middle class

[southeastastra]

why is it so important for them to all conform to a certain standard

the right playschool, the right school, university, job

the right clothes, politically correct opinions, cars. does it not get suffocating to conform?

I'm middle class - I do also love it - but I really had no choice in the matter. I was born to University educated parents, with middle class jobs/lifestyle. I went to University, did a professional job and married a man I met at University, who also came from a very MC background.

Interesting to read that, as well as having a liking for hummus, we're also the reason for the downfall of the global economy

Mrsfrumble, that's exactly what it is, with garlic and olive oil in the middle. I'm so sorry you have to shop at Walmart. I hope at least there's a Target near by.

Interesting to read that, as well as having a liking for hummus, we're also the reason for the downfall of the global economy

But, the consumption of humus and the accompanying pita chips must be well up. At least that's something.

In Canada where I grew up (and where I am right now - I am visiting my mum for a bit) we kind of don't have working class / middle class / upper class I don't think.

I mean, we have rich people and people who are not well off, we have white collar and blue collar jobs, we have left wing and right wing political parties but I think we are all middle class or working class. I struggle to think who the Canadian "upper class" would be - which begs the question, if there is no upper class then how can you have middle and lower classes?

What do you Americans think? I think America has something closer to upper classes with all the Rothschilds and Rockerfellers and Carnegies and things. Kennedy clan? Would they be upper class? In any case a lot of it seems tied to wealth and (political) power and influencce, which is not really the case in the UK.

And olives, steff - don't forget the olives.

They closed all the Targets in Canada. A sad day indeed.

They closed the Target in my town, it was the oldest one in my state. :( I now have to drive 20 minutes to get to a Target. But I least I can get to one. I'm sorry for you, Hearts.

Grayson Perry did a very interesting documentary about exactly this OP.

www.channel4.com/programmes/in-the-best-possible-taste-grayson-perry/episode-guide

This is the 'middle class' episode:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=DFi7PFVVeWk

My favourite quote is 'You always have to make sure that you're one step ahead of George at Asda'.

And olives, steff - don't forget the olives.

I have green olives stuffed with blue cheese in my fridge right now..

Americans are all middle class. Otherwise all the politicians would not be able to keep going on about helping the middle class.

Seriously, there is class in the US, but it is closer to what Hearts describes for Canada than what it is in the UK. For example, Carnegies and Kennedys come from self-made fortunes from families that were definitely not upper or even middle class in their countries of origin.

We do Steff. There's a SuperTarget about a 30 minute drive away, but I try and avoid it because I love Target and I end up buying all sorts of extraneous crap like clothes and home wears that I didn't plan on. That doesn't happen in Walmart, as I don't favor Tshirts with slogans about loving hunting season and Jesus.

steff ooh garlic please.

I'm Herts born and bred (with very definite mc parents, Tory voters and everything!) but DH is from Bridgend so I think that pulls me down a couple of rungs on the class ladder. Although he does work in Hammersmith and earns about 3x what I do so it gets a bit confusing sometimes . Does anyone remember the BBC class test a couple of years ago? I came out as "elite" - I nearly choked on my caviar!

Also love the fact we have wilkos and morrisons down here now

I'm a social climber. Came to England not being able to speak English and parents (for a while) having to rely on benefits. We were political asylum seekers. Parents found jobs and we made the most of the education system that was offered. That was over 30 years ago. Now I'm on a £100K+ job (few women are and I'm proud to be one of those) and I love being middle class. I'd rather be comfortable than not. I'm doing all that I can so that my children can also be ''middle class'' as I know what it's like to be without.

I'm exactly the sort of MC that is so often lampooned on MN (and wider) - left wing, not into labels or overly materialistic, but very into education, the arts etc. I shop occasionally at Waitrose, but mainly Tesco online.

Funnily enough, I just started watching that Grayson Perry thing, and I used to live on Kings Hill. We moved to a little Kentish village a while back - because Kings Hill really is very, very strange neat.

"Cookie*, all joking aside, I think that's amazing.

Lemon some bits of Bridgend are very well to do, others, not so much.

Steff13 Thanks Steff! I can say I got to where I am by working incredibly hard at school and beyond. Getting good grades help :) Seriously though, I'd like to give back to society somehow (when I have the time and I don't at the mo, have two very young dcs). It's a middle class thing to do charity work too isn't it?

I volunteer at an animal shelter, and I'm a Court Appointed Special Advocate for kids who've been taken into foster care, so I'd say yes! :)

Greenwood, GP kind of recognises two kinds of middle class people. Those who think that their money makes them middle class and those whose education (and to an extent for some, money) makes them middle class.

I found that documentary eye opening. Because I really don't fit into a 'box' for class. I guess I'm working class now but my background is probably education based middle class edging towards upper class.

I would never, ever dream of referring to somebody who was a steel worker or a factory hand as being common or look down on them.

But those people on King's Hill, yes, I really do. I think their 'I'm upper class because I have the income' and 'You have to have a Range Rover Vogue and Prada shoes and keep one step ahead of George at Asda' are crashingly common purely because they value monetary display so much.

I have known some proper posh people in my my lifetime and they would totally look down their noses at someone who spent £16 on a Heal's washing up bowl instead of getting one at a pound shop.

Kings Hill was totally like that - I think I'd probably fall into the 'Tunbridge Wells' MC - I didn't feel at home on Kings Hill at all. Dh used to say it was full of the nouveau riche, a bit too blingy. I knew a fair few people there, and went to a lot of the houses - they were all exactly the same, perfectly decorated, minimalist. Someone commented on ours once - oh you're the first people I've seen with books on display!

However, I'm constantly called a bleeding heart liberal on MN, for, like, caring about stuff.

My DDad comes from a long line of farmers in rural Quebec. My DMum was a Barnardo's Child in the UK in the 1940's and 50's. Both were from decidedly working class families. DMum emigrated to Canada when she was 20 or so with $25 in her pocket. Both were the first ones from their families to go to university. DBro and I were definitely raised "middle class" (but without all the brand names ) So "working class" to middle class in a generation.

Huh ? Upper class/middle class meddling? In what? Education is never a bad thing either, knowledge empowers people. I feel you are trying to make a point. But badly. Or if its just that you loathe the middle class, ok then. Its the educated Victorian upper and middle classes that bought in sweeping social reform for the staggering levels of poverty in that era y'know.

It's a bit of a wide ranging term though isn't it? DstepF would say he was middle class. He went to boarding prep and public school. His DM went to finishing school and 'came out' (into society, not as gay!!) and all that malarkey. Yet round here social workers, teachers and middle managers with DC at the local comp are also seen as middle class.

So which middle class are you talking about OP? Upper middle, middle middle or lower middle? Because they look quite varied to me!

Perceptions are strange things. My steelworker dh earns considerably more than me with a profession (even when I worked full time).