To think that *some* people paying for healthcare *some* of the time would be no bad thing.

[manicinsomniac]

I am a big fan of the NHS and think it would be terrible if we lost it.

However, I think we could help prevent that happening by it being not quite so free as we are accustomed to, iyswim.

I had to go to my GP today for help with my totally avoidable and self inflicted health condition. I was given an appointment just 3 hours after phoning and the doctor was calm, non judgmental and extremely helpful. I am independent adult with a good, full time job.

I can't see why I, and people like me, shouldn't pay a token amount towards GP appointments, just like we do for the dentist. Even just £10-£15 a visit could make a huge difference on a national scale, surely.

Obviously if you are a) poor b) have an illness or disability that requires frequent appointments c) are a child or d) need expensive treatment/care then the NHS is vital and must remain free.

But I don't see the need for this 'free at the point of use' thing for all people in all situations. If you can pay for standard, infrequent appointments then I think it would be fine to be made to.

AIBU?

solomon2003 i didn't ask to be ill.
I didn't ask to have a disability and i certainly didn't ask for an illness that could kill me at any time.

Not everybody has family near them, or friends ( or has nice neighbours!!)or money.
I couldn't get mad for an oap if they were stuck.

lampy i don't blame you, I've waited 2and half hours before for my app.

What a load of bollocks

I work in the nhs.

Baaaaaad idea. Totally slippery slope and will cost the nhs more on health issues via avoidance. It'll also increase visits to a&e to avoid charges

Both have huge cost implications to the wider nhs.

Dreadful idea. Because the very young and elderly (who cost the NHS most) and of which many could afford to pay, would be exempt, and the minority in the middle would be the ones charged and continue to subsidise these groups as we do already with prescriptions etc.

And Lampygirl, as a practice nurse let me tell you that most of the time appointments run behind because patients are booked in with one issue and turn up with several. An everyday occurrence.

I don't understand why some people think it would be a bad idea due to visiting A&E to avoid paying or people not going - if we are only charging people who are in the sort of income bracket where they can afford to spend thousands on a naice bottle of wine then why would they go to the trouble of squirming out of a £100 doctors appointment fee? That kind of money is nothing to them.

^ it's not like I / we are proposing charging everyone on more than £40k or something!

CPtart. Is it my imagination then that practice staff are seen looking desperately for a parking space at 9.10 when their first appointment was at 9am? It rather helps I venture if the first appointment starts on time.

Remembers HV who sent me a letter when I had a newborn and arrived at 8.54, telling me she was coming at 9am on the same day. She arrived at 9.22. No excuse for the lateness. No excuse for not picking up the phone the day before. If I'd known I had 28 minutes rather than six, I'd either have fed the baby in my dressing gown or had time to get dressed. Either way I'd have been more empowered and she would have exercised a modicum of respect fir my dignity and my time.

Well that's not acceptable.
I was at my desk working at 8.40 this morning and I only get paid from 9am.
I would guarantee there are far far more patients turning up with several issues in a single appointment than the odd member of staff coming in late.

One example of why there is such massive wastage in the NHS....

I know someone who used to work in admin heading a team of roughly 25 staff who were sending out pre written appointment letters where you just fill in the blank fields (the staff were also earning above minimum wage). Some team members complained that the target number of letters per day was too many. There were meetings and reviews and the new target was set to be that of the average team output. Still people complained so the target was revised to that of the lowest achieving team member, which was 10 letters per day, where only the blank name & address fields need to be filled in, so just over 1 per hour. Management found this target system easier than trying to re allocate staff to different roles. no wonder there is so much NHS wastage.

Tax people more and they will simply stop working, then there will be no one to pick up the bill.

lol, ur funny, also very wrong.

Go on irretating. Tell us why that's so wrong?

If you want more people to die of cancer than introducing a charge for GPs visits would work perfectly for this goal.

I think there should be charge for missed appointments. In my doctors practice there is a sign up showing the number of missed appointments in the previous month and it is always several hundred every month. At a time when people struggle to get appointments it isn't acceptable and I think a charge would discourage people from just not turning up.

Go on irretating. Tell us why that's so wrong?

There's no evidence to support the view that increasing taxes causes increased unemployment. At most there may be a slight disincentive to do extra work but that's about it. It's ludicrous to believe that a higher rate tax payer would rage quit their job because of a slight increase in tax.

CPtart oh I am really really sorry that my 85 year old Dad takes up the NHS budget which apparently YOU are having to pay for, of course its self inflicted isn't it for fucks sake working for 70 years until he was 84 and paying TAX, lugging heavy cleaning equipment around until he was too ill with a heart condition and needing a hip replacement to carry on , well he is bound to be a drain on NHS resources isn't he? ( oh did I mention he paid into this country for 70 years ) YOU Madam are not subsidising my Dad he has paid in enough .

And of course you mentioned the young many rich families are quite able as well to pay for their children who get free prescriptions up to age 18 in full time education.

Most elderly people haven't paid in for 70 years and work until they're 84. There will always be exceptions to the rule. Madam.

Thanks for all your thoughts; really interesting reading.

I think the donation idea probably sounds the most sensible, on balance, given the slippery slope argument and the people being put off going argument.

Just wanted to clarify again that I was not trying to differentiate between self inflicted and non self inflicted illness/injury. I should never have mentioned it. It was purely the fact that my problems are my fault that made me think about it in the first place - in a 'my goodness, I should be so grateful that the govt will pay for my shit choices and, as I can afford to, should I not be paying?' kind of way. Not that I should pay because of the reasons behind the appointment. Sorry again for the confusion.

I am actively considering registering with a private GP as it is pretty much impossible to get an appointment with our practice. I spoke to the practice manager after I spent 3 days phoning twice a day for an appointment only to be eventually referred to an out of hours service 10 miles away. She apologised but said that it was only going to get worse as they couldn't find enough GPs to cover the practice. Much to their horror I self diagnosed and cured my chest infection with antibiotics bought from an online pharmacy. Not ideal, but better than a 10 hour flight and a week working abroad whilst ill. Fortunately I know enough about antibiotics to pick the right ones

some people never work at all....and never pay anything in.....all those single mothers with loads of kids....whats gonna happen to them when they get to 70 and havent ever worked and paid NI and taxes.....oh yeah, someone else who has worked all their life and paid in, who happens to drop dead from exhaustion on their retirement day will pay for them!

my point is you cant blame the elderly anymore than you can blame single parents, people who have never worked or even the disabled.....we are all in this together....its the government that needs to step up and stop the billions in aid to all and sundry and to start supporting its own people first!

CPtart OK then my pensioner DH who worked for 45 years and still pays tax, my pensioner BIL worked for 43 years and still pays tax, myself not a pensioner for 5 years who will have paid in for 51 years when I get my pension and will still be paying tax until I die

Not 70 years I grant you but enough to have paid a significant amount towards our health care

I have just recalled an NHS manager. She organised the Christmas Fayre with aplomb (primary school - raised £4k). And regaled us all with her tales of delegation and how one if her administrators did all the legwork .

Too much piss taking in a state funded service.

irritating why would people with vast amounts of money be put off paying a small (from their perspective) fee to go to the doctors? We are talking about people for whom £100 (charge for a 10 minute appointment for a private GP) is an utter irrelevance? Not just higher rate tax payers or similar.