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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think 5yr old shouldn't be taught creationism in a state school?

123 replies

sparklewater · 01/10/2015 12:44

Exactly that really. Our primary is not supposed to have any religious leaning at all - but the headmistress is quite religious and so we have close ties with the local church etc. That's fine, community spirit, etc.

However, I keep finding out little things - such as saying Amen at the end of assembly (which suggests there has been a prayer) and that the weekly singing assembly is hymn-based. Yesterday, dd suddenly started telling me how the world began (with God saying let there be light, apparently) and said that God is everyone's father.

I've tried to explain it's just one option but WIBU to talk to the school?

OP posts:

DisappointedOne · 02/10/2015 10:18

Whether you like it or not this is still a Christian country.

Is it? How so?

BertrandRussell · 02/10/2015 10:19

"and... now I think about it, I know that if my son (who has been at school for 4 weeks) ends up in a position at the harvest festival where he is asked to put his hands together and pray then I will be thinking very seriously about asking for him to be exempted from the praying stuff."

The trouble is that he will then also be exempted for the utterly enchanting wearing of a cauliflower shaped hat he has made and singing a harvest hymn in front of the parents. In many schools you can't opt them out of the God stuff without also opting them out of some lovely things

InimitableJeeves · 02/10/2015 10:20

Whether you like it or not this is still a Christian country. What the frig are you so afraid of? Surely stories about 'mythical' 'sky fairies' are harmless?

But in practice only a tiny proportion of Christians in this country believe in creationism - so why is it OK if small impressionable children are taught that creationist theory in fact represents the truth?

And is this really a Christian country? I know that's the theory, but wouldn't the churches be rather fuller on Sundays if it was actually the case?

MaidOfStars · 02/10/2015 10:32

Can you exempt your child from RE, should you wish to, if you know the lessons include teaching belief as fact?

AbeSaidYes · 02/10/2015 10:40

"In many schools you can't opt them out of the God stuff without also opting them out of some lovely things"

The last advice I got was to request that he be withdrawn from the prayer part but not from the assemblies. though how workable that would be I don't know.

I think I will probably end up telling him quite frankly that the praying bit is just a silly thing people do but it doesn't change anything and that it is not God that gives us food - he's just a made up story - then take him to the allotment and talk about who he thinks really grows the food and how the sun and the rain helps etc.

CloudsofBrick · 02/10/2015 10:51

Gosh this makes me terribly uncomfortable. Thinking back to my childhood, I loved singing hymns and I remember praying (or at least bowing my head and looking at what everyone else is doing out of one eye).

It didn't affect me. I've been a headstrong atheist for as long as I can remember. However, my child goes to school next year, and I am super uncomfortable with the idea of them being told to pray and practising a Christian mentality in assemblies, albeit a light version for primary children. As others have said, I wouldn't want him to be removed from the lovely stuff, so it might be a case of having a wee word and letting him know it's a pile of nonsense.

redstrawberry10 · 02/10/2015 10:57

Whether you like it or not this is still a Christian country. What the frig are you so afraid of? Surely stories about 'mythical' 'sky fairies' are harmless?

I don't like it. I would prefer a secular country.

I am afraid of further encroachment of religion in my life. I dislike that I, someone who pays my taxes in full, has 2/3 the school choice of a christian. I am afraid of Britain instituting blasphemy laws. I am afraid of segregation of children by religion. I do not want the CoE to receive special treatment, tax breaks, etc.

just to list a few.

TheSwallowingHandmaiden · 02/10/2015 11:21

I'll bet you atheist Lefties are just dying for your tiddlies to learn about transgender parenting at primary school though, eh?

Propaganda? Don't make me laugh.

TheSwallowingHandmaiden · 02/10/2015 11:23

...if you're afraid of all that under centuries of the CofE you must be terrified of the march of Islam, no? Or do you reserve your disdain for Christianity?

MaidOfStars · 02/10/2015 11:26

The Swallowing Handmaiden

I'm not sure why learning to respect any and all parent/gender conformations should be linked to ones theist position. Can you clarify?

AbeSaidYes · 02/10/2015 11:29

"I'll bet you atheist Lefties are just dying for your tiddlies to learn about transgender parenting at primary school though, eh?"

you meant to sound rude, yes?

I don't call myself an atheist, I just don't have any religion.
I think it's important that my children learn about all sorts of things, not least so they don't turn into horrible nasty adults. You don't need religion to achieve this.

AbeSaidYes · 02/10/2015 11:31

"Or do you reserve your disdain for Christianity?"

and this is not actually about Christianity. It's about the way in which all religions are taught and the difference (Which has been pointed out lots of times in this thread) between teaching as fact and teaching as a lesson about religions.

TheSwallowingHandmaiden · 02/10/2015 11:31

Yes I can. There are some things tots should not be taught - that is your argument. Lots of non-mumsnetters would prefer it if their six year-old was not taught that Caitlyn Jenner marrying Frank Maloney is a really normal state of affairs.

InimitableJeeves · 02/10/2015 11:35

Why does being atheist automatically make someone a "Leftie"?

And what a childish term anyway.

CloudsofBrick · 02/10/2015 11:35

I take it you mean that tots SHOULD be experience religion as part of their school day? For what reason?

CloudsofBrick · 02/10/2015 11:36

Extra 'be' there!

InimitableJeeves · 02/10/2015 11:37

Swallowing, where has anyone indicated that they're afraid of children being taught creationism? I can see people disliking it, objecting to it and believing that it is wrong; where is anyone exhibiting fear?

TheSwallowingHandmaiden · 02/10/2015 11:37

Abe, please quit the disingenuosity. The pp I was addressing was demonstrably referring to Islam when she spoke of her fears of women being unable to drive etc. This thread bloody well IS about Christianity, because you are too craven to slab off any other religion.

I'm leaving the thread as it will now take the yawnsomely predictable route of hysteria where shouts of 'racist' will be yelped. You are afraid of Christianity. You hate Christianity. You abhor the idea of a patriarchal God thwarting your little Sophie's chances of becoming something other than a hairdresser or a SAHM. Yes, we get it...

InimitableJeeves · 02/10/2015 11:38

And, Swallowing, on what basis does not wanting creationism to be taught equate with wanting "tots" to be taught about transgenderism?

InimitableJeeves · 02/10/2015 11:42

Hmmm, Swallowing, before you disappear perhaps you could explain why you felt you had to join MN or change names just to come and abuse people on this thread?

CloudsofBrick · 02/10/2015 11:43

Bore off, Swallowing.

TheSwallowingHandmaiden · 02/10/2015 11:46

Yes, my name is FanOfSpam and I fancied a name change as I'm a little tired of being asked why I love shit meat substitutes when 'spam' spelled backwards is 'maps' and I'm a cartographer

MrsGentlyBenevolent · 02/10/2015 11:50

Swallowing - I for one have said many a time, I don't care which made up Middle-Eastern religion is being preached at me, all of it is nonsense in my opinion and will say so when asked. Along with every other religion, from Hinduism to Scientology, all rubbish to me, created and used to control people's fears and highten their prejudices. As you seem to prove. I'm not afraid to say it - however, Christianity is the one discussed here, because that's the one that most state British schools use as part of assembly, when many believe no religion should be preached in school. Respecting other human beings is a different matter though - that should always be taught, whether it's respecting others' right to believe in god, or their right to live their lives as they please (as long as it does not hurt others, which transgenderism does not).

redstrawberry10 · 02/10/2015 11:51

I'll bet you atheist Lefties are just dying for your tiddlies to learn about transgender parenting at primary school though, eh?

The thing is, transgender parenting is a real thing. Demonstrably happens. I've seen it. it actually exists. But I guess in your world that doesn't count for much.

if you're afraid of all that under centuries of the CofE you must be terrified of the march of Islam, no? Or do you reserve your disdain for Christianity?

Yes. Totally. I am terrified of it. far more than I am of the CofE.

Your leftist conspiracy theory falls apart with at least me.

MaidOfStars · 02/10/2015 11:52

Lots of non-mumsnetters would prefer it if their six year-old was not taught that Caitlyn Jenner marrying Frank Maloney is a really normal state of affairs

Would you argue that those same Mumsnetters would object to their children being taught to respect that marriage?

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