To think that this is the end of women's athletics?

[fidel1ne]

And women's international sport generally?

Transgender competitors will be allowed to compete as the gender of their choosing pre-operatively and after just one year of hormone treatment.

Just reposting the link for the FB group.

www.facebook.com/groups/ATWIWS/

You'd think, if transwomen were genuine allies of women, they'd be keen to compete in men's events, as transwomen. I'm imagining a transwoman, with massive hair, fabulous gel nails, a muscular physique and a great rack, stampeding down the track and beating a bunch of men. If the genuine goal was to dismantle gender stereotypes and liberate us all from the confines of the gender hierarchy, that would be a fantasically powerful image.

Of course, that's not what it's about at all. The genuine goal is validation of self, not validation of women. So I think that the image we will see instead will be the transwoman, hair, nails, rack and all, pulverising natal women and not giving a shit.

Incidentally, there is a place for trans-women to compete, where classes could be designed specifically to suit them perfectly. The para in Paralympics comes from 'parallel', the term is not to do with disability. It is to do with equivalent but different, parallel.

This decision is utterly bonkers. Are we now in a parallel universe?

What is going on?

This could well have an impact on male athletes as well.

I have a relative who reached the top of their game in an Olympic sport. To do so they had to sacrifice a normal life; getting up at silly o'clock so they could train before school, watching every single thing they ate, not taking part in certain other sports in case of injury, training after school plus every weekend. You cannot underestimate the impact not just on their life but their family's too.

Compare their schedule though to one of their competitors from another country - think China, Russia etc - and it was a walk in the park.
As Brits we do the "It doesn't matter if we lose, it's the taking part that matters" thing quite well, so I would guess that people who are for the new ruling are maybe thinking everyone else is as sporting as we are.

How long before the very best male athlete from a particular country is actually given female hormones completely against their will because their government thinks it's better for them to win as a woman than come third as a man?

I'm a little worried about posting the link to the FB group on here, as there are certain trans activists who take pleasure in joining these groups and posting screenshots and doxxing the members on Twitter.

Wow. This is a truly bizarre decision. I don't understand the reasoning, since sport always effectively "discriminates" against people on the basis of merit, with a level playing field decided by physical characteristics and biological categories. As someone said upthread, this is a political decision, not a biological or a physiological one. I mean, I would love to be an Olympic rower, and my heart aches and I feel excluded knowing that I can't row for shit, and will never be an Olympian, so perhaps I should be allowed in the Olympic team, just because I feel discriminated against, and that's not fair? I can, however, see just fine, but I kinda identify as blind, so I should now be allowed in the Paralympics competing against blind athletes: I mean, I'll wear an eyepatch on one eye, just to fit in. FFS. Ridiculous.

There were two distinct schools of though on that Calla. I do know what you mean.

I'd love to go in the wheelchair sprinting in the paralympics. However i cant self-propel, so i'll be doing it in a powerchair!!

I made the mistake of trying to search for the group rather than clicking on the link. It really opened my eyes to how many men have a vested interest in stopping women participating in sport, calling them ridiculous, insisting that women can't do sport properly, threatening to cancel TV subscriptions if channels don't stop showing women's sports.

This is what we're really fighting against, isn't it? It just has a convenient new excuse that sounds liberal and right on but the end result will be the same - women taken off the playing field and put back in their place.

YY One. We're being put back in our place remarkably successfully.

Just to address that we know there's some concern about the FB group linked to and whether it's safe to post there. Just to reassure that the settings are locked down and all requests to be added are being looked at carefully. We were adding quite quickly at the beginning so will take a look back through those again. I think it's as secure as it can be and there's some good discussion and ideas coming out of it so far .

👍

The social blowback they feel would result from being marked as a Bad Person on account of having Bad Views. This state of affairs is a major part of the problem. No-one should feel afraid to say what they think, or we are heading into very troubling territory indeed.

Still catching up on RTFT but wanted to agree with the above. A FB friend posted something yesterday about transgender rights and all I posted was this

I did not support it when Fallon fox was outed as trans in womens MMA fighting. After beating many women very badly. And still people support Fallon. Its so crazy that so many women support male to trans playing in female sports. I do not think it is fair. I think men have a different bone structure that they are built differently. Even if they choose to invert their penis . That does not chance the advantages they have over women in sport... I say no.. If you were born a man. You have no place in womens sport.. And Those who try and pretend they were always women or they are women. are in denial. We are not the same. And it is pretty shitty to tell women we are the same a men who identify as women..

Why not let Otherkins join in horse racing... Let transabled join in special Olympics..

Why not let Otherkins join in horse racing

I know a MTT (not a friend but have seen this person at events) who has a shortish (for a man) very average non-athletic build. This person is now competing in an amateur sport with some excellent and incredibly fit women who have trained for years. Got a first place in their first event in the older age range.

FFS!

It doesn't surprise me Flora - one of my friends is a guy who is 5'4" to my 5'8", weighs 8 stone to my 10, spends most of his time sat on computer games whilst I train regularly, and the sod is stronger than me.

Now fortunately I'm not representative of elite female athletes and he's not inclined to compete as a woman to win anything (that I'm aware of!) but it just shows that regardless of all other factors, the very fact of being a man confers an absurd amount of competitive advantage.

Oh wow! Thank you to the poster who linked to the "science of changing sex" and to venus for the earlier link!

I'm just half-way through, but feel so relieved to find an explanation why there is so much aggression towards any tentative suggestion that we should question to open women's spaces to MtF transwomen (autogynephilic). This paragraph was a true eye-opener:

"To understand the vehemence of the backlash ... You have to understand ine more thing. ... The ultimate eroticism of autogynephilia [natal man who finds it sexually arousing to be a woman] lies in the idea of really becoming or being a woman, not being a natal male who desires to be a woman"

Why isn't this stuff mainstream public knowledge??

Have a read of this:

www.lifesitenews.com/news/psychiatry-expert-scientifically-there-is-no-such-thing-as-transgender

Going off topic, what about hospitals? I wouldn't be happy at all with being put in a hospital bed next to a biological man.

Thank you solomon.
I am actually pro-choice and am therefore wary with information on such sites, although I acknowledge that they are quoting a psychiatrist.

As a left-liberal feminist, I find it difficult to put across my reservations against unconditional opening women's spaces to all Transwomen without being draggef into the conservative (far-)right corner.