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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Bible from school

409 replies

user7755 · 14/12/2015 17:51

DS goes to a standard secondary (not a religious school), he came home last week with a bible.

I remember we got them when we were kids but I had forgotten thought we had moved on since then

DS doesn't believe in God, his choice and nothing to do with us. But I'm just really shocked and irritated at this act, presumably an attempt to spread the word and indoctrinate kids into organised religion.

I am very, very anti organised religion right now, following a historical abuse case involving our family which has just been through the court and involved a vicar, so very aware that I'm probably oversensitive.

Is it me? AIBU?

OP posts:
captainfarrell · 14/12/2015 22:15

It's just a book. He can make his own decision. End of story, no need to waste any more energy!

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 22:20

Oh wise one myother Please tell us what is the divine truth in your opinion?

The truth is that there are many things in life that we have yet to discover and science is the way to find out about those. The galaxy we live in is so vast that we don't know everything that exists within it never mind far galaxies beyond that. I am perfectly willing to believe that there may be lif out there on other planets that we've yet to discover. Religion and the existence of a god like figure has been studied and proved to be utter hogwash. I can totally understand that primitive people made up a god in order to explain the workings of their world. That people in this day and age still believe in that utterly astounds and dismays me tbh.

I also can't understand why people would worship a being that is either uncompassionate or impotent. This pretend being either doesn't give a shit about people dying needlessly or does care but can do nothing about it, clearly too busy helping old Mrs Smith win the bingo this week perhaps to worry about starving and abused children etc?

thebestfurchinchilla · 14/12/2015 22:24

There is no reason why science and faith cannot coexist. The fact that we have yet to discover everything surely means that a god cannot be ruled out.

clarinsgirl · 14/12/2015 22:33

We have yet to prove that I can't fly. I don't believe that either. And actually, which bits have not been disproved? Earth created in seven days, Eve made from Adam, Noah and the Ark, Resurrection, virgin birth???? Sorry it has been disproved. Cognitive dissonance is the rational explanation for modern religion, that and the fact that it's very lucrative for those at the top.

BigDorrit · 14/12/2015 22:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 22:34

There is no reason why science and faith cannot coexist

Errrmmm, yes there is a reason....because it's utterly not true. The bible and the ilk have been gone over by scientists and they have yet to find any truth in any of the claims other than some people in it (people that is, not gods) possibly existed. There were no miracles, no parting of the seas, no immaculate conception etc etc etc.

See, if you stand back and actually look at it, the whole premise of religion is built on blind faith, it has to be blind as there is no actual evidence or truth in any of it.

Religion is basically a power tool to control and subjugate the masses and to provide wealth and power to the few elite at the top. I am fairly convinced that the people at the top don't believe it any more than I do, however it gives them money, a good lifestyle, power and control.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 22:38

I can absolutely see why people find comfort in it though, especially the bereaved. It must help to think that your loved ones are waiting for you etc. The way I look at it is that a person exists within your memories even when they have died. In that way they are never gone whilst there is still someone to remember them with love. A life without religion is not cold and bare, its a life full of love just the same and more so for knowing that the time we have is all we have and we should make the most of it.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 23:00

And while I am on...can I ask a genuine question?

Ok, so old testament there is god and heaven correct? And the people are Jews right? So there is heaven and it's full of Jewish people. Soo, god sends his son to save everybody so now everybody getting into heaven are Christians and the Jews are doing their own thing - same god or now are there two? Is heaven now split into people who were Jewish before Jesus so that's okay, Christians and now post Jesus Jews are in a separate bit?(or maybe not?). Then we have Muslims who believe in the same god but have a different take on a lot of the things that Christians think they are right on, so still same god yes? but now we have a separate area for Muslims that's basically just full full of virgins waiting to be raped by people who blow themselves up? Muslin virgins or christian virgins or jews?

Anyway, the above scenario and the same convoluted questions about everything that is talked about in the bible, together with science and the dinosaurs effectively cleansed my mind of the childhood brainwashing.

Imustgodowntotheseaagain · 14/12/2015 23:25

Why do atheists get so abusive about faith?

I don't give a fuck whether anyone else believes in God or not, yet atheists seem to really, really object to the fact that I do.

I respect BertrandRussell's position on Christian privilege, it's an interesting perspective on our politics and society, and it's put forward without a farcical distortion of what people actually believe.

WMittens · 14/12/2015 23:27

There is no reason why science and faith cannot coexist. The fact that we have yet to discover everything surely means that a god cannot be ruled out.

Everything that has ever been proven in the history of everything, has so far been proven to not involve god. In terms of success rate, he's not doing very well, whereas William of Ockham is doing extremely well.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 23:30

Why do atheists get so abusive about faith?

Possibly because it is constantly rammed down our throats, because it is the root of most conflict in the world and it continues to occupy a place in society that it doesn't deserve.

When was the last time you had an atheist at your door telling you that you are living your life wrong and that they can help you see the light? Would that be never?

Bunbaker · 14/12/2015 23:33

"Why do atheists get so abusive about faith?"

Because they know it all. There is no evidence that there is a god. There is also no evidence that there isn't, but some atheists don't like to acknowledge this. It's two sides of the same coin. No-one knows for sure whether God or many gods exist or don't exist. Many people have a faith and believe in God/gods and many don't. End of.

Live and let live.

BigDorrit · 14/12/2015 23:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 23:35

Personally, whatever you choose to believe in the comfort of your own home or place of worship is up to you and I have no objections at all (using your own phrasing here).

However, it is the aim of most religions to go and spread the word/convert people rather than sit at home/place of worship and get on with it. It's that that causes conflict.

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 23:38

Because they know it all. There is no evidence that there is a god. There is also no evidence that there isn't, but some atheists don't like to acknowledge this.

I think that the onus is on the religious to prove that a god exists rather than the other way around to be honest. It is easier in theory to prove that something is there rather than to prove that something isn't. So when you produce your evidence then I'll be happy to take a look at it.

tibbawyrots · 14/12/2015 23:39

Not read the thread - but seeing the posts above am glad I didn't...

We had the Gideons visit the school when I was

myotherusernameisbetter · 14/12/2015 23:41

Live and let live.

If only it could be so. Not many atheists blowing up planes or chopping off people's heads though...

Geraniumred · 14/12/2015 23:43

We got a letter from school to check with parents if it was ok to give out a bible to their child - I only remember this because dm refused permission for me - it was years ago.

LittleBeautyBelle · 14/12/2015 23:59

WMittens, many scientists, including founding scientists, are/were Christians. The father of quantum physics was a Lutheran and the formulator of the so called Big Bang theory was a priest. Two of many examples. It's not all one way or another.

BigDorrit · 15/12/2015 00:07

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BertrandRussell · 15/12/2015 00:17

I would absolutely love to "live and let live" Sadly, in the UK, Christians won't let me.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 15/12/2015 00:59

Where do you all live that you get religion rammed down your throats?

Apart from the occasional incredibly boring mumbleing strange man in the town center (who I'm sure is only boring because he does not enunciate) who rocks up for a week in dec and then again at Easter, a Johavas witness perhaps once every few years I only ever come across in your face religion if I walk into a church.

My kids schools send home all sorts of faith books from different faiths talk about all sorts of faiths in collective worship sometimes they just play a bit of lip service by saying lets all be kind to each other.

Oh I forgot about the attractive men from the latter day saints who occasionally bring dime bars but I haven't seen one of those for about 6 months!

BertrandRussell · 15/12/2015 01:12

"Where do you all live that you get religion rammed down your throats?"

I don't get it "rammed down my throat" However.christianity has an extraordinary influence on life in the UK.it's so normalised lots of people don't notice,

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/12/2015 01:14

Except that as science develops, there are fewer and fewer gaps for a god to exist in...

Gods exist in the heads, hearts and souls of believers. Not in unexplored parts of the universe.

Myother, religion and science can indeed coexist. Religious scientists are proof of this.

Big where did you get that 5% figure from?

LittleBeautyBelle · 15/12/2015 01:15

Big, that's not really factual to claim they only pretended to have faith. When you read the writings of these scientists, they had a strong belief in God to the end of their lives which disproves your statement. The quantum physics guy said the more he learned about science the more he believed, and that is true for many scientists. I'm paraphrasing but he said something like people who take a sip of the glass of science don't believe but as they get closer to the bottom of the glass they see God. (Not exact quote) No, I'd say it is nearer the mark to say many scientists today are afraid to admit they believe because of the hostility and retribution toward believers in certain fields. The Nobel prize winning genome scientist is one who is ridiculed in recent times for his faith.

Once upon a time, a scientist doctor was thrown out of the medical field for suggesting surgeons wash their hands before surgery so as to prevent infection. If I remember correctly he went a lifetime without being recognized for his contributions and died excluded from the scientific community. A majority opinion doesn't always equal truth on either side of an argument.

We are all on a journey. Each of us is shaped by our personal experiences, our circumstances, what we've read and people we respect and admire. We all have our opinions based on what we know or think in our hearts and minds and all these personal experiences--nobody can invalidate the experiences and beliefs of others, be they atheists or believers.

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