To ask what UK parents really think of school uniform

[longtimelurker101]

Relating to the thread on school uniform and hair dying. What do parents really think? Do you support the idea or would you prefer that schools across the U.K went non-uniform and had no rules regarding appearance?

I agree with uniforms. However I don't think schools should be allowed to insist upon certain jumpers, blazers etc that have school logo on so it ends up costing a fortune. All basic stuff can be brought relatively cheaply from supermarkets, M&S etc which is great, but our jumpers alone for primary school cost £15 - £20 each which still makes it very expensive. They could just have a basic school sweatshirt from a supermarket. The colours are ok but they don't have logo on so we have to go to specialist supplier.

and sometimes they need help as we are in such a rush in the mornings and both tend to dawdle, which would be the same whatever they were putting on!

No, I mean the time taken is the same for a polo shirt as a T shirt, and greater if it is a button up shirt and tie - so even the quickest uniform item is not a time saver, its just the same.

The kids used to occasionally demand clothing item X or Y (at the weekend or on a school day) but things go into the wash each eve and I wash them, fold them into a separate basket for each child and return them to their rooms for them to put away themselves (4 yo with my help), so they are very well versed on the roughly 3 day cycle of wear and wash and capable of not being repeatedly baffled by the fact the items they put in the wash basket yesterday will take a day or two to re-appear, and the fact that wearing the same item every day would look as if they'd put yesterday's dirty stuff back on anyway, so no - they don't ask, because they know.

Ha ha ha, Now I really know you're talking bullshit!!!

I've got one DC in a uniform school, one not. I prefer uniform but not UK and uniform is more practical here (no blazers, open neck shirt, no ties, unisex fleece, they wear sports kit all day on PE days). Let's just say DD's idea of task and weather appropriate are not the same as mine.

I'm absolutely no trixy why would I be ? Because my kids understand that laundry isn't done instantly? Because my school age kids are capable of taking a T shirt out of their cupboard and pulling it over their head? Because nothing needs ironing so can be folded out of the dryer/ line in summer and shoved into their room in a basket? What is bullshit about that? That is normal...

My kids don't really own inappropriate clothing, unless you mean summer clothing in winter, which there isn't room for in the cupboard so it is in a basket on top of the wardrobe... They own jeans and tracksuit bottoms and T shirts and fleeces...

Schwab, do you have teenage girls?

only ask because DS, and DD until very recently, would have been exactly as you describe... but DD is now VERY different, and genuinely really cares about what she wears and how she presents herself each day.

My kids don't own any inappropriate clothing either. It hasn't stopped them going out in a tunic which is meant to be worn with leggings with nothing underneath or in pyjamas (that was DH). I can assure you that having a strop when a favourite item is not available is normal, expecting school age kids to be rational enough in the morning to be aware of the three day washing cycle is absolutely hilarious.

I have a pre teen girl and an upper primary age boy, and a 4 yo boy.

I make them put their own laundry in the wash and then put it away so they are aware of how the laundry cycle goes. They aren't daft.

They all have opinions about clothing and input into buying their clothes, and DD buys some of her own clothes - she spent Christmas money on a (fake) leather jacket and a long sleeved T shirt. She doesn't have any clothing she doesn't like though and puts her clothes out the night before - she didn't used to but does now due to a couple of early morning stresses about not having the right jeans in the first two weeks of secondary, but we haven't had any such angst in a good few months.

DD has to be up at 5.45am and out the door by 6.30am to catch the school bus at 6.39am - there is no time for dawdling and I am not dressing or choosing clothes for a child on the cusp of puberty!

The boys pull on whatever is top of their pile usually - DS is particular about having a football top for football training or football based birthday parties but not for school. Again if they don't actually like their clothing it would go to the clothing recycling/ refugee collection, not be in their drawer anyway...

I'm pro uniform. Mufti day causes such stress and anguish for my teen and preteen DDs.

Earrings are important to DD and she has started experimenting with make up sometimes, but not asked to wear it to school. Some of her friends do (she is the youngest in a class with the oldest being over 2 years older - German system has a lot of children repeating years in order to move "up" categories of school from less to more academic, or due to poor grades). She has dark lashes and no spots yet so currently not feeling the need to wear make up to school, just to mess with it at home to be able to join in conversations about it. If she wants to take more time getting ready in a year or two she'll just have to get up earlier - the bus isn't going to wait and its logistically challenging to drive her the 40km 'round trip due to the conflict with her brothers' bus/ drop off times!

Mufti day is not a realistic comparison though thebest - it causes anguish because its a special day, if it were every day maybe your DDs would still be anguished, but maybe after a few months that would become unsustainable and they'd just get dressed, like they do at the weekends and in the holidays, like they will do at uni if they go and at 6th form if it isn't one with a suits rule...

Yes that's true schwab but I still think uniform keeps clothing/label envy to a minimum. Teenage girls can be competitive over such things as they all want to fit in and be liked. By the time they're at 6th form , they have matured enough to know that is less important. at weekend meet ups with friends they can dig out a favourite outfit but daily would be a struggle. My dd has finds whose parents by them clothes in Jack Wills and Hollister!!! I can't and won't compete.

friends!!! Buy!!!

I think uniforms are stupid. I was training as a primary teacher just as the fad for putting primary aged kids back into uniform - after decades of not having it - came back. And that was long before I was a parent, but even then I thought it was crazy. Uniforms never look good anyway - cheap synthetic fabrics, etc. My kids freeze in winter.

Recently, I was on a FB group about the history of my old primary school and someone posted class photos from late Victorian times up to the 1970s when the school closed. We were the last kids there. And even in Victorian and Edwardian times - no such thing as a uniform in a village primary school. But many parents are in their 30s and probably now don't remember a time when kids didn't wear it so they imagine it is traditional. It's not. Not in ordinary state (primary) schools. Secondary schools often had it.

It's impractical, cold, expensive for what it is (nylon tat) and in the case of this area, only one or two shops allowed to stock it so you have no choice - it's a monopoly and they can charge £12 for a 50p thin, synthetic jumper because if you have no alternative "That's what the market stands".

I think it's another of those half baked tory 'reforms' that came in the 1980s - some fantasy of this perfect little England, where kids would be future employers' drones so better learn to conform aged 4.

Costs me money I don't have and my kids would be more comfortable and warmer (or cooler, in summer) wearing their own clothes. I think maybe parents at the time it was reintroduced thought it was 'A Good Thing' - but since when were parents educators?

My DDs uniforms are cotton actually joffrey. The polo tops and sweatshirts anyway. The bottom half is my own choice and I agree it's harder to find natural fabrics but not impossible. I would like to see long sleeved polo tops in winter though.

I was a 70s school child and we had a vague uniform of navy blue anything. There was a uniform(navy) but it was optional!! Looking back at photos it looks quite odd, some in jeans.

Ah and as a teacher let me tell you the 'label envy' thing is bullshit.

I taught in some rough inner city schools but my boys in particular, had to have the trainers or the shoes, even coming from families with little or no money to spare, there was huge peer pressure to express themselves that way. In 1990 they'd think nothing of wearing £100 trainers for the label - aged 10. Label envy is a reality and worse, if anything, where there is a uniform as they get desperate to express their individuality in some way.

My kids' school has a fairly strict uniform policy - so the kids, like the younger ones I taught, express themeselves with shoes and trainers, hair dos and their coats. 'Super Dry' coat at nearly £100 a pop two years ago still fits my son but he'd rather not wear it because it's so last year... (Luckily he managed to get a £220 duffle coat in the sales for £45). Other son got a designer label hoodie in the sales, so now won't wear his brother's perfectly good old coat...

And my kids are very typical of their friendship groups. We are dirt poor but they wouldn't be seen dead in Lonsdale trainers, astros or football boots.

I like it. Our is a pale blue polo too with a green sweatshirt plus black bottoms.
You can buy it from tesco or a local uniform shop.
It saves so much time wondering what to wear. My dd wears a very similar uniform to nursery and that's a godsend. It doesn't matter if she gets covered in goop and gunk and it washes well.
Love uniform!

I actually wish the uniform was stricter to avoid the trainer thing. Would be great if they said no labels allowed, only supermarket trainers allowed. My 15 yr old's face would be a picture!!!

I think the fussing over clothes thing depends a lot on the particular peer group of the children. My niece (no school uniform) is stressed most days about what to wear, according to my sister. She's only 7 but is already in a weird competition about the right look. It's really a shame. Dsis would love a uniform just to remove that angst in the morning - I agree it doesn't take away the general unhealthiness of that sort of competition at such a young age but it would take the stress out of my sister's mornings.

I don't think uniforms are a panacea but I think they do remove a certain potential for battle, differentiation etc. People keep saying you can still tell who are the poor kids but at my school you really can't. Yes you might know anyway, but not via the uniform. No one has any qualms about buying second hand uniform from the second hand uniform sale - it's well designed and robust and plain.

But perhaps my perspective is slightly skewed in that I am delighted by the lack of stress uniform brings to my life and therefore I don't really care about it on any level beyond it being clean. I don't iron anything and I don't care when the white shirts look a bit grey from too many washes. It all looks smart enough and that's good enough for me.

Caveat that my children don't have allergies that make cotton essential or anything like that.

That argument that is a leveller and you magically can't tell which are the poorer kids, is wishful thinking, too. And again, I observed this as a teacher then have done many times since as a mother of 5 sons...

From a teacher's POV.... sorry but kids totally know who it is in the class smells/has nits/comes to school maybe in uniform, yes, but also stinking of wee from the pants they've worn for two weeks... Uniform does nothing to level out the differences because the differences are obvious even to 7 year olds. Harsh reality. They see eachother's mums in the playground. They all know who is poor/dirty/mistreated/neglected. Uniform does NOTHING to paper over the cracks and the reality of some kids' home lives. Other kids are observant, judgemental, bitchy - all those things adults are. I've worked in private schools and state schools, schools on two continents, schools with uniforms and in one (blessed, very posh, very abroad) school - no uniform.

Uniform does nothing - repeat ZERO - to level out the social differences.

I hate it for that reason and all the others stated above. Also - why is it so fecking impractical? Our kids had 3 new uniforms in almost as many years thanks to 3 egotistical new broom sweeping clean Heads at their school... the dark blue polo shirts, surprisingly harder to source than other colours round here, but at least we could buy from wherever.... Have now reverted to some 1950s' concept of uniform which is a white shirt. I can't keep white shirts looking good beyond the first few weeks. It is impractical. Jeans and t shirt (jumper/sweatshirt in this weather and thermals cos my kids' football compression thermals are not allowed as they show at the neckline.... That would be warm practical and fine.

Gosh yes, the time taken to wrestle DS into shirt and tie and jumper in reception. At the weekend he dressed himself independently in 1/10 the time, probably less.

Just dipping back in, Joffery you may say "as a teacher" but other teachers on here have said the opposite, and in my experience I'd say that the need to have "the trainers" etc is compounded further in some schools that have no uniform because its not just the trainers, its the t shirts, the jeans, the need to have more than one of each.

There were several schools that I worked in during the 80s and 90s that had no uniform, this was certainly the case there, the same was the case in the USA, until they reach the maturity of their final years it seems to be an issue.

But agreed on lack of practicality and cost, although the cost argument is a bit void cause you'd have to clothe them anyway. Should be practical and cheap if we have to have it..