To Think The UK is a Racist Country and the racism is deeply ingrained.

[ACoolDad]

For the last couple of weeks BBC Three has been running documentaries about racism and racial tensions in the U.K and USA. This week we saw a program called "Is Britain Racist?" it failed to prove much apart from black men are seen as more likely to steal from shops and women in Burka's are more likely to face verbal abuse.

As a second generation Black Briton from Jamaica, I have faced racism many times, I do believe the UK is a racist country but it is a in the closet type of racism that is hard to prove. The UK unlike the USA has a type of racism in which few people are openly racist, but racism is deeply ingrained into are mindsets as the program explored.

The presenter who comes across as a very anti racist person still perceived black people as dangerous sub consciously when she had her brain scanned. You have to ask why? You have to ask why black people have been sub consciously viewed as angry, violent and criminals.

I am so proud of my family and my black, mixed and white children and stepchildren. My family represent the tolerant modern Britain that we have and should be proud of.

My son aged 15 was stopped and searched two weeks ago. My white stepson aged 15 has never been stopped and searched, despite them wearing similar clothes, my black son has been profiled by the same mentality explored in the documentary. The type of racism is so difficult to fight as it is so difficult to prove it is racism.

Britain comes across as a country that is improving in terms of race, but I believe certain people and aspects of the media always have to push the idea of white supremacy in different forms. In the past it was considered that black individuals were considered less intelligent now it is considered blacks are more likely to be criminals.

It would be interesting to hear what you think.

Bertie, I know! Fuckers

I am Irish and lived in London for 20 years. It was pretty grim being Irish in the uk in the 80's and 90's because obviously we were all IRA bombers of course . It has got better there for Irish people but there is still white privilege and racism.

I now live in NI and the racism is shocking towards anyone "foreign". Now, not everywhere but it is here. Obviously our "dear leaders" aren't of help. Anyone in the rest of the uk aware of this little gem?

www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/peter-robinson-i-wouldnt-trust-muslims-devoted-to-sharia-law-but-i-would-trust-them-to-go-down-to-the-shops-for-me-30313447.html

BTW I am in a "mixed marriage" as I am a Catholic and DH is Protestant. He was actually given a leaflet on dealing with mixed marriage and its impact on his family, children, society etc Cos he married a "chucky".

The police are really shocking at dealing with racist complaints.

My parents were verbally and nearly physically assaulted by a middle aged woman when they visited and took my children to a local park. She abused them in front of my children who became hysterical. They did not respond they were so shocked. I say nearly physically as my parents are elderly and the woman was wagging her finger so close to their nose she was very aggressive and could have easily shoved my mum has she responded. She said things like "go back to the gutter you come from" and similar stuff. The attack was totally unprovoked. Unless you call talking in a different language an provocation.

I called the police and they went round, as I know where the lady lives (small village, worked out who she was, even though I don't know her personally). She gave the police verbal abuse too and they just came back and said there was no point in pressing charges as it would be her word against my parents. And the kids were too young to be involved and what was the point of it anyway. So the foul woman got away with it and my parents are now scared to walk around when they come, in case she abuses them again.

I never let any racist comment however minor pass me by even by taxi drivers. If we tolerate it we condone it. It's vital particularly for those of us in very mixed areas that we fight against it. It is important our children treat everyone equally too. However I don't think the UK is anything like as bad as some countries which might be why 1m+ people want to move here. We don't have the Indian caste discrimination here on the whole. We don't have sunni and shia killing each other here. We don't have hindi/muslim fighting. We just tend to get along in a meritocracy.

However we need to reserve the right to fight sexism and some races from other cultures have very sexist objective disgusting views of women and we need to ensure that our right to mock, criticise and denounce those practices trumps any racism allegations.

I was stopped by the Police here once in a very dodgy area, lots of us in a car, known drug and prostitution location (where I worked, lucky me). I got out of the car (a total no no for Black men) said in a plummy accent, "sorry Officer, is there a problem". He said, "no", got back in his car and drove away. So, yes, white privilege.

The OP is about ingrained racism and the anecdote above is just another example out of many many about the systemic racism that exists in our society

People seem to get very defensive whenever White privilege is brought up. I've seen it before on MN. Part of the 'white fragility' article linked above I guess. It's a real thing.

Sadly OP I think you're right. My family (who are from a very white, rural part of England and rarely see, let alone interract, with anyone non-white), are shockingly racist and bigoted. Sometimes I forget and then they come out with something that leaves me speechless and I feel really depressed that English people in 2015 still hold such ignorant views. I really hope I haven't subconsciously absorbed any of their bile.

I've always chosen to live in big cities and met, worked and made friends with people from all over and various different backgrounds and ethnicities. My DH is a white, Catholic forriner and that's been hard enough for my family to deal with. I can only imagine what they'd have said behind our backs if he'd been non-white.

I think you're right, OP. I live and work in a very traditional, white British country town. Up until recently, you never saw anyone who wasn't white around here, and some people are shockingly racist towards anyone who isn't local. It's awful.

I work with the public, and a colleague of mine is always making comments about people not speaking proper English, people who should "go back to where they came from" and "using all the NHS resources" etc etc. The ignorance is astounding, and these are people who are middle-class and otherwise well-educated.

I ignore it, because if you confront it, they just try and deny it. These are people who openly voted UKIP and liked Nigel Farage. It makes me shudder that I work and live with people like that. If you don't talk to them about it, they come across as really lovely people, but the racist side just makes me want nothing to do with them. And they wonder why I don't want to associate with them publicly outside of work!

And a as usual, a lot of white people here trying to dictate what is and what is not racism!

How they've experienced racism without understanding 'structural' racism and how any racism they may have received has very little effects on them.

How being white Irish or as usual white Jewish, oh and now even white polish (although you can hide all of these facts) is the 'same' as being black? Are the stop and search or police brutality figures for Irish or polish people the same as for black people? No.... Why do you think that is then? Can every police officer with 'racist' views towards Irish people tell they're Irish through thier car window? If not, how comes???????

Do you even understand the dictionary definition for racism. Why are you in such s rush to make this a 'me too' conversation and turn this debate into yours?

How the UK is not racist or any racism only exists in small towns.

How multicultural cities automatically means racism doesn't exist and is not prevalent because 'they've never experienced it'.

Basically a lot of white people AS USUAL telling us with 'conviction' the way it is because you know, they have experience of being black!!!!!

That's the bit that still surprises me. The absolute comfort for white people to feel thier thoughts override your experiences and that your outlook on YOUR life and any racism you have received is basically short sighted and a result of that chip on your shoulder rather than the racist society you live in!

Amazing!

Again perfectly explained by white privilege and the cultural imperialism that enables that.

Of course racism is a one way street. That programme demonstrated it very well

Grazia your post is a great example of that 'well meaning' imperialism which single handedly manages to place your thoughts and feelings above those of the people that HAVE experience of racism and are TELLING you their experience. In one breath you say we must challenge it and you've taken it upon yourself to narrow your idea of racism down to taxi drivers. In the next you say its not as bad here as other countries. How does any of that feed into the OP's question? Comparing Britain to the rest of the world is another point altogether. That WAS NOT the question. Why do you feel it your right or even duty to 1. Explain the typical scenario in which racism occurs thus explaining what racism is and 2. Give any feedback whatsoever on how racist Britain is in comparison to other countries. Your post is entirely self satisfying AND to me reads 'its REALLY tolerant here mainly. There's a few old school taxi drivers but 'I'M' telling you that you should be grateful that this is as good as it gets'.

Just so you know, the taxi driver racism or even that of the EDL twats is exactly the kind of racism I prefer.

For those genuinely interested in understanding what you will NEVER experience but what EVERY black person and some POC is trying to tell you in the race conversation, this is a good read.

Another I didn't feel brave enough to be as outspoken as you but for what it's worth I agree.
These types of threads without fail
Have people minimising racism experienced by BME people with xactly the things you said: other countries are worse, white people get racism too, black/Asians have a chip on their shoulder, it's because of crime, it's not like that in the cities etc etc

m.huffpost.com/us/entry/7770652

You know I do agree, but I think racism goes several ways. I am white (not british) but have experienced racism from people of African heritage. It goes in all directions, between white of different cultures, any shade of brown to black.. Everybody's at it! However I think UK is far from the worst at racism.

Ego I'm a black, muslim woman.

Racism
Religious intolerance
Sexism

Affect my life in THAT order.

I am sharing my experiences on racism and in that breath I am not prepared to bring others warmth in the notion that 'they' know what it's like. That would be lying and doing this debate and any potential progression in the discussions of race a huge injustice!

The same if I were to have a discussion with a christian about religious hate or a man about feminism.

I believe the OP was discussing racism from a 'BLACK' perspective.

I would like to challenge white people and anyone else to have 'THAT' discussion.

I suspect that the reason it is typically so hard is because it requires the acceptance and evaluation of white privilege with the understanding of the ways in which your life has and will be easier than mine and even more heartbreaking, our children's!!!

You've summed up this thread perfectly another

Also the posts about being white and experiencing racism from minorities are wrong. That's not racism. Being called a white slag isn't racism. It's a temporary prejudice. Your whole world hasn't been blackwashed you live in white supremacy.

. Enjoy, people who think it goes both ways.

chipstick renieddolodge.co.uk/?p=842

There's no such thing as reverse racism.

Did you click the link, Ilike?