to think rudeness in children isn't cute

[mommy2ash]

My family seem to find it hilarious that a young relative has developed what they call a sassy attitude. Said child is almost three and today was the first time I have witnessed this myself. She will put her hand up and say that's enough I'm not listening to you any more, shut up, don't talk to me anymore roll her eyes when you are speaking to her etc. she isn't even 3 yet. I found it very hard to watch especially as everyone was laughing and egging her on. What happens when she is too old for this to be cute anymore and the poor child doesn't know any better. I babysit for this relative quite often and feel like I will have to start declining if I am to be expected to be spoken to like that by a toddler.

It's unreal to see what behaviours parents think is cute. Swearing, being rude, misbehaving, running around in restaurants etc isn't cute in the slightest. The child is being naughty and people can instantly sum up the parenting.

My DS is almost three. 95% of the time he is very polite, always says thank you for things and we've never had to prompt him.

The last 5% I think he is just testing his character / influence over others, although sometimes this comes across as rude. A notable moment was an evening at MILs a few weeks ago. He was in pjs ready for bed when I went to collect him. Sitting in the sofa watching peppa pig. MIL and I were either side of him on the sofa and chatting. He turned to us and said "No mummy, no nana, stop talking. I want to watch peppa pig!" Yes the phrasing was a by rude, but he doesn't really have the language to ask in a more tactful manner. We told him that we were having a conversation, and then silently giggled over his head.

A lot of his cheekiness / testing boundaries I find very funny or cute, but I do make sure I go out of the room to laugh!

most of time he's just trying to say "sit"... I hope.

Nanny that would be quite different wouldn't it.

My friend's child was overly encouraged by dad to be obnoxious as a toddler and friend always seemed to turn her back to it

Seen that too - also turned out they were constantly undermining the mother as well. The school pretty quickly taught them what was and wasn't acceptable so it was behaviour mainly seen round the parents.

In one case they split up and Dad took off and new step dad came along and the boy in question was a fine after that - the other a girl parent split but then got back together and were getting upset their daughter was being excluded more and more from social events. Thing was if you dealt with the behaviour made it clear it wouldn't fly in your house or company she was fine - it was just hard to do in front of her parents for many people.

I have found though GP houses can be a minefield - my DC GP have been undermining in the past which we've ignored or dealt with but somehow it's a lot harder - though not impossible - in their house. You tell your DC off for some behaviour only to find yourself under attack for doing so or stopped from doing so or the DC encouraged or told it's fine. Sometime it can be better to ignore and deal with the behaviour later at home in private as and when it crops up.

Fred is not alone - I teach children where the parents believe exactly what Fred does. "You've got no f**king right to speak to me/my child like that." It's delightful.

As someone said upthread, they're going to get one hell of a shock when they try and get a job.

You can bet that when this child's behaviour hinders the learning of other pupils the teacher will get the blame.

Try explaining to her that you dont like it and she shouldnt do it to you. If she doesn't stop, stop babysitting and explain why.
Its nothing short of criminal to ruin a child this way

I think you can only influence how you allow this child to speak to you. So if she puts her hand up and says "that's enough I'm not listening to you any more, shut up, don't talk to me anymore" or rolls her eyes when you are speaking to her etc.. you get down to face level, meet her eye and say pleasantly but firmly, "no, you do NOT speak to me like that, do you understand?"

Children like this have idiots for parents. I feel sorry for them.

I wonder if these are the sorts of parents who, once they realise things have got out of control and can't manage their offspring's behaviour anymore, say things like "Oh, school will sort them out." And then complain loudly when the school tries.

I kind of see where fred is coming from.... sort of but not really

I tend to ask kids to do something, rather than "tell them" ifswim? unless they ignore me too many times
Generally it's "Ask them nicely - Ask/tell firmly once more - Tell them what to do- consequences"

I only say that, because, whilst kids do need telling what to do and guidance, We don't boss adults around. We would never dream of saying to our mate "Pass the newspaper" but you might ask "Would you pass me the newspaper, please?"
so, I do feel that we shouldn't automatically speak to children in a demanding way :)

I always talk to my children (both my own and those at school) with respect and manners (they need this modelling to them which is part of what we teach them as parents) but they also need to know that I'm the parent/teacher and that they can't just do as they please.

We do children a disservice not to teach them this.

One of my friends has always taken the 'work through the social rules in your own way, darling' approach.

One of her children is delightful, the other is really, really rude.

No, rudeness in children is not cute at all.

Occasional mispronunciation of words that then sound like swear words is funny but not to be encouraged (DS2 is 3 and says "pirate shits" when he means ships - we just nod and smile but don't laugh and repeat "yes, pirate shiPs" back to him.

DS2 got into a habit of saying "Shh shh shh" whenever I was trying to tell him off, or get him to do something he didn't want to - this was infuriating, as well as rude - he doesn't do it now. Now he just tells me "I'm busy mummy", which isn't rude (and can be quite amusing but I don't let HIM know that!)

It's no good letting them get away with such stuff at that age, that you're not going to put up with later - it just sends mixed messages and confuses them, IMO.

The children are mimicking the way they see others behave and speak. Our dc is like a sponge, we have been at some behaviour and comments since she started nursery. I watched 'the secret lives of 6 year olds' recently and one child was pretending to speak to another child on the phone and said "I've told you Richard, to stop calling. You are NOT the dad!". Presumably, that child was repeating an overheard conversation as part of her play. op, it is up to the child's parents to parent their child. You don't have to babysit for them, if you choose not to. But, you won't be thanked for pointing out how much you disapprove of their dc's behaviour.

Forgot to add: Yanbu op

Yanbu. I know a child like this. He has been encouraged to call adults by "hilarious" nicknames, which his parents now play along with "here comes Uncle Poohead!" Etc. Laughs all round when he tells his mum to "go to hell". Frankly, it makes me really uncomfortable. However the family in question think I am the one with the problem (can't appreciatea bit of fun etc etc)

I don't find that sort of attitude from a small child at all cute or funny, and I feel terribly sorry for when they go to school/in public, because people will make judgements

Agree with PP who pointed out that this can be part of a pattern of undermining by one parent. Some people really are so maladjusted that they would use a child like that.

I also wonder, if there is a large group of people, or people besides her parents, if there is a case of group paralysis happening -- nobody wants to play the parent when the parents are there, and the parents are too timid to confront the child for fear of losing a battle of wills to a three year old in front of a roomful of people. If others have been talking about the behaviour to you, OP, then maybe it is a case of the child getting away with behaviour in a group that she wouldn't if just one or both of her parents were there.

I think you are doing exactly the right thing in stating your rules and catching her being good.