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Original poster

To love the idea of scrapping all benefits and just giving everyone £500 a month

431 replies

DyslexicScientist · 08/12/2015 11:33

Like Finland are going to do.

Would get rid of all the east that goes on with means testing and would cost about the same.

Would be much fairer as the current system does discriminate against certain demographics.

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 11/12/2015 14:22

As others have said its not really giving people x amount a month extra is it? I thought it was.more that everyone was given their personal tax allowance as a citizens income, and then taxation on earnings would start straight away. So well paid people would not be better off as they lose their personal allowance and then get it back as citizens income = no loss or gain.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:22

Posted too soon.

Of being disabled. My bil doesn't have any costs of being disabled as he doesn't have a physical problem but he still receives around £650 or something a month.

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:23

If the rate was the same wherever you lived, it would make sense if you are poor to move somewhere cheaper.
And where I live, a single person unemployed would be better off with this than on JSA.
JSA discourages people from taking on part time and temporary work. A CI encourages people to do temporary work. There is also lots of money spent on trying to get people into work through various schemes. These could be scrapped.
My parents who live on the state old age pension, would be better off as well. They get much less than £1,000 a month.
There would have to be a payment to each child as well.

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:24

Kaytee, that sounds very strange. I have lots of physical problems as a disabled person and am not entitled to anything.

longingforfun · 11/12/2015 14:26

Rich or poor we'd all get the same? I can't see how it would benefit the less well off as the cost of living would just be adjusted upwards. Some people need more financial help than others.

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:28

Lots of single people live on less than £500 a month and lots of couples iive on less than £1,000 a month. Of course you can live on that amount. But there needs to also be an amount per child as well.

StrawberryTeaLeaf · 11/12/2015 14:29

the trickle UP economic model is far more effective than 'trickle down' which doesn't work at all

So true.

My BIL's DLA payments have gone up in recent years so I don't think it's being phased out?

It's being phased out. There's been a LOT of news coverage for several years.

Social Services fund direct payments for those who need carer help. So it would make sense for these still to exist.

Good point. That'll make a difference.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:29

Cleaty it may be that as bil can't work he is entitied to more (can't read or write, various learning difficulties etc) however if you have costs due to your disability it's a bit unfair that they're not covered :(

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:30

Entitled *

FannyTheChampionOfTheWorld · 11/12/2015 14:30

Yeah nobody's really picked up on the fact that £500 a month is more than some low income, vulnerable people get now cleaty. Carers for a start. And yes the 'pension credit' amount for a couple is a little below 1k at the moment.

eatingworms · 11/12/2015 14:30

People in employment already all get the same personal tax allowance longing, so for people in work it wouldn't make much difference as they'd be taxed on ALL earnings with no personal allowance (they'd be getting it as a cash sum instead).
The poor would benefit as they'd be able to take advantage of seasonal work etc that previously they daren't so for fear of losing their benefits.
It may also benefit people struggling to find work in that people currently working may cut back hours/jobs as they no longer have the fear of being out of work, therefore freeing up roles to those who want them. (I say may as this is what happened in a trial that was done in Canada that someone linked to earlier)
We should watch Finland with interest.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:32

Strawberry I have heard of some people getting less but bil has received more in recent years. I dont know about others circumstances, only his as I fill in his forms for him.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:36

His £650 may include his personal independance benefit too though...

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 11/12/2015 14:36

kaytee www.gov.uk/dla-ending

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:36

Yes it would benefit carers. And it would benefit those who struggle with forms and jumping through the hoops to get what they are entitled to. It would also have meant as a young single person I could have just walked out of that terrible job I had once, knowing I had some money to fall back on.

Maybe £300 a month for children?

StrawberryTeaLeaf · 11/12/2015 14:38

It isn't about the amounts Kaytee, it is that the coalition government decided to get rid of DLA.

DLA is being phased out entirely and slowly replaced by PIP which is harder for people to qualify for. Eventually there will be no more DLA. Already, new claimants have to claim PIP, not DLA.

Because it is harder to get, fewer disabled people will get PIP than got DLA.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:39

He's not been told his dla is being taken away I don't think however he can't read his letters and his mum's not the best looking into things. Possibly his dla has just been replaced by personal independance benefit and actually gone up as a result. I just assumed the personal independance benefit was pretty much just a different name for dla but only have experience with one case so maybe lots of other people have suffered as a result

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:40

And yes, it is strange to read people saying that nobody can live on this amount, when people are actually doing so.

It would also encourage people to get pensions, who would only ever manage to amass a small pension. If you have a small pension, it really isn't worth saving for it. Under this scheme a pension of £300 a month is still worth having.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:42

Posted at the same time strawberry, this makes more sense now as to why I need to fill a massive bloody form in for him every year. Well in his case it's actually been a good thing but obviously not the case for others.

longingforfun · 11/12/2015 14:42

eating worms the poor wouldn't necessarily benefit. For example, how would the unemployed pay rent? Rent for a private sector one bed flat in London is over £1000 a month. It's a non starter.

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:45

Housing benefit also wouldn't pay for a £1,000 one bedroom flat in London.

honkinghaddock · 11/12/2015 14:47

Ds doesn't have a physical disability but there are still costs because of his disability. As an adult he will get top rate pip ( top rate mobility because he will never be able to leave the house by himself) and he will never be able to work.

Kaytee1987 · 11/12/2015 14:51

Honking I believe bil gets top rate also as be can't be unsupervised.
By saying no costs I meant no equipment etc that some poor disabled people need.
Obviously he has every day costs and is unable to earn money to cover them himself.

cleaty · 11/12/2015 14:51

This is the absolute maximum anyone can get in housing benefit. And good luck trying to find somewhere in central London for that rent level. The amount you get is less outside central London. And there are strict rules about who is entitled to a 1 bedroom rate, 2 bedroom, etc.

Central London BRMA
Shared Accommodation Rate:£136.52 per week
One Bedroom Rate:£260.64 per week
Two Bedrooms Rate:£302.33 per week
Three Bedrooms Rate:£354.46 per week
Four Bedrooms Rate:£417.02 per week

longingforfun · 11/12/2015 14:56

Cleaty, £260.64 a week = £1129.44 a month.