To ask those who voted for the conservatives ....

[ginorwine]

Reading the threads here there is much criticism about conservative policy .
A lot of people must have voted for them .
Where are they on mums net ?
And on threads such as those re the w t c cuts are they not representing their views as it was clear this would happen ?
I can tell that they may be slated but surley differing views can be expressed so long as it doesn't get nasty - a know that feeling run high but surley ppl can do so .
So to Tory voters -is it how you anticipated .what are your views ?

I feel like any family which tries to live within its means. That it is in the best interest of everyone. YOu can't live on air otherwise you end up like Greece which is where Labour would have taken us. That would damage the least fortunate very much. That is why a Tory vote is a vote to help the less fortunate and ensure the security of the poor.

The Greek comparison is erroneous and if you are using it, it means your understanding of economics is very poor. We are nowhere near doing a Greece, our debt rating is AA, our % of debt to GDP is lower than Germany's, The USA etc etc. Using Greece actually negates your argument.

"That is why a Tory vote is a vote to help the less fortunate and ensure the security of the poor."

Which is the opposite of what the generally conservative economic think tanks Adam Smith Institue and Insititue for Fiscal Studies say. Sam Bowman of the ASI said: “The government has long claimed to want to make work pay for everyone, but cutting tax credits would disincentivise work and hurt those at the bottom of society.”

So the tax credits could mean people are forced on to JSA rather than working to "help themselves", so there is your argument in tatters, and you're a lawyer? Pah...

Not really but think what you like. If a nation spends what it doesn't have it gets in a mess. The people know that and voted Tory.

Farmers didn't exactly get 'bail outs' for foot and mouth ...if the state hadn't offered compensation to farmers they would be tempted to hide the fact they had infected cattle and prolonging the outbreak - instead of reporting it and therefore having their whole herd slaughtered.
I doubt any farmer who cared about their animals (as a lot actually do) and had invested years - sometimes generations into building up a herd and breeding etc would have been jumping up and down with glee - they would rather have their animals than the money.
Personally I don't think the banks should have been bailed out...but the farmers and foot and mouth was completely different. (You could also argue that if it wasn't for cheap imported meat it wouldn't have been a problem in the first place
And the steel industry wasn't sustainable long term - there was a very insightful post earlier (can't remember who made it) about why it wasn't... and the unions should take some blame for that.
As should everyone who wanted cheap things and didn't/doesn't buy British where they can (a bit like that cheap imported meat with poorer welfare standards that caused foot and mouth - because you want a Chinese takeaway...but you don't want to pay for it.)

"If a nation spends what it doesn't have it gets in a mess. The people know that and voted Tory"

No the people buy into the "household" narrative of national economics and its a very basic and incorrect way to view it.

Your argument which is always self reliance has been redressed by the ASI and IFS who say that this will effect the poorest much more, increasing relative poverty. How does that help the poor? How does it help people rely on themselves.

Also the "self reliance" argument falls completely when you look at the tax breaks, aid and subsidies paid to firms, the number of pet industries (Grouse moors?) that have had their subsidies increased under this government. Either we have self reliance for all or none, not the poor getting hit for the expense of the rich. We can't say its your fault you are poor whilst subsidising the profits of the firms and giving tax breaks and subsidies to the pet projects of the wealthy.

How bout creating jobs by building our own high speed rail? How bout doing it with our own Nuclear Power? How about paying fair wages? Why not go for things that are for social justice rather than for a get rich quick scheme for those at the top?

Oh and farmers did need a bailout agreed, but as with the city there were lots of nefarious practices going on to get around restrictions at the time. The bailout in 2001 created 34 new millionaires over night! They also recieve large subsidies at the minute so ......

So some farmers either retired on their money (heart no longer in it) or spent the money replacing their stock - one dairy cow costs about £1.5k (and they are cheap at the moment). A few hundred cows and loss of income ...not surprised there were some millionaires. There would be a lot of small farmers who got nothing like that.

Just like there are the vast majority of CT recipients who aren't skivers, as the ASI and IFS have said they use they free child care, they work, they will not be better off, and less incentivised to work.

Hard work pays?