to expect an 11 year old to be able to take some responsibility for herself?

[RainbowDashed]

My eldest is 11, just started secondary school this year. I KNOW that it's a big adjustment and we've tried to help her be more organised but honestly, she's so bloody dippy, her mind seems to be elsewhere ALL THE FUCKING TIME

Examples:

I have had two texts from her today, one asking me to take her a plastic tub to the bus stop for food tech as she hadn't remembered to bring one herself. I didn't get the text until after the bus had gone, and I was busy getting dd2 and myself out of the door at the time anyway, a detour to the bus stop would have made me late for work so I couldn't have done it anyway. Then at break time I get another text asking me to drop one at school - this is the school that's almost an hour's drive from where I work - by the time I'd gone home, found her tub, got it to school and then driven back to work it would have taken the best part of 2 hours, the 50 miles worth of petrol notwithstanding. So I said no. (She has found one now apparently so problem solved). She KNEW she had food tech today. I'd helped her gather the ingredients. All she had to do for herself was remember a tub.

Yesterday I sent her to find a table in a shopping centre food hall, she came back to tell me that there was one in the corner, should she sit there? Well, erm, YES, that's why I sent you. By the time she wandered slowly back to the seating area the table had been taken and we had to wait ages for a seat. Lovely cold burger and chips.

We were away this weekend Christmas shopping. We stayed away overnight. She brought some pyjamas and clean knickers then complained because she'd spilt her drink down her top so she'd have to wear a dirty top for the rest of the weekend. Could we please buy her a new one? I'd told her to pack a change of clothing, she'd forgotten apparently.

She is constantly forgetting PE kit, swimming kit, dinner money. If she's looking for something but can't find it at first glance, she gives up. I found a £20 on the drive the other day that she'd tried to put in her pocket and missed and not realised.

We have an agreement that in order to get her pocket money she has to keep her room tidy enough that whoever is hoovering / cleaning / dusting can get in there to do it. She hasn't had any pocket money for ages, her room always looks like someones ransacked it. She has other jobs, emptying the dishwasher, making sure curtains are open etc etc so nothing an 11 year old shouldn't be more than capable of doing and she never remembers to do it.

How on earth do I help her become a bit more organised? I am really getting to the end of my tether with it. I do my best to not enable her by picking up after her but that doesn't seem to help. I've been helping her come up with systems to remember what she needs each day but she doesn't look at them.

Am I asking too much of her? We are an extremely busy family, I do as much as I can for her but a) she wants to be treated more like an adult which it's hard to do when she can't remember to look at a calendar or job list b) sometimes I forget things too and she needs to read her lists and take some responsibility for herself, surely?

Arggghhhh I'm just so frustrated. Even if someone could tell me she'll get better as she gets older it would help, as I despair of her ever fending for herself or driving. Her 6 year old sister is more organised than she is.

I think food tech is one step too far for Y7 - way beyond what they can cope with alone when making the transition on all fronts.

You must help her!!!!!!!!! The consequences aren't worth the ball-ache if you are a busy family. As you've discovered.

She will prob rotate onto design/tech after Xmss and you'll be able to breathe s sigh of relief!!!!

OP, me and my ds2 are like this and have Dyspraxia.
Ds1 and dd are far better organised.

However, dh is worse than all of us, I don't know how he manages to get through the day tbh, it's a miracle. But he does and he thrives on his chaos.
Dh isn't dyspraxic, btw.

It may be worth seeing if she is dyspraxic, she could be a very arty, creative type like my dh.

Umme- this could be off beam, but is there a possibility she's dyslexic? Even is she is bright/learnt to read easily etc she could still ahve some issues with processing speed or working memory...

She sounds like my DS, who is only 7(nearly 8) but is showing all the same signs, and at parents night recently, his teacher flagged up his organisation problems. DH is dyspraxic, and I'm pretty sure DS has a bit of the same, if not to the same degree. I feel a bit guilty for shouting at him for being scatty now... But DH functions just fine as an adult - he's found coping mechanisms and is way more organised than NT me.

My son is like this. He has ADHD.

DS has serious problems with concentration. This is what has helped:

• in parents evening, explain that she has serious problems with concentration. Ask each teacher when does s/he normally sets homework (and if she has been doing it)
• ask the teacher to break long instructions into smaller sets of tasks (that helps tremendously)
• create routines. Make sure that she has the weekly list of what to take to school near to her books, and make sure she sorts the bag in the night (after a month of practice, DS is doing it without prompting). If something can't be in the bag (perishables/big items) make sure there's a note next to the bag.
• make sure you check the planner every night and insist on her doing her homework in the day when it was set.
• set a time of the day as revision/homework time.
• When it comes to taking forms/payments/notes to school... Well, DS own way to remember is to write a reminder in his hand. I really don't like it, but it is the only thing that works.

You can help her with all the above but let her take responsibility for her own forgetfulness: Between many other things, DS was good at loosing his bus pass. First time I paid for the replacement, second time he had to pay with his allowance (which is still the case) but there was one day when he didn't have any allowance left so I let him walk to school for the last 2 days of the duration of the pass. He seems far more responsible about keeping the pass safe since that day.

My dd is exactly like this.
She is nearly 14 so I can't offer you any hope I'm afraid.

She leaves lights on, forgets school stuff, never charges her phone, arrive on holiday with no hair brush,swim suit, suitable shoes/clothes.

She luggs a bag about which is heavier than a boulder rather than re pack it.

She gets I to the car late for her great love (dance lessons) with no music, ballet shoes, laddered tights and no hate brush or pins.

It is totally the bane of my life, I'm exhausted from it but can't see it changing.

DS1 is like this. Turns out as well as ASD he has dyspraxia.

This made me laugh as im 24 and i used to be like this, still am a bit, used to drive my mum insane, now it just drives my dh mad! No helpful advice, maybe its just her? As ive got older i actualy annoy myself, i have to write everything down and have a designated area for letters and a calender with reminders otherwise i forget everything

And yes routine helps alot

I was a bit like this too - dreamy and distracted. I'm pretty focussed and efficient as an adult though (I do like a list ) so I clearly sorted it out at some point

My dd was like this at 11. She's 13 now and slightly better. I would just ignore texts like the tub one. In fact my dd is not allowed a mobile at school until year 9 - thank god as it stops all those spur of the moment texts.

If she forgot stuff she didn't do it. Although I did realise she genuinely was a bit flakey and helped her a lot.

I think you expect a lot from an 11 year old. They are all different. My 9 year old is scarily organised. Some need more help than others. I felt sorry for your dd about the table in the restaurant.

Umm - if this is every day I would think she is struggling.

So you need to sort out what each "forgetting is", is it:
a) something she just has to take the consequence for - eg. Food Tech, PE kit,
b) something she needs help with - writing in homework - two of my children had help for the first years of secondary to get HW written into their planners. I would discuss this with the school to see what help they think she needs/can help with.
c) something she needs to work out how to sort out - where would a timetable help her most? Maybe a list of check before you leave notes on the front door? etc.
d) things you are going to have to help her with, or even sort for her.

Different children have very different abilities to organise themselves, so don't compare.

I have a reputation for being really organised - it's because I'm like your dd and have learned coping strategies.

So the tub she needed - that would have been just inside the front door so I couldn't open the door without picking it up. When I had made cheesecake for work there was a post it for me to get it - again on the front door.

I try to have as much routine as possible and if I am starting a new job (supply teacher so this happens a lot) my alarm will go several times with reminders between me getting up and going to work. I use my phone as the alarm and it says things like, "you need petrol, set off X time"

I'm dyslexic and so are a couple of friends, we can be quite literal, one of them would so do the same when looking for a table. He has been known when asked to do something to just do that, so 'can you peel me some potatoes?' yes he can, but he will then leave them and all the peelings on the worktop because I need to ask him to peel the potatoes, rinse them, put them in water and throw the peelings away.

If I ask him to put the kettle on that's what he'll do, some people would interpret that as 'can you make a cup of tea for everyone' but he doesn't.

We were housemates for a while and do quite a few things together, I have learned that, "we need to leave at 6pm" means that at 6pm I'n in my coat with the keys in my hand but he ie just starting to get ready because 'leave at 6pm' translates as do what you want until 6pm and then get ready.

Sorry for the rant, but could you try getting her organised, so if she needs things for food tech her phone alarm tells her at 8am?

Tbh, I think you need to cut this girl some slack. She's not a mini-adult, she's a child/adolescent whose brain is developing still. Things that are easy for you might not be for her. No, clearly you're not going to run around after her when she forgets stuff, so she needs to realise that. But she is a young person who is still learning, and one of the things she is learning is how to organise herself. Forgetting her HE tub isn't the crime of the century, it's something that's actually pretty normal for a busy girl who has a lot to think about. Remember, kids that age need a lot of sleep and they naturally get up a lot later than they are forced to get up for school. So she, like most people her age, is probably permanently slightly sleep deprived. She is also learning to settle into a new and intimidating environment (secondary school), managing her schoolwork, managing her friendships, and dealing with a changing body and hormones. She's got a lot on her plate.

I sincerely hope you don't tell her she is "bloody dippy" or less organised than her little sister.

The not doing chores may be unconnected. She may be choosing to not to them, not forgetting!

The not looking properly for stuff & not packing an extra outfit does sound as if she can't be bothered to make an effort!

I think you need to start getting stuff ready with her, or watching her do it everynight, until it becomes routine.

She also needs a way of reminding herself to take one off stuff to a particular lesson iyswim.

Practise, practise, practise!

Also re the finding a seat in the food hall.

It could be that she needed you to tell her to find a seat & sit down.

It could be that she didn't fancy sitting down & waiting for you.

And yes agree with mellojello too - think maybe just her and cut her a bit of slack /help and accept thats just her.

Thanks for all your thoughts and experiences.

We organised all her stuff for today last night. She got to the end of the drive then had to come back and pick up her PE kit. DD2 and I leave the house 10 minutes after she does. I think I'll make a point of seeing her out of the door rather than her just shouting through and leaving. Get her used to checking for her bags before she goes.

MuttonWasAGoose that made me laugh, dd would probably agree with your ds

theycallmemellojello I most certainly haven't said anything of the sort to her. She does have other issues not mentioned here as they don't apply to this. Her confidence is on the floor, we're working really hard to do something about that, there is no way on earth I would say anything to her like this. However I do say it to myself, and to her dad when she's not around, and to other adults when I'm discussing her.

The food hall thing - she's done it before, we have a roughly one in two chance of her sitting down or her coming back. She knows she can tell me if she's not happy do do something, ie if she hadn't wanted to go off she could/would have said so and there would be no repercussions. I will speak to her though and make sure she's not doing anything that makes her feel uncomfortable. I must admit that because she's been sent off before, I thought she'd be ok with it, but it could be that in this case she wasn't.

It's funny that reading has been mentioned. She was quite late to learn to read and write, she didn't really get the hang of it until towards the end of Y2, a lot . Her teacher at the time seemed to think she was a late bloomer rather than dyslexic. I wonder if that was wrong.

Ds secondary school have removed the choice from parents hands on that score and stated they will only accept items being dropped off in an emergency. If they can't organise themselves they do without. Seems to work well.

Well if she's not that confident that could explain the food hall thing.

Even as an adult I don't really like saving seats especially when it's busy, in case I'm asked to move!

yes defiintely explains the food hall thing. She probably just doesnt WANT to sit there alone.

Harden your heart and carry on as you are doing; if she is forgetting things for school she will pretty soon receive punishments which will focus her mind wonderfully.

I was very much like your daughter at that age because my mother did a great deal of organisation for me, (she was caring for my bedridden grandmother, and we were always in a rush). When my grandmother died my mother took a job, and was not available to run round after me.

I eventually learned to stop day-dreaming, because that is her problem, and organize myself, after some painful experiences at school, and rarely forgot or lost things after that.

"Harden your heart"?

Good grief, the poor kid is only 11 & just started 2ndry school!

I thought that it was quite usual to organise bags the night before with a parent initially.

Has she got a phone? Could she set reminders on it?