To think today was not the day to try and out liberal each other

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

I have some painfully 'right on' types on my Facebook, the sort that make mumsnet look positively right wing.

A few are trying so hard to be 'right on' in their, not anti Paris but I can't think of how else to put it, they're being down right offensive. They are showing such contempt for people being shocked and saddened by the events in Paris that in their rush to do so they're just coming across as utter cunts.

Aibu to think some subjects you just don't do that with?

*They're

All murder is awful.
Yet I think it lacks empathy if people genuinely can't understand why people in the west might be slightly more distressed by the murder of people in restarants/at a concert/watching footy/ in a country where they have many connections/family and friends and which they associate with liberty and peace with a bomb in a city that used to be a byword for war and disaster and they are less likely to have any bonds.

Being honest I think many people don't have actual connections in France but are upset because they see it close to home and possibly could happen to them. As it happened close by to people doing what they do in the same sort of places.

Apart from the obvious sympathies for those who have lost loved ones.

I have seen even worse Washed :(

Not only that people in Paris are more worthy but that those in Middle East as totally unworthy and should all be bombed.
Any posts which try to tackle these attitudes can only help IMO.

I don't think that's what most regular people are saying or feeling though.

There are so many awful things happening every day, if you felt awful over every single one your life would be pretty miserable.

All these things are sickening and heart breaking. Absolutely. but saying you can only feel this way about one incident if you feel the same way about every incident is ridiculous. You'd have no time to live, you'd spend your life being miserable. Because there are far far more horrific occurrences happening daily than the extra ones that have now come to a lot of people attention since Paris.

YANBU

I have people banging on about the nationalism of the tricolore and supporting people, not countries.

I have yet others accusing people of racism if they don't immediately acknowledge the incidents in the Middle East and the inevitable backlash against peaceful Moslems when posting about Paris.

Sometimes they have a point but IMO they are often not showing they care, but showing how much more right on and clever they are than their FL. Gold star for nuanced thinking about complex issues and all that, but bit of a failure in demonstrating empathy.

I think it lacks empathy if people can't see that being murdered is just as awful no matter where in the world you happen to live.

Of course they deserve respect. Where did I say they don't? Every life stolen- whether it's in a market in Baghdad, a hotel in Mumbai, a cinema in USA, is a utter tragedy. Of course.

However, when I next see my friend who is grieving a lost child, I shall take photos of other dead children. If she's not equally upset, I will suggest she is crap and racist.

Helmet that's not equivalent.
Excluding people with direct connections to France, it's simply being more upset about one group of strangers than another because it happened on Western soil.
The whole thing has really depressed me. This is how we get dragged to war - the "othering" of whole sections of humanity.

Someone was stabbed on shooters hill yesterday. It's disgusting that people aren't remembering him too. They don't give a shit, clearly.

I mentioned the contrast between my personal reactions to Beirut and Paris to DH as Paris unfolded. Beirut was on the news as a warzone through my childhood. It's a place I have no real life knowledge of. France (to me) is a peaceful country I've lived in.

For my great grandmother France was a war zone she travelled through and it was also her husband's grave. Different generations , different backgrounds, different perceptions.

The self styled liberals the OP describes are as kneejerk as any group they like to critique.

I don't think it's about saying any one group is more deserving (for most people, for some I'm sure it is)

Thousands of people die every day for any number of awful reasons, starving to death, freezing to death, drinking dirty water, no access to medical care, no money, violence in the home, terrorism, war......

I cannot grieve for all of them in the same way. I cannot carry the weight of the world that way. Doesn't mean I don't think it's all horrific, I do. But can I sit there and think about all these incidences and be sad about every single one? Because there are an awful lot of individuals dying too. I can't. I'd never have a moment to be happy

Washed that's not a fair argument. Just because changing a picture is one way of demonstrating people care, or have empathy doesn't mean there aren't others. It's ridiculous to suggest that doing that for Paris means you don't care about the rest of the world and actually quite offensive I think to suggest people don't care about other things.

Personally I think what has happened in Paris is tragic, families and friends will be mourning now and people will be traumatised. At this moment in time there's not much more that needs to be said.

My feelings of sadness about that don't negate my sadness about other tragedies or suddenly mean I don't care about them nor does it undo the campaigning I've done or arguments I've had or donations I've made - which are all probably more meaningful than changing a photo! But that doesn't make changing a photo wrong, just another small thing to do.

Liberals are also often totally illiberal: they are all for tolerance when it comes to one of their "causes", but stonkingly intolerant of anyone who doesn't agree with them or holds opposing views

This ^^

FWIW I agree with Fanjo that sympathy for the bereaved doesn't necessarily require endless online blathering. That said, surely this must apply in all cases - where some posters are quick to express horror in support of one particular group, their selective silence over others tends to be rather noticeable

France is our nearest neighbour and millions of us have been there and/or learnt French at school. That is why it "closer to home". Because it quite literally is, particularly those in the south of England - it's just across the water, geographically closer than parts of the UK.

It's not to ignore the other atrocities in the world .

Delete social media!

"Liberals are also often totally illiberal: they are all for tolerance when it comes to one of their "causes", but stonkingly intolerant of anyone who doesn't agree with them or holds opposing views"

Then they aren't liberals then. By definition.

I am beginning to think social media is swaying young (and not so young) minds!

Seeing the ideas sweeping back and forth and roundabout reminds me of wind through a field of wheat.

Maybe it's strength though is that people will begin to empathise virtually with the whole world and it won't take a lifetime of meditation to be like The Buddha!

Thank God I am picky about my Facebook feed and I have no Britain First loons to contend with, and nobody telling anyone else that they shouldn't be posting the tricolour because they didn't post the Lebanese flag for the Beirut bombings.

I can completely see why people are much more agitated about what has happened in Paris, though: put up your right hand if you've been to France and then put up the left one if you've been to the Lebanon. Most of you still have a left hand spare to type with, don't you? France is close geographically, it feels familiar - so if it can happen there, it can happen here. That's why people feel afraid and anxious.

What is not right or sensible is forgetting that this sort of crap goes on all the time, or overlooking why it happens.

I actually think that all these Facebook trends are a bit of a red herring. What was printed or not printed in the press earlier this week about other atrocities can't be changed - it's done now, and if the papers were suddenly to start reporting on them tomorrow I suspect that they might be accused of hypocrisy. What surely matters is what happens going forwards. I would be unreasonable and untruthful if I were to claim that what happened in Paris didn't affect me more than what happened in other nations last week - it was obviously utterly horrific. I may be uncomfortable about that fact, but I have to take responsibility for the truth of it. I think it is partly due to human nature; it is also true for example that after DD was born, I felt more deeply distressed by news reports about the death or mistreatment of children. It's also true that when refugees were struggling in the Middle East, I watched the news and thought it was very sad, but only when they got to Europe did I start taking more significant actions. That may not be right, but I would be a hypocrite if I were to pretend otherwise.

However, now that we have felt that horror close to home, now that people we may know have felt that appalling fear and now that we may have lost people we know, isn't that all the more reason to express a greater level of compassion in the future to others who may be feeling next week what we are feeling now? It's not about who said what on Facebook last week - what is that argument going to achieve? However, just as I felt more strongly about children's safety and well being after I had a child, I would hope that we would express greater understanding with anyone in the future who is feeling what we are feeling today. Possibly that is selfish and short-sighted of me, but I am trying to be brutally honest. To fail to express that compassion when we know ourselves now how absolutely horrific it is would surely be genuinely awful.

Well let's agree to disagree then Washed

I do think there's an important point about the scale of reporting which is worth looking at and I think both what and how things are reported is a big issue. I just don't think it's reflective of how much individuals actually care. I also don't think today is the right day to argue about it. Let people mourn first.

Probably I really liked your post.

It's disgusting that those talking about France and Beirut have turned a blind eye and discounted all the women over the world who don't have equal rights - or the three women a week murdered in the uk.

Speaks volumes.