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To think this is utterly repulsive behaviour

104 replies

bridie69 · 29/12/2015 21:58

Was visiting friends in N London today and decided to tube it. The last section of the Northern Line carriage thinned out and gradually became aware of a 40s guy to put it bluntly staring at my chest. I wasn't even wearing a low cut top not that that would excuse. I was feeling really uncomfortable and actually quite worried, then he stands up somewhere in the Claphams and my heart starts to race like mad I am convinced I am about to be assaulted. He screwed up a bit of paper and threw it at me as he got off a few stops before me. I started to cry partly with relief and got off at my stop then drove home shaking. I just opened the piece of paper and let's just say it is quite an unpleasant sexual comment. I am 51 for God's sake I just want to be left alone...why the HELL do we have to put up with this and why I am sitting here thinking "it could have been worse". Sad

OP posts:
nailslikeknives · 30/12/2015 00:18

Please report it.
I had a horrible incident with a nasty perv at Kings Cross. One of the station workers realised what had happened and got the police for me. The police took it seriously, used cctv to find him - still in action at the station (!!) - and took it from there.

UndramaticPause · 30/12/2015 00:23

I hope you're OK. Please report it. I had an equally horrible experience happen years ago on a train where a middle aged man (I was late teens) eyed up a woman's rear as she got off the train, licked his lips as he placed his hands in his lap between his thighs then proceeded to stare at me for the rest of the time I was on that train. I feel sick remembering it and wish I'd reported it.

Don't let him get away with it Flowers

Lynnm63 · 30/12/2015 00:38

Definitely report it op. BTp have a zero tolerance policy, they prosecute everything. My DS was being bullied at school and school were fucking useless. Bully punched DS on the train station platform, it was caught on CCTV, they said he'd be dealt with and they cautioned him due to his age, if he'd been older the punishment would have been greater.

pickledparsnip · 30/12/2015 00:48

OP that sounds awful

A friend of mine had a horrendous experience on the tube years ago now. She was on a very packed train, and some dirty fucker got up behind her, slipped his hands between her legs and whispered vile things in her ear. She was so scared she just stood there and didn't know what to do. I wish I could have been there to protect her, I'd have castrated the filthy bastard. She suffers with really bad anxiety, and it was a big deal for her to go on the tube.
Apparently these incidents are really common.

mathanxiety · 30/12/2015 00:49

He did it because he thinks he can get away with it and because he feels he is in tune with the rest of society in expressing his hatred and contempt for women. There are vast swathes of the online world and the real world too where blatant misogyny is perfectly acceptable.

To that extent, what he expressed was normal and how he expressed it was also commonplace -- you don't have to search for long online to find exactly the sort of sentiment he seems to have expressed. Where he differed from many others was in his personal initiative, taking the chance of an empty train carriage to show Bridie 'her place' and to big himself up.

Spending so long using porn or on menz rights forums that you start to feel entitled to let women know what you think of them is not a sign of mental illness. Every iceberg has a tip. It is horrifying to have an encounter with this up close and personal, but our world is awash in this.

Italiangreyhound · 30/12/2015 00:49

I must also say that sometimes people who create unease on trains are not all men! I was once on a train where a girl was bullied by other girls and another time when two young girls were upsetting passengers, throwing paper at a guy, being rude etc. No one did anything, everyone was just waiting to get off at their stop. To my shame, I did nothing either. Public transport can be very like this. So in one sense I think weird things do happen on trains.... but....

I think hating women, or feeling very negatively towards women, is a lot more common than many of us might realise. What is very sad is that some women feel this way, about themselves, their bodies, and about other women.

Society is built around the default that male is normal. So female is abnormal. That's how patriarchy works.

What's sad is that when women are treated very badly they sometimes wonder if it is their fault, what did they do to provoke it.

IMHO the reality of life means anyone is able to treat others badly. So men can treat any women badly, if they choose to, they can say or do mean things, to women they are in relationship with or to strangers. Of course woman can do it too. Of course it does not mean it is right or fair or correct to do so. Of course some things will be punishable by law. The reality is men do these things a lot more than women do. Prisons are full of men who create havoc in society - women, not so much! That's all part of patriarchy.

So when women ask why a man treated them badly or did something - maybe there just is no reason. They wanted to do it and they thought they could get away with it.

Which is why reporting it is important. I think throwing a rude note at a person is a bit like shouting an abusive message. It's not right.

But I do understand if people do not report stuff. I am 50 now but when I was in my teens a few things happened, very minor, and it never occurred to me to even tell anyone. Did I report the man who tried to kiss me when I was babysitting (at 16) for his employee's children. No I didn't. I was glad to get him out of the house and relieved nothing further happened. Did I report the customer who kept touching my bum when I was a waitress, in front of his wife? No.

We are kind of conditioned to think when these things happen that it is somehow our fault. bridie69 you said I wasn't even wearing a low cut top not that that would excuse. And you were right. Whatever top you were wearing it was not an excuse and not a reason. He just did it.

If you report him you can know that maybe you've just registered that it is not OK. Maybe he will do something else another time and someone else will report it. Maybe he will be caught. But anyway, you are OK.

Italiangreyhound · 30/12/2015 00:50

Oh crossed with Math and others!

mathanxiety · 30/12/2015 00:50

So Bridie, please report what happened.

Flowers to you.

mathanxiety · 30/12/2015 00:52

doh, x post

Aeroflotgirl · 30/12/2015 01:07

Not mental illness, but possibly narcissistic . you can be one, and not have a mental illness. Some people are inheritanly nasty people, does not mean they have a mental illness but something wrong in their psyche.

knobblyknee · 30/12/2015 01:11

This makes me so angry, its 2015 and we still have to put up with this shit! Anyway, its some kind of assault or something so please report it. Sending hugs and Brew

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 30/12/2015 01:22

I agree

I have been sexually assaulted (then called having a feel/touched up), flashed at, stared at in a way to make me feel uncomfortable, men standing far closer than they need to on far too many occasions while travelling on the tube I never reported it but if I had at the time it would have never been taken seriously now thankfully it is

StopShoutingAtYourBrother · 30/12/2015 08:38

In the interests of completeness there is a text 999 number but you need to have registered your mobile number first, before you can use it.

www.emergencysms.org.uk/files/3649_esms_6.pdf

Again OP so sorry this happened to you

bridie69 · 30/12/2015 10:32

So I have reported it. Feel a bit better now. BTP were very helpful took all the details said they will look at cctv at station exits and I gave them a good description. Still can't find the blinking note but mentioned it. Today I am going about my chores and find myself thinking about every single man from the overweight guy in the paper shop to the guy washing his car to the young guy quietly waiting for a bus "I wonder if you do it (sexually harass/offend women)". I know they probably don't but you just don't know do you? Where is that idiot today, did he go home to a wife and kids and just act normal? Did he stay up all night looking at violent porn? Is he in some office somewhere leching over some woman now? It is truly terrifying to think how much and how deeply some men absolutely HATE us women. As far as I know there are no baby misogynists so what the hell happens to them to turn them this way? It wasn't like I had some magic formula with my DS he just had a (semi) normal upbringing like everyone else. Should I be worried about him turning put like this idiot now if some switch flicks in his brain?? This has been a very bad learning experience and I am shocked to have read all the stuff that has happened to other women. Must have been bloody naive I really thought this nonsense was almost stamped out now.

OP posts:
EnthusiasmDisturbed · 30/12/2015 10:40

Glad you are feeling better from reporting it not always easy.

We can only teach out children that men and women are equal and that everyone should be treated with respect and treat others as you wish to be treated.

There are so many reasons why men becket like this. I think violent porn with constant access to it has a lot to answer for

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 30/12/2015 10:41

Sorry excuse typos ....

Shockers · 30/12/2015 10:47

I'm glad you reported it. Mental illness or not, the effect on the victim is still the same. This man either needs treatment, or punishment.

On a similar note, a friend of mine found a private message on her fb the other day, calling her an "horrible, ugly, old slapper." This was from somebody she has no previous knowledge of, but who is from a nearby town.

Why would a man see the profile of an attractive woman and feel the need to do this?

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 30/12/2015 10:49

To feel powerful and to cause hurt/fear like the vile man the op encountered

Viewofhedges · 30/12/2015 10:55

Glad you have reported it. I was on a tube recently and heard a bunch of drunk football fans yelling "gang rape" at someone and too bloody right I reported it. The BTP were brilliant and they log everything to check for patterns and to get these people prosecuted. (And in my case they sent officers)

Can I suggest everyone makes sure they have the transport police text number in their phones - means you can report quietly and they read and respond straight away.

disappointed101 · 30/12/2015 10:58

Sorry this happened to you, you must be in shock. I would be worried that he is building him up to something bigger. I would definitely report it.

bridie69 · 30/12/2015 11:10

Shockers was that guy already a Facebook friend I mean to be able to send a message like that? But what on earth did he possibly get out of it? Why can't you silently not find someone attractive without resorting to this?

OP posts:
hefzi · 30/12/2015 11:22

bridie well done for reporting it - just reading this thread has made me feel ill, so I can't imagine how foul it must have been for you to experience it Flowers I hope he gets cautioned and a bloody great shock that he can't go around behaving like this, to anybody: ugh.

Shockers · 30/12/2015 11:40

bridie, no- she'd never heard of him before and they had no mutual friends.

She is very attractive though, I suspect he saw her photo and decided to do a little virtual pigtail pulling... or perhaps he's just a sad sack who gets his cheap thrills from making people feel sad, or threatened.

Either way, he's been blocked and reported. Nasty little man.

It's just horrible when someone decides you're worthy of their vitriol, or contempt, for no other reason than you're there. I once started a thread about some men who were verbally abusive (under the guise of 'humour') to my friend and me in a restaurant. It really affected me, even though I knew it had nothing to do with me as a person, and everything to do with them being complete and utter arseholes.

Hope this doesn't knock you in the same way. MNetters were bloody lovely when I posted, and it really helped!

bridie69 · 30/12/2015 13:54

Shockers wow you live and learn. I really thought to pm someone on fb you had to have had them as a friend first. Obv not. And how awful about those men in the restaurant. I really feel supported by what has been written on here though. I have been doing private study of psychology and of feminist theory recently but still can't get my head around events like this. I also don't think I should be thinking like a grateful little woman "well at least I wasn't raped". Let's face it, men just aren't going to experience this are they? Yes other things like male on male thuggishness but I don't think any man has ever suffered at the hands of women the way some or it seems the majority of us suffer at the hands of some of them. And where are the men calling other men out on this kind of stuff? All you ever read from men on here is "I'd never do this, what about men's rights to speak to women" ffs. With the notable exception of one male poster I think called "my first and only" whose post here really touched me.

OP posts:
Italiangreyhound · 31/12/2015 00:57

Well done for reporting.