to ask if you see a problem with modafinil/'smart' drugs

[manicinsomniac]

My work is absolutely crazy at the moment - looking like 80ish hour weeks all term, maybe more, and I'm also a single mum of 3 girls and they have a lot of activities etc they need to be at. I was really struggling. I often don't sleep well, find it really difficult to work and organise myself when I am stressed and have (very well controlled, long term and functionable with) anorexia.

A couple of weeks ago I started taking modafinil and it has literally changed anything. I am fully awake, alert, energised and enthusiastic about life from 8am to 2am. I am getting so much done and absolutely loving my job. It's gone from seeming like something I wanted to do but that I couldn't achieve and was going to drag me down and drown me to something that is really full on and intense but also fulfilling and exciting. I can't get enough of it. And I have energy left over for my family and their needs to.

But I know logically that these pills should be 'a bad thing'. I'm only taking them 4 days out of 7 (break at weekends and mid week) so I can get a bit more sleep on those nights but I don't know if there's some major down side I'm not seeing.

Has anyone else taken these? Positive or negative experiences and/or opinions?

Deep down I'm thinking I must be an idiot for doing this but life is good! So confused. AIBU to be taking them?

Whois, you mean on MN? Just looking up nootropics, a whole new world to me.

I've used it. Modalert iirc. It was ok but I wish I had had access to brand Provigil instead.

I remember it made my pee foul!

No, whole forums dedicated to discussing different types, dosage, usage patterns, combinations etc.

Don't know if I can post links to them really?

I personally found M made me very task focused and I Just Wanted To Get This Done and it was ok for logical thinking but not good for anything requiring creativity. I also found the crash quite intense. I think that would be easier to manage with better eating and sleeping but I tried it over 2 weeks in an 'emergency work situation' where I was at work till 3 every night and back in for 8. So it's hard to separate the impact of the M or just of the crazy work schedule.

DP didn't like M at all - no improvement in alertness or concentration over caffeine and got more of the edgyness than with caffeine.

I've no idea if this is true but someone told me it's because it's popular with recreational drug users. Apparently it would be less limited at the doctor if it wasn't abused so frequently.

By its very nature diazepam will always be abused - it's addictive and has a long half life. It relaxes your muscles and helps you sleep. It calms you down and makes you feel good. So many reasons for people to keep taking it!

Recreational drug users like it because it helps them sleep after a session of using 'uppers' like Coke. Chills them out and helps them sleep. Also nice taken in doses exceeding medical uses as a recreational drug in its own right.

Whois, I've been known to go into that mode just because, but only ever in summer!

lorelei9 yeah it's so nice eh? Only a couple of times when I had like a week off work and no responsibilities (and in the summer). Reduced to a 'wow I feel amazing' state / sleep / wake and want to eat / want to hug kiss have sex / sleep / eat / sex / sleep / eat / have sex.

Unfortunately it takes me about 2 weeks to get back to feeling normal again so I don't think I'll ever have something like that in me life again. Maybe when I'm retired :-)

Ugh typos

Cocaine would have the same effect. Sure, it's illegal but that's the only difference between that and what you're taking its dodgy, you don't know what you're taking and the long term effects are unknown. I'd be very careful.

To be fair Whois, not knowing what you are buying was only one point of concern raised by posters on this thread. Having to rely on a drug to cope with your lifestyle and taking a prescription drug without medical supervision have been the other two themes.

Working 80 hours a week and having only 6 hours rest in a 24 period isn't sustainable - a crash is inevitable.

Modafinil looks, at least short-term, better than cocaine in terms of being less addictive/other profiles.

It does, on the surface, look like a 'smart smart drug' (and I quite like the idea of being smarter, so almost tempted)

But, we've been through these 'wonder drug' phases before, with Valium (much much better than the old sleeping drugs- then found out it has huge addictive potential and terrible withdrawal syndrome), with anti-depressants ('they work, they work'- oh actually for most low/moderately depressed people they don't).

I was reading a paper yesterday on Modafinil in patients with brain conditions/impairment, and on every measure it worked (more alert, better concentration)- but so did the placebo! So, yet again, the inert sugar pill helps people feel less tired and be their better selves. Might go back to homeopathy (only joking!)

I'm not sure this helps the OP, as there are very good reasons not to mess with your stability by taking substances if you have a history of eating disorders/compulsive behaviour (e.g overwork) but I find the whole area of cognitive enhancement fascinating.

Also, they may be legal to purchase now (from what others have said, not sure of their legal status) but once the new Psychoactive Substances Bill becomes law, they won't be unless someone manages to convince them to make an exemption (such as for coffee, tea, alcohol, nicotine).

I take something else for ADHD inattentive type. It was made clear to me that the medication, which helps enormously, was not a substitute for better work/life/sleep habits, but additional to them, so I should use some of my time on medication to try and build in organisation and good habits. If you want to try this, I can recommend reading 'The Organised Mind' by Daniel Levitin.

The not sleeping is a massive no no, irrespective of taking modafinil or anything else. By disrupting your sleep that drastically, you will impair your cognitive ability. Before long, you won't be getting a cognitive boost from the modafinil, it will just be bringing you up to (almost) normal.

Working 80 hours a week and having only 6 hours rest in a 24 period isn't sustainable - a crash is inevitable

Yes, I do not disagree. Remember that many people do work those kind of hours tho, but they generally get paid enough to make it worth their while. I don't consider a teachers salary to be worth those kind of hours.

but I find the whole area of cognitive enhancement fascinating it really is - so much interesting reading on different substances and different stacks.

To be honest though I find a strong black coffee works well enough for me when I need to get things done.

Also OP, on legal status, modafinil is a prescription only medicine but is not controlled by the Misuse of Drugs Act. I think that means it is not illegal for you to buy it from an online site registered overseas, but you would be committing an offence if you gave it to anyone else.

whois I once tripped all the way home on the bus off several strong filter coffees in a row when I was 16 (and too polite to say I didn't drink coffee). I have never drunk caffeinated coffee since.

Bit confused why people think OP is a teacher
I'd have guessed a job with commission myself, or something similar.

Maybe the reference to 80 hour weeks all term?

The Op talked about 'terms' so my guess was teacher or academic?

My job is very much make of it what you want to and the more you put in the more I find you get out. Plus the things I choose to do require lots of hours or they wouldn't be as successful.

That plus 80 hour weeks and references to term time screamed teacher to me (having been a teacher).

It says term and beyond so i was thinking of it as a reference to balancing busy-ness with the DC. I don't really get a sense of academic or teacher. Just a guess.

I didn't want to admit to being a teacher because I was scared of all the people who'd say it was disgraceful that I could consider myself fit to be responsible for children etc. But let the term time thing slip. Yes, I'm a teacher. Believe me, it's not marking or planning that's filling my time though, I am perpetually behind with these things! I teach performing arts as well as an academic subject so it's productions, scholarship prep, extra curricular lessons/exams, clubs, dance classes, choirs, gymnastics etc.

I'm going to try and do something about it though, honestly. It's probably purely psychological but, although I have been super productive and energised all day and didn't even need to think about taking a break till I got home about half an hour ago (boarding school), I am now convinced I've got a cold, shaky left arm and fluttery feelings in my chest. I don't I'm sure (or if I do it's because I demonstrated some stupid dance choreography in a rehearsal earlier with about 100 spins and a forwards death drop where I landed on my wrist). But I've been thinking about this thread all day and it's starting to seem like it just isn't worth the risks.

I'm either going to the doctor to see if I can do this safely or I'm looking for another way.

Reddit is the best place for opinions on this. I take it daily have tried lots of things as have cf. I envy people who can get wired on caffeine as it has no effect on me even when I've eaten caffeine pills like smarties

Manic, I'm glad you told us. Because if you said you were getting commission and wanted to max it out for a couple of months and then you'd stop the drug, I could understand that. But there doesn't seem anything to stop this being a permanent thing.

I'm a bit fascinated that you said it was the kind of job where the more you put in the more you get out, because I'd only apply that to money or opportunities to make more money! That's me though.

I don't know about these nootropics so I can't offer any useful advice, other than expressing concern about how sustainable this is. Is it the kind of drug where you will eventually need more to get the same effect? Also, won't your immune system need more rest, especially if you're working in a school..?

Op, please get your last post removed. It makes you very identifiable and there are people out there who would use it to hurt you x