To think that teachers should have a sound grasp of spelling and grammar?

[2kidsintow]

I know this is a forum, and that punctuation is used to a greater or lesser extent by various posters because of the more informal nature of the media and that auto-corect can be responsible for a lot of errors if you don't proof read. However, I'm surprised at posts I've read that have garmmatical errors in. The one that sticks in my head at the moment is the 'you and I' rule. A few teacher posters had put 'me and my colleague' or 'me and my boss' on a thread I've just been reading. Is it dialect in some areas to use this phrasing, or just incorrect?

Iggi- if your job is to teach literacy (that is the job of every teacher whatever subject they teach) and role-model good spoken and written English at work, how can you do that job if you can't do those things?

You can't teach driving if you can't drive. You can't teach a foreign language without being able to write, speak and read it. You can't be a chef unless you can cook. Why do you think you can be a teacher if you can not do the things you need to be able to do to teach?

It is not about disability discrimination. It is about having the skills to do the job.

If you are dyslexic to the point where you can not spell, compose accurate sentences, use grammar appropriately - how can you teach children to do so? There may be jobs where dyslexia is no issue whatsoever, teaching is not one of them if the dyslexia is that bad.

We have been put in a postion in my school where a teacher did not declare they were dyslexic although they knew. They had attended a private school where their English results had been 'helped along' by a teacher, at university their course was mainly practical and involved Technology, Science and Maths, they had almost failed their teacher training (they later admitted to us) until their partner began planning lessons for them.

When they started teaching with us they could not cope. Their written English was awful. They could not mark books accurately. They could not plan lessons or manage the work load (because their dyslexia affected their organisational skills). Their classroom was chaotic because they were so disorganised. Eventually, our SENCO said she thought they were dyslexic and they admitted it.

Their union asked us to give them a 40% timetable to accomodate this but pay them as if they were a full-time teacher. We refused and they took legal advice. As they had been asked in the interview if there was anything they had not told us about that might in any way affect their ability to do the job or that we might be able to make adjusments for to help them do the job and they had replied no, the legal advice was they had misled us. They resigned.

Lovely person, not suitable for teaching in a school. Runs a scuba diving company in Australia now.

One of the best teachers at my school has dyslexia. He is meticulous, has a first from Oxford in the subject he teaches and carefully prepares teaching materials and reports often asking someone to proofread for him. Does he make mistakes in exercise books? In all likelihood yes. We have lots of books to mark in not much time. The kids would be losing out if he couldn't teach anymore.

Argh- typical! Excuse punctuation issues.

I think there's a difference between spoken and written grammar, and I'd include the error you mention in the OP as an example of conversational English that is based on dialect. Since I think exchanges on this forum are a conversation, then it's no biggie

In other words, I agree with superam

I've corrected my secondary school English teachers' spelling twice, "computor" and "matress". And yes, they were two different teachers!

I think that English teachers should be correct at all times. I think that many other teachers (including Heads) should have the self-confidence/awareness to have their "mass missives" to pupils/parents checked by the English department. Not bothered if a brilliant Biology teacher makes some grammatical/spelling errors on homework. Am bothered if a school makes itself look collectively sloppy/ignorant. It just seems, well, a bit sad.

I'm not a teacher.

Not many of you are addressing the point to OP is making.

Narp

Why should a teacher be held to a greater level of grammar and punctuation when they are on a forum and off duty?

Boney

I agree with you
(look above my last post)

However, I'm surprised at posts I've read that have garmmatical errors in.

should read:

However, I'm surprised at posts I've read in which there are grammatical* errors.

Here, have this with my compliments

And I agree with Narp It's a forum, an informal medium [note OP "media" is the plural of "medium"], and I think that comment on people's expression is just, well ... naff.

In my classroom my spelling, punctuation and grammar (including spoken) is pretty darn good. In reports and formal written communication it's awesome. On a random forum it's pretty crap. Because I'm not at work and I simply don't put in the same level of effort to both MN and work.

I also swear on here, and wouldn't do that in a classroom! In fact there's loads of things I say on MN is never talk about in school. I don't mention ttc, for instance, or whinge about DP, or have political opinions in my classroom.

Teachers need to be relatively articulate, not least so they can explain clearly and concisely to children. But they do make mistakes, probably because they're human.

OP hasn't replied yet because she is still re-reading her opening post trying to find where the non-existant apostrophe should be

I feel slightly torn about this, because my son had a teacher in year 3 who sent home some pretty egregious spelling errors, but English wasn't his first language and he was fantastically inspirational.

In the case of an English teacher, I would expect something approaching perfection because it should be effortless.

A few teacher posters had put 'me and my colleague' or 'me and my boss' on a thread I've just been reading. Is it dialect in some areas to use this phrasing, or just incorrect?

It's impossible to tell from this context, it could be correct.

The coffee at work distresses me and my colleague.

I know what you mean OP. I am guessing your own errors were deliberate??

We have been looking at primary school websites to help with school choice and have yet to see one without glaring errors.

We know the local reception teacher very well. Her response when I said about this? 'Teachers don't have time to check these things'.

Between the lines... 'We do not know how to get it right in the first place'.

Bottlecap, how is the coffee sentence correct, unless it is spoken in a sort of 'The coffee at work distresses me - and my colleague'.

There is no dialect that justifies such gems as 'me and Sheila went to the cinema'.

As for the 'Me and my Granny' pictures frames...

Catsize- those picture frames are correct as is the coffee sentence. You should check you understand grammar rules before criticising other people's grammar.

Ohhhh you should have proof read your post lol!
I don't think it matters on a forum.
Of course teachers should use the correct spelling and grammar at work. However, my bil is a teacher and he's dyslexic which is why he prefers to do marking on a computer. If it's hand written he may make mistakes. He's a D.T. teacher though so it wouldn't matter as much as an English teacher making mistakes I suppose.

The order of pronouns is a much higher-order rule, and almost certainly not the reason for the OP's distress.

We know the local reception teacher very well. Her response when I said about this? 'Teachers don't have time to check these things'. hmm

In every school I've worked in-it's the admin staff that do the website!

I take a blind eye to admin staff making errors (more out of pragmatism than acceptance). I would have thought that the competition for teaching positions was sufficiently robust to disqualify out of hand those who can't write with proficiency at all times?

Surely that's not extremely difficult for a native speaker of English. This is quite separate from being able to write elegantly, which I've come to realise is an unreasonable demand.

Is it an issue in the hiring procedures, I wonder? Or an issue with the quality of the candidates?