To avoid this mum? (Yes, a school gates dilemma)

[Campaspe]

I hang out with a group of mums. Our kids play together at times, and we socialise together. One other mum makes me uneasy. She seems awkward and lacking in social skills, and I felt a bit sorry for her as she seemed friendless. She seemed to latch onto me a bit, and our DDs became friends. I found her a bit boring, and a bit snide at times, and tried to see her only as part of the group.

Our DDs have had some friendship problems recently, typical 9 yo girls blowing hot & cold with it. I've kept a discreet eye on it, but I'm trying to let DD figure it out alone as much as possible.

Other mum tried to text me about it, and I advised her we should ignore etc etc. Since then, things have felt awkward between us. To make it worse, DD's teacher phoned me to say this mum has been in (the implication was to complain about my DD & the friendship issues). Other mums have told me this mum regularly visits the school, & my DD seems upset & puzzled by this. From what I can see, their friendship is up & down, no bullying is going on, & my DD is left on her own whilst this other child plays with other children. All fair enough.

I'm polite to this mum, include her in group stuff, avoid conversions if I can politely do so, but feel I want nothing much to do with her. However, I feel guilty as she stands alone if I don't explicitly invite her to join the conversation, and the other mums aren't keenkeen to get caught by her.

Aibu to restrict our relationship in this way, and why do I feel both guilty & manipulated by her at the same time?

Oh! We certainly weren't patting ourselves on our backs and thinking good on us! It's very unsettling when another child moves schools or classes and can be unsettling for parents, too.

In any case, my post wasn't about your child or your situation or anyone else's really. My post was simply there to empathise with OP as I just wanted to say it reminded me of this particular mum who also had form for this. As it happened, the child she moved was actually quite a dominant character and, from what DD and some of her friends intimated, it sounded six of one. The child was not all that happy to be moved initially either. DD and her were quite upset as they were really close. In addition, the mum moved her elder child from her secondary school, too, because she felt she was not fitting in. When I saw the girl a few years later - in a pt job at my work, as it happened - she was happily chatting to her old friends from the old school who also worked there. The mum often proudly announced that she had no qualms about involving herself in her daughter's disputes. I've met a few like this is DS's year. There is one going in all guns and everyone avoids her. Sometimes she has a point and things do need to be dealt with but it's the way she does it and it's all the time and her son, you can tell, finds it very difficult to stand up for himself because his mum is always there. Sometimes you do have to intervene, yes, and I have done but always discreetly and always when other avenues have failed.

I don't think they learn anything from mum getting involved to a high level unless really out of hand. Dd s teacher as much as told her recently they didn't like to involve themselves unless it is out and out bullying.

There is a LOT teachers can do below the radar - and in the best schools, they do - one of the many, many ways in which excellent teachers are underrated, IMO. The kids won't ever know it, but the help will be consistent.

The mum often proudly announced that she had no qualms about involving herself in her daughter's disputes.

That's idiotic, I agree. Hardly models maturity, plus risks molehill to mountain.

I agree. They can do a general talk, which I know they did at DD's previous school. I always give DD some gentle guidance if she is having problems and have no qualms about telling her if I think she's in the wrong but not all parents are like that and my point is that there are lots of parents who think their child can do no wrong, which is tempting but you have to be objective.

Yeah, when you clarified I understood what you meant.

The problem is, I think, that a parent who is blind to their child's wrongdoings can manifest as inappropriately hands-on or inappropriately hands-off - it's getting the balance right that is hard.

I would be horrified if I thought teachers in a school were passively waiting for a situation to escalate to "out and out bullying" without doing anything which might help avoid that escalation.

Yes, you do see that. A parent with an obvious bully and just says 'kids, huh?' Equally wrong.

It wasn't like that. I had a meeting with DD's teacher (she's on this programme because she is so behind) and she was talking about friendships and some of the issues she has but he was really quizzing her as to what they were and asking for examples. All of them were just little niggles (to me as well - small things like children not saying hello to her when she had) and he said he would not get involved unless it escalated to something more.

But I can see how it sounds written down here.

I was worried other mum might be me too!

You don't have to speak to her or be friends if you don't want to, of course. I think the attitude of being inclusive is a good model for your DD as others have said.

I don't think she is wrong going to the teacher if her DD is upset. It's up to the teacher how she handles it, but she shouldn't be making anyone upset without good reason and your DD shouldn't be left out as a result.

Maybe bring this up with teacher at a convenient moment. There might be a side to things you are unaware of.

Yes, these social lessons and skills do need to be learned, but that doesn't have to mean abandoning the children to sort it out in the playground amongst themselves.

I agree. I was bullied at school and it was rare to be given help or support from a teacher. The effects lasted years.