To think today was not the day to try and out liberal each other

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

I have some painfully 'right on' types on my Facebook, the sort that make mumsnet look positively right wing.

A few are trying so hard to be 'right on' in their, not anti Paris but I can't think of how else to put it, they're being down right offensive. They are showing such contempt for people being shocked and saddened by the events in Paris that in their rush to do so they're just coming across as utter cunts.

Aibu to think some subjects you just don't do that with?

Well, I changed my pic, because I am obviously French, so it was no question of being a "sheeple" (I hate this word, it was made by snobs).

However, at the risk of making myself look like a bad guy, I will try to explain how I could react to bad news in the world.
First, they are happening all the fucking time. Whether it is a natural catastrophe, a terrorist attack, a shoot-out, whatever, they are omnipresent.
So I will not have the same level of caring to all of them, because if so I would be a puddle of misery and unable to function. This is the price we pay for a Global news system.
My empathy is limited, because I am human and I need to be able to live without the weight of all the world's horror on my mind. My country and my people are my priority. We share our History, our values, our culture, They are part of me. So yes, I will care far more for what happen to them than to any other country.
Then I have the UK. I choose to live in this country because I felt I could meld with it and share its values. I love it, I love the people. If something like what happened yesterday happened here, I think I would be as devastated. Then I have the rest our neighbour countries, that I have visited, where I have a lot of friends. They are more important TO ME than any other far off country. Same thing for Israel and the US: families, very close and loved friends have their home there. So I will cry for them if something bad happen. etc...

This is not to say that on an absolute scale some lives are more worthy than others, it is just that people react to events based on their own experience and personal affinity. That does not make them monsters, that makes them Humans. You see more French flags on Facebook because your network is more French-oriented or western. If you were more African-oriented or Middle-East oriented, your feed on Facebook would look completely different.

(Wow, that was long)

Facebook was ever thus. You'll get the "send 'em all home" brigade on one side, and those trying to out-Corbyn each other on the other. Most people are somewhere in between thankfully - those on my list definitely are.

I have had one person post about how if we are happy to open our boarders we are part of the problem. If we are stupid enough to agree with letting in immigrants and refugees then we are part of the reason why what happened in Paris happened.

I have had another person post a Britain First post about closing our boarders and getting the immigrants out.

Quite saddened by the pair of them.

I completely agree. I'm a very left type but I see nothing wrong with showing solidarity and sympathy for what is going on in Paris when it is so close to us. Because I want to express that does not mean I'm not equally horrified by the murders in other parts of the world.

It is human nature to be more involved in the death of a neighbour, than someone you just read about in a far distant county.

What pisses me off is that you cannot mention the obvious fact it is ISLAMIC extremists involved.

But you can't mention Islam. Cannot even mention it.

Well I will mention the obvious. Peaceful Muslims need to open their fucking eyes to the undeniable connection too.

........awaits banning....

Furthermore, I read an astute comment on another forum.

"it's not really islamaPHOBIA anymore now"

A phobia is an irrational unfounded fear.

Just as I can accept that during the troubles, you couldn't really blame British people for being wary of all irish people.

I strongly recommend that genuine Muslims themselves could be the ones with the power to change this.

Just like the normal irish person became the catalyst for change by condemning IRA, rather than defending them.

Rant over.

Most of us feel more grief about a death at a close neighbour and would be more likely to express our condolences than for a stranger across town who died in similar circumstances.
Let alone a stranger the other side of the world.

If you personally don't feel the deaths in Paris more than any others across the world, try this test:

Suppose instead that far-right terrrorists in Paris had shot dead 129 Muslims and injured 300. Would you wish to express more sympathy & outrage than you do now ?

If so, give your head a wobble.
If not, fine, you just have a broader world view than the rest of us.

How do you know they are? You were the one who said they are discounting whole parts of the world?

As an aside I haven't changed mine but that's not the point.

The level of political discourse on most social media is sophomoric at best.

The best advice is to ignore it.

On the other, noisy self rite push people (on both sides) can pull the debate in their direction by making it appear that the bulk of public opinion is on their side. So do stand and be counted for what you really believe in, just don't bang on about it insensitively.

Rite push = self ritious

Tell me, Washediris, how do you live? Seriously, if you feel the same way when a total stranger dies as when your neighbour or a friend do, how is the grief not crushing you? Because every day, every minute scores of people die. Each of them worthy of the same pain and grief as people close to you, if I apply what you are saying to these events.

People in the West do tend to think about victims in other places and many times are against what their governments are doing. I do wonder however, how many people in places like Saudi Arabia, the Gulf States, Malaysia, Pakistan etc ever think about their governments part in the conflicts worldwide (Saudi Arabia spreading Wahhabism, bombing the shit out of Yemen, Malaysia with it's discrimination against non-Muslim Chinese Malays, Pakistans treatment of non-Muslims, the Gulf States slave trade of non-Muslims etc) and whether they ever grieve the deaths of non-Muslims to the extent that many Westerners greive the death of Muslims. It always seems to be largely one way as if only the West has a history of colonialism and conflict which couldn't be further from the truth.

[]storify.com/JamilesLartey/on-fff This]] sums up what I think of all this liberal sanctimony

storify.com/JamilesLartey/on-fff

Ubik1 I love this one: "Some commentators today honestly sound like tragedy hipsters, "Bro- I care about suffering and death that you've never even heard of" "

Great link Ubik1.

I haven't changed my profile pic on Facebook, or made any 'I'm with you, Paris/France' statuses or Tweets. It's difficult to articulate why. It is not that I do not have sympathy for those affected. But I do feel quite disquieted by the nature of the media / public reaction to all this.

Like I said I find it hard to articulate but here are a few things that have been running through my head:

• Many of the people on my facebook feed with tri-color profile pictures have also been posting Britain First style posts about banning the burqa, petitions to close Britain's borders to refugees, etc. I feel as if one of the overtones of the changing of facebook photos, tweeting under a single hashtag, etc, is to promote a sense of unity. But I don't feel unity with these sorts of attitudes. I'm also deeply concerned about exactly what the official response from Western governments is going to be. I don't feel comfortable publicly declaring myself as "with" that.

• Attacks like these are designed to have a psychological impact as much as a physical one. ISIS want people to be afraid, to get angry. They are trying to engender an "us" vs "them" mentality. Obviously I am against ISIS and everything they do and stand for, but many people's reactions to the attacks has made it clear to me that for many the "them" includes people who are just as innocent as those killed in the Paris attacks.

• Over the past few days Facebook has been this kind of echo-chamber of drama and misinformation. For example there is a facebook post by an 'eyewitness' being shared that comes from an account that was only just set up, attached to a name with no other hits on Google. At times like this I prefer to step back from social media and avoid commenting because I worry that it's very easy to get caught up in a (manufactured) sense of fear and drama that accentuates the negative reactions mentioned above. This is not to say that the fear and pain of people caught up the attacks is not very real - but that I think social media can serve to heighten the emotions of people who are several steps removed from what is happening, and less scrupulous people take advantage of that, either by falsifying posts or by sharing hugely inflammatory ones.

I don't know. I also chose not to wear a poppy this year, because I personally feel that the discourse about remembrance has recently shifted towards a glorification of war rather than a reflection on its horrors and the need for peace. I have no problem with other people wearing a poppy, just as I have no problem with people changing their statuses to the tricolor, but I do have a problem with the (implicit) pressure to personally partake in an exercise of symbolism about which I am quite ambivalent.

Tl;dr: People have a diversity of reactions and viewpoints to events like this, and I worry that social media promotes a sense that there is only one correct way to react.

I have changed my FB profile picture, not because I don't care about Beirut, Syria, Russia etc. but because I know people in France and the change of picture is to show solidarity with them. I'm not ashamed to admit that the events in Paris have affected me more than those in other countries - I will find out tomorrow if the people I work with and count as friends are safe.

Pink

I think that's totally reasonable! I also don't have any personal connections to France, so the distinction (between a place you have connection to and a place you don't) doesn't hold for me personally.