AIBU to think that most of us take the NHS for granted?

[Kampeki]

My niece has recently given birth to twins. They were born prematurely, and both have had breathing difficulties. She and her husband are from a small rural community, and they have very little money. So far, they have exhausted all of their savings to keep the babies in intensive care, as well as all of the savings of her husband's extended family. If we were not able to send them money from here, she would have to take them home.

My dd spent a week in the special care baby unit after she was born, and it was a horribly stressful time, but I didn't even give a second thought to how much her medical care was costing. I took it for granted that she would get the support that she needed.

My niece and her babies will get the help that they need, but I wonder how many other women around the world are forced to take their premature babies home because they can't afford to stay in hospital.

Made me realise how very lucky we are. We must never let the government take our NHS away.

I have had premature twins and was beyond grateful for the loving care and support we all had. We would still be in debt if we had to pay for it.
I do think most people take the nhs for granted though (including me sometimes) maybe not so much the emergency / long term care, but the other bits that seem normal to us - hearing tests at school, health visitors clinics, free prescriptions for children.

There will always be people who take something for granted if it is free, I'm not sure what the answer to that is but it IS infuriating. However I work in the NHS and for every one ungrateful patient there are 10 incredibly grateful ones.
And I think I'd prefer to put up with the ungrateful ones rather than have people scared or put off accessing healthcare because of the cost!

Exactly Kimbomc, there's a perception that it's either everything free at point of service for everyone all the time, or a deeply flawed US model. I would prefer a European model with relatively low cost insurance for elective and non emergency treatment, and excellent socialised medicine for emergency and life threatening conditions. They have better outcomes overall and much higher satisfaction at relatively low cost

I think the NHS is amazing - it has saved my life 2x now and I have had nothing but excellent care from the hospitals and staff. Despite being in a supposed useless NHS trust, my recent treatment meet every recommended timescale. I'm also really grateful that having had a cancer diagnosis I don't have to pay higher insurance premiums for other treatment in the future.

I would happily pay a small cost for GP appointments (£20?) with it means tested and free for children, if it helped keep the service going. And I certainly wouldn't want an alternative system where your ability to pay dictates your treatment completely.

I love our NHS and know we are incredibly lucky to have it. No taking it for granted over here!

Yes I think people do, maybe not so much on life saving situations but day to day stuff.

Missed appointments, seeing a doctor for every sniffle or to get over the counter meds rather than buy them etc.

There should be a small fee for seeing a nurse/doctor and no free prescriptions. Those on long term meds can buy an annual certificate to keep costs down.

Obviously some people do take it for granted - they don't turn up for appointments, they bother their GP with trivial complaints etc.

But I do get annoyed at the implication that because we're lucky to have the NHS we should never complain about it, we should just be grateful. I've seen people on MN describe the most horrendous experiences while giving birth, particularly in postnatal care.

My late father died in his local hospital - a place where despite clearly being very ill indeed he was just left on a full public ward and largely ignored by medical staff. Doctors treated me and my brother as if we were a nuisance for asking questions. The whole thing was massively upsetting. The hospital was later subjected to an inquiry into the way it treated elderly patents, and examples of its poor care regularly turn up in Private Eye. I honestly don't see why I should feel grateful for this.

I paid £1500 for my dog's lumpectomy (have insurance and got it back eventually but still had to find the money upfront). So no I don't take the NHS for granted.
YY to having text reminders - so helpful.

As a nurse I'm frequently thanked and told that people are grateful for the NHS. It's lovely to hear. I think that people who really need it are grateful.

However those who can wait and do have to, due to the massive demand on all services, tend to be the shirty entitled ones.

I am actually more afraid of no free prescriptions than being charged for acute care. The meds I have to take, that keep me functional would cost about £1200 per month if I had to buy them. There isn't a pre-payment card that would make that affordable.

I would either have to not take them and hope that I then became eligible for in patient treatment or, I guess if the government helped people on benefits, I'd just have to give up work. Except as I'm in a relationship I guess he'd be expected to support me and I wouldn't be able to claim that way either.

Right now I have a job I love (not super well paid but professional, creative and v positive which contributes to society), I own my home, have some small savings and generally live a decent life. It is 100% due to the NHS and my access to hugely subsidised meds. Without that, I'd be screwed.

No free prescriptions but keeping charges as they are. The monthly card is £10.80 which if you get 2 or more regular medications makes them affordable.

Adult DS was in a huge amount of abdominal pain. The first hospital he went to were going to do scans and xrays but both were cancelled (on the grounds of cost). He spent over a year going to GP and hospitals (A&E mostly) and nobody knew what was going on. He was even admitted for an appendectomy but a last minute scan showed no problem with the appendix.

When they finally got to the bottom of it, it was a problem with a kidney. Had he been scanned properly the very first time they'd have known what it was and saved over a year of time and NHS money trying to treat him.

Similarly I had cancer and spent 7 months going back and forward to the GP to be fobbed off with "it's IBS". The cost of referring a patient to the hospital comes out of GPs budget so they seem to do anything they can to avoid it. They only referred me because they were fed up with me keep going back because they were adamant it wasn't cancer. I knew it was.

Couldn't fault treatment after that but it shouldn't have taken so long to get a referral.

I have also received appointments in the post the day (or the week) after the appointment date, so I do wonder if that is why some appointments are missed.

I am massively appreciative of the NHS - has cured my mum's cancer, treated my OH for a mental breakdown, and conducted life-saving abdominal surgery on my MIL (as well as treating her ongoing dementia) over the years.

It saddens me that people do no-shows for appointments, turn up for A&E with trivial complaints and abuse front-line staff.

I do think we should charge for no-show appointments, and fine those who take resources away from the emergency services due to drunkenness or abuse.

My brother is a doctor, and his main gripe with the public is an increased tendency to self-diagnose on Google and argue with the medical staff to what is or isn't wrong with them - ten years of training versus an internet search wins out!

America's healthcare system by contrast - a disgrace!

I don't take it for granted, but then I have had serious health problems. If it wasn't for the NHS, I would probably be dead.

If we had accepted a consultant's view (instead of knowing he was wrong and making a complaint which resulted in ds getting the treatment he needed) my disabled son would have continued to be in a lot of pain. Sometimes patients or their carers do know best. In my son's case the consultant may have great expertise in his particular area but not in my son's disability.

That is not to say we haven't had excellent care in other areas.

I really resent the idea that if we don't sing the praises of the NHS, we are somehow ungrateful. No other organization enjoys this hallowed status, and none should imo.

The NHS has let me down badly on several occasions, at both primary care (GP failure to diagnose cancer) and hospital level. It is truly terrifying when you realise that the NHS is the only game in town and if they won't help you, you are screwed unless you can afford private healthcare. In countries like France, this just doesn't happen.

The other thing that massively changed my view on the NHS was living abroad and learning what a high-functioning healthcare system is like. It's a different world and I honestly believe that if more people knew how much better they functioned, we would stop eulogising over the NHS. Even the admin is streets ahead, which is a big deal when it comes to fixing appointments and follow-up.

At best, the NHS does a few things brilliantly, but there is an awful lot of mediocrity and some downright terrible practice (post-natal wards being one example that springs to mind).

Honking - should have said "wins out in most cases".

Another here who is grateful for our NHS. Saved my dds life and saved mine last year when I had an ectopic pregnancy. They were wonderful. They are wonderful. Dds birth was a beautiful experience in my local hospital. No doctors present just her father and a midwife. Birthing pool in a lovely floor to ceiling windowed room on the top floor. I could never in a million years have paid for that. Or the room alone I got afterwards. I'll pay all the tax I need to so others can have it too.

there's a perception that it's either everything free at point of service for everyone all the time, or a deeply flawed US model. I would prefer a European model with relatively low cost insurance for elective and non emergency treatment, and excellent socialised medicine for emergency and life threatening conditions. They have better outcomes overall and much higher satisfaction at relatively low cost

Totally agree. All these the NHS saved my life are missing the point as they are comparing to having no health service.

The NHS is way way behind in western european health systems and won't exist in its current form in the next decade.

No one should have free prescriptions unless they can't afford them.

Kimbonc - do you know how much meds actually cost for many chronic conditions? And these are drugs that keep people alive or in work or functional.

Basic asthma inhalers in the US hit $1000 per year with insurance. Add complications/steroids/etc and you can double that.

Atypical epilepsy meds which don't cripple you with side effects can top $10,000 per year easily. Who can afford that? Good antipsychotics likewise.

I don't think people in this country are aware of the lifeline that subsidised/free medication is. Although, to be fair, I guess if that ended the resulting death toll would cut the burden on the NHS significantly.

Relatively low cost insurance still has co pay. Fine for relatively healthy people. For people like me, co pay would be crippling. I am literally at the hospital or Dr every week.

I have just looked and ds preventer inhaler alone according to the BNF is £60 an inhaler, one inhaler lasts him a month. He is on 8 different medications daily just to keep him stable. Mind boggles how much that lot actually costs. But it keeps him alive and I am very grateful that I don't need to worry about affording it, or fighting with insurance companies to get them.

So in France:
"patients have to pay a flat rate fee for any visit to a general practitioner. The cost in 2012 is 23 € per visit."

"The most significant charge that the patient must pay is an 18€ per day hospitalisation fee, basically a contribution to the board and lodging provided by the hospital. In most cases, most or all of the rest of the bill is paid for by the state health insurance scheme and complementary health programmes."

etc, etc.

All these systems require that you pay some money for most services. Having a chronic illness and being in and out of hospital is very expensive. But it is unsurprising that if you pay more, you get a better service.