to think drs who recently complained about salaries should be willing to try to get money out of non uk tax payers who use the NHS

[Scoobydoo8]

It really annoys me that drs won't charge people for health care because they want to be seen as mr niceguy or something to do with their hippocratic oath or whatever it's damn unfair that anyone can come to the uk for treatment.

There have been many threads recently complaining about the new low salaries for junior doctors, which were justified, but to then whinge about having to enforce rules to reduce the misuse of the NHS by foreigners make me feel - serves you right.

They claim that it isn't worth trying to reclaim the money but look guys, if people think they will never be charged they will come in their droves, if they think they might be nailed for the cost they might stay at home - obvious imo.

No problem Punk, easily done! thanks for the flowers

Junior doctors have nothing to do with who pays what.

As a medical PA to a consultant I am the one who registers new referrals on to the system as follows:

GP writes/emails a referral. I register it onto the hospital waiting list. I have click on 'NHS' unless GP referral says otherwise (which it never has done in the 29 years I've done the job).

Therefore, GPs are the gatekeepers.

Ripening apples I think the reason your dd didn't get afford the support you wanted is because she was assessed at tier two.
My dd was tier 3 and has had excellent support from camhs , she sees a psychiatrist monthly ( more if very unwell) and a psychologist weekly. Her treatment started the day after we took her to A and E.

It's better to get the money up front surely. so Doctors would be involved. Chasing after the event is bound to be less successful.

I don't know but when a private patient came into where I worked only the radiologist got paid for his report, not the rest of us staff. So I would say they paid for his time but not for everyone else, the maintenance of the equipment, heating of the dept etc etc
That might be why the bills are so low.

It's not as simple as simply checking someone's nationality or passport. Many countries have reciprocal agreements with the NHS. I'm live in NZ and as a UK citizen I could have given birth here for free under the reciprocal agreement. But if my baby had needed extra care, we would have been charged. I had health insurance but this did not cover those costs. So you need to establish nationality, visa status, where the treatment counts as 'emergency' etc....

It's bloody complicated and healthcare staff do not have the time for it.

But it's like everything, if no one is ever caught, everyone will take the mickey. If there is a possibility of being caught fewer will take the risk and others may not come to the UK at all to try to get free treatment.

Let's face it no one risks swanning off to the USa without cover.

AndNowItsSeven. I realise that but she was escalating and I'm quite sure she would have become Tier 3 if professional support hadn't been put in place to prevent it. That's what's so awful. I also don't think a Primary Health Worker should be making that call. The psychiatrist felt dd needed anti-depressants and that there was a very real problem.

I'd have accepted the Tier 2 call if there was some advice and support around referral to a private therapist/counsellor. I do not accept under any circumstances that it's acceptable to tell lay parent to find that support using the internet.

I'm very sorry your daughter was picked up through a&e and is diagnosed as tier 3 by CAMHS. It's a difficult thing to have to face.

FWIW the trust we are under hasn't even noted which tier they felt dd was. Our GP was extremely surprised she was offered anything at all - not because she didn't need it, the GP felt she did very much, but because CAMHS here is so poor and offering so little to anyone.

I did.

Everytime my dds have needed to see the gp in the uk I have filled out a 'visitors' form . This form has NOT asked for a equivalent of a NI number or a copy of their Italian medical cards or E111. I have always offered it. Italy has an agreement with the Uk to reclaim costs. I often wondered how it would be reclaimed !!!! ( we are also insured). DH had some holdiay vaccinations a good few years ago. He was charged - and quite rightly.

Scooby
Which bit of
the data does not support your hysteria do you not get?

And to those moaning about people who have not paid enough tax within 2 years to justify getting the NHS

how much tax have your children paid?

Lots of love, A Doctor.

I dont find Scooby hysterical at all, Im with her fully on this. She's front line and knows what goes on. Friend is a practice manager in a GP's and what goes on where arseholes try it on day in day out would be laughable if it weren't true.

What on earth has it got to do with how much tax children pay?

Can I have a cup of tea with all those buscuits

biscuits.

Yabu.
I work in NHS hospital and there are departments within my trust who deal with this. It should not be the responsibility of junior doctors.
In the area that I work (very specialised and intensive and therefore expensive!) I actually look after more British families who pay nothing into 'the system' than non UK nationals..... and the ones who don't work and therefore don't pay, expect the most out of the NHS (sweeping generalisation I know but this has been my experience!)

Bottom line is, you can't keep a patient shackled to a bed until they cough up. They can leave, and we do not have the beds to keep them in beds. I am not a clinical member of staff, I work in Finance, so I know very well how difficult it is to actually get cash from people who a) have none or b) disappear off the face of the earth.

I also spend loads of timing finding information for the media about how many overseas patients fail to pay their bills each year under FOI requests. Unsurprisingly, lots of them don't pay, because they die before they have chance to. Many do pay and have payment plans set up, but the media don't care about those.

The amount of money lost to overseas patients is very small compared to what the NHS needs to stay afloat with the demographics we have going on in this country. I would much rather a doctor or nurse focuses on treating their patient than getting all stressed because they don't know if they can get them to pay up or not. Their priority is to care for patients, and that's how it needs to stay.

I wonder why the gov are going down this path then. Perhaps just hoping the publicity will be a disincentive to foreigners coming for treatment.

Who knows!

Or perhaps it's some way of stopping visitors taking out the EU EHIC card to pay for treatement in their own country.

Scooby it's not rocket science - they want a handy headline or two that will create a bogyman to blame when the NHS is in its knees this winter.

Collecting the money owed from foreigners is the right thing to do (as long as urgent cases are treated). But quite often it already happens! And anyway expecting doctors to do it is wrong. It is an administrator's job.

I don't understand your comment about the EHIC card, I don't think you understand what it does. Do you have one?

Possibly the Gov will have a rant bit of publicity about this then generously and publcly decide that our doctors are too busy to implement it.

But what's happening to the nhs is happening to all our public services.

OP, I thought you'd fucked off?

As the dog returneth to its vomit....