgage.

My partner lives with me and my 2 children. He gives me an amount each month to cover the bills. His name isn't on my mortgage or any other bills (except he is named on the council tax form) he basically contributes to the bills I have, he doesn't pay them, I do!

My solicitor advised me to keep everything strictly separate. If my partner contributes to home refurbishments or helps to lay a patio etc then he would be within his rights to ask for that money back if we were to separate.

My solicitor also said that maybe over time I may feel that I would want my partner to receive a % of my property on my death, especially if we remained together for a considerable amount of time.

It's a very difficult situation when 2 people come together but the balance of what they own in property isn't the same.

Of course you could marry her and get half of everything - unless she made you sign a pre-nup of course!!

Are you sure it's a loving relationship or are you just a tenant/lodger with benefits to her? She could make provisions for you to have a small share of the house equating to a percentage of what you've paid towards the mortgage and still leave the bulk of it to her family. If you do part ways then she just amends the will back to what it was. I think she sees this relationship differently to you

if you can afford a place and you said you can just, then buy, rent it out and you will have security if this relationship fails

He'd still be forking out for 'rent' he shouldn't be paying.

I understand why she wouldn't want him to have an interest in the house, but the corollary of that is he pays no mortgage.

She can't have it both ways, or rather all her own way.

If you have the means then if your relationship is to be fair I think you should get the option to buy into the property for your security. But to me that would mean 50/50 ownership at current market value and you would need to find the cash/your own mortgage to buy your half of the house. If you can't contribute equally, then paying "rent" is fair.

If you are paying rent any home improvements/maintenance your dp must finance.

Alternatively can you suggest she sells and you go 50/50 in a new joint property?

I'm guessing she's already had to buy her ex out of the property, I completely understand why she won't risk doing that again.

Pooled finances are all very well when you're starting out with someone who you're going to have a family with, when your older and already have assets it's completely different. There's no way I'd move in with someone and step off the property ladder and also no way I would put someone on my mortgage or give them a share of it, my assets go to my daughter.

She's having her cake and eating it.

Move out into your own place.