AIBU About Screen Time?

[LadyNym]

I suspect I am being unreasonable but I guess this is the test for just how unreasonable I'm being.

DS1 is three and being assessed for ASD (he definitely has ASD but it's taking an age to get a diagnosis, though it should be at an end soonish). DS2 is 16 months and I have my suspicions but it's too early to tell if he is also autistic. Both boys are hard work.

I used to limit DS1 to no more than about two hours of screen time a day (it was the NHS guidelines I'd read or some other probably arbitrary limit ) but I've gradually increased that until now I'm sure he watches far too much TV and goes on an old laptop now on top of that. It's just so hard to do anything with him. He doesn't 'do' imaginative play so if I get out all his figures he'd prefer to line them up than actually 'play' with them. If he becomes overloaded or bored he starts playing up by basically just doing things he knows he shouldn't over and over (hitting his brother, biting my clothes, throwing toys, running through to rooms he's not allowed into, kicking, tipping out all his toys, finding anything he can reach that he's not allowed etc.). I mean, there are not even seconds in between me stopping him doing one thing to him moving on to the next. Without locking him in a room I don't know how to stop him. He's worse if we've been somewhere or had someone round and his usual routine was interrupted.

And the noise is constant. I know everyone says that about their children but he seriously makes noise all the time. If he's not speaking continuously (his language is very advanced for his age but when he's walking around a lot of it doesn't really make sense; it's more like a stream of consciousness than actual conversation/information), then he's 'verbal stimming' where he'll make various noises (humming one note in short bursts over and over, making a 'brrrr' noise with his lips, cackling, screaming, shouting sounds, babbling) or just hitting/banging things. He'll also randomly scream in his brother's face a lot.

I try to do things with him (drawing, painting, Playdough, making train tracks) but once it's set up he doesn't really like actually playing with things so they don't tend to hold his attention very long. He likes going outside but we're living with my parents at the moment and they have a huge garden (with ponds and concrete steps etc.) so trying to keep him and his brother together and safe is quite exhausting.

I also don't want to do anything that might prompt a meltdown (yesterday he screamed for about 20 minutes and ended up making himself sick because I told him the guy who trimmed my parents' hedge last week was on holiday).

I feel like a shit mum but I don't know how else to get through the day sometimes other than sticking him in front of the TV/a laptop. Although, to be honest, that's no guarantee. I try to limit it more to when his brother's napping but it's not always the case (his brother can be hard work, too, and has decided to start climbing anything and everything so I spend a lot of time trying to move furniture and get him off of tables/chairs/shelves).

I'm sorry it's so long. AIBU to stick DS1 in front of a screen half the day?

UniversalBagel OP says she is living with her parents at the moment so I expect there will be rooms that are out of bounds. When dgs (3.7) is here he is only allowed in the living room as he cant be trusted anywhere else and it was the same when ds1, who has ADHD, was younger. He couldn't even go into the kitchen alone as he had absolutely no sense of danger. He could climb onto (and fall off) the work surface before he was two!

No, but if you give up and don't even try to teach the skills, then they have less than no chance. It's not about it coming naturally, but teaching them.

So Early to be clear, you do not have a child with ASD?

Who has said the op isn't trying to teach the skills? Seriously though it isn't easy

Sorry for not replying within seconds!!

Yes I do.

The thing is screens haven't been around for that long, yet they've become a crutch so quickly. I barely watch TV, so why should I impose it on my child? I notice a massive negative difference when more screen time is offered - GPs etc.

It works for the duration, but everything is much worse after until he's weened off it again.

Ps I'm going out now, so if I don't reply, it's because I'm out, not ignoring!

Early if you only knew how much heartache I went through trying to get ds1 to play "normally"... He can't do it. His brain isn't wired to play, and that's fine.

It doesn't mean he lacks imagination though. He builds his toys into other contraptions which are far more than the sum of their components.

I think that ds1 feels totally in control when he's on his iPad. The world can be overwhelming for him and he is calmed by spending time in his own space.

Sewing I think that's exactly it.

Early - out of interest ds spends most of his time on his tablet looking at maps and planning routes. Would you be as quick to judge if he was looking at paper maps (which he does a lot but he prefers the interactive nature of Google Maps)?

That's fine. And I'm not talking for everyone, just me.

Autism is a massive scale and not always a logical one.

It's just in my (small) experience there are some people who just fall back on screens without much long term thought.

Try something and if it doesn't work, then you know. Don't try and you could be inadvertently making things worse.

Anyway, I really have to go. Just to be clear, I'm just talking about my experience, but in our case, screens make everything harder overall (although not always in the minute).

Last post!!

Yes I would be less quick t judge.

I think the backlight (and other things i have bo time t go into) from screens is not good. The blue light is bad. Also they make things 'easy'. There is a different challenge in paper maps (for example)

Things sound hard enough for you. Don't beat yourself up about a bit of TV. Ds 21mo and I watch too much when he's home, but I don't care. We watch some kids TV but mostly animal documentaries and wLking with dinosaurs. At least his animal vocabulary is growing! We won't discuss his love of come dine with me though.

Seriously, you sound aware and caring. Doesn't sound like you are ignoring or neglecting in the slightest, so do whatever makes your life easier.

There is a different challenge but that doesn't mean a better one. Different and better are two different things.

Not at all I have a DS who's 10 with autism. His iPad is what keeps him calm and able to cope with the things we must do and also cope with going out for short trips.

It's so hard when you don't have a child who can play in the conventional sense. DS can spend hours setting up Lego scenes. Then they are just there (in the way!) and he watch s Lego on iPad for more ideas.

I've learnt not to worry so much.

Think early is getting a hard time here unnecessarily. Of course the OP should try where she can to reduce 'screen time' but not to the point where it makes their lives a nightmare and she shouldn't feel guilty about when she needs to use it. I don't think early was saying that the OP doesn't do this, just reaffirming.

Early I only wanted to clarify as PolterGoose had asked and your next post started with 'No, but...' So it seemed as though you were not the parent of a child with ASD. Obviously was a cross post.
That's fine, if that is what works for you. However, if your child is on the spectrum then I should imagine you have fairly good knowledge of it. So you should know full well that what works for one may not work for another and I think it's extremely judgemental of you to basically say the parents just can't be bothered to 'teach' them. It may well be your experience, and you are perfectly entitled to share what has worked for you. But please don't assume those children that use the screen are only doing so because their parents don't care or are too lazy and want an easy life. Nothing about parenting my DS is easy, I promise you!

As for you, bonkers, please do fuck off

I do think that that is quite a lot of screen time for kids of that age, probably an unhealthy amount, Having said that Its in a completely non judgemental way as everyones kids are different and you sound like you're having such a difficult time . Do you have any friends going through anything similar? Or supportive family members that can take him off your hands for a few hours?

Can you take him for a soft play session for a few hours so he can climb ect without having to particularly worry about his safety and burn off some energy? I know it won't help the situation but might give you a little break from handling it all at home. It must be so frustrating until you get a proper diagnosis. Is he fairly good with food? I know it wouldn't cause the problem or fix the problem but some foods can make things more difficult so maybe have a look at that? Having said it though Im just trying to give well meaning suggestions, I haven't been in your shoes and it sounds like you're juggling a lot! So just hope you have good friends there for support for you

Thanks for all the replies. I've had a nightmare morning with the boys (DS2 has molars coming in and found a way through a barricade to the CDs and a lamp and DS1 has been...well, basically how I described in my OP!). I'll try to quickly answer some questions/explain a bit more before looking through all posts again more thoroughly.

We have two trampolines and paddling pools but on wet days (like today) they're not much good and it's quite hard to get the boys outside. DS1 refuses to wear any clothing inside so it takes at least 15 minutes to get us all ready just to go out into the garden between having to get him completely dressed and trying to juggle a clingy toddler. I do try to take him out, though.

No, the ponds can't really be fenced off.

I don't drive (neither does DH, although he out at work from 7am-7.30 (at least) weekdays and sometimes has call-outs at the weekends, anyway) and my parents are outside a village without convenient public transport so soft play etc. is not really an option unless my mum gives us a lift and she already runs around after everyone so much as it is.

I have been trying to buy/make various sensory toys/equipment for DS1 (Playdough in a balloon, bought him a beanbag as he likes to just roll around on the floor and sofa a lot/got him ear defenders) but he's just not quite there with understanding yet and so none of it really helps (or he breaks it).

He can't go in many rooms in the house because he would trash them. Also, we're here with my parents and my sisters (they're much younger so are still at school/college and have their own problems (at least one has ASD and anxiety, the other self harms and is currently at a CAMHS session as I type) who need their own space. The kitchen is largely off limits because he will just grab at things and people are often cooking in there. The sun lounge is off limits because the dogs are all in there. It's a six bedroom bungalow so if he's through in the extension I can't hear what he's doing from the living room. Even with rooms he's allowed into, there are issues. He managed to eat a quarter of a tube of toothpaste from the bathroom the other day!

He's not really into construction. I have building blocks and Duplo for him and he prefers for me to build things whilst he watches and it doesn't hold his attention for long.

He's not good with food at all. Largely a texture thing, I suspect. He won't eat any veg at all unless I managed to hide it (pizza with the base made out of mashed sweet potato and flour) and isn't that keen on most fruits (will eat grapes, apple (without skin), banana, raisins, dried apricot, sometimes strawberries and occasionally blueberries). He will eat bread/breadsticks/cereal/cheesy oatcakes. He likes cheese and will sometimes eat omelette. He also eats junk. I'm not going to lie; his diet's not great.

One suggestion id make - through years of worrying about it!- is not to worry about clothes in garden. I found by not forcing clothes in house DS was slightly more am eatable to them outside the house.

I did find the take them out as they are and they'll learn/ get cold and want clothes on was an absolute no no here. Didn't work.

Are you down south? Just dos you mentioned rain - I'm currently sat in the sunny south in the middle of a pigging thunderstorm!

Just . That sounds really tough.

No experience of your situation but think that it's really important here for you to be kind to yourself and ditch the guilt. It sounds to me like you've got things as well under control as you possibly could have in the circumstances - much better than I could manage, I'm sure - so I hope you are proud of what you are doing, rather than just worrying about things you think aren't optimal.

Hope you get some more help and useful comments both here and from professionals once you have the diagnosis.

Don't worry about his diet. Breadsticks, cheese and the fruit he'll eat all sound fine. There's carbs, calcium and vit c.

Trying to go through and answer anything I've missed. To the poster suggesting visual timetables etc., I've been meaning to make something like this for a while but can't during the day (just don't get a chance) and by evening I'm so tired plus all the craft stuff is either in DS2's bedroom or just outside both the boys' bedrooms. It needs forward planning and I'm just not great at that right now. Maybe it sounds like a cop out (feels like it) but I do suffer from depression and anxiety (on medication, which is helping) and I feel so overwhelmed I think I just revert to inactivity if that makes sense?

I would LOVE to see an OT. I strongly suspect DS1 has SPD as well as ASD as he's very sensory seeking (or avoidant - depending). I'm hoping we might be able to get a referral once we have a diagnosis.

The last appointment for assessment is with a child psychologist tomorrow (we've already seen a paed and SALT). After that I don't know how long it will be before the meeting where they decide. I just worry they'll tell me they want to 'wait and see' because they all seem so surprised I've picked up on it 'so early' when he's so 'high functioning' (ASD runs in the family so I knew before I even brought it up with HVs). I'm prepared to fight DS's corner if needs be.

You can sometimes have a conversation with him if he wants to talk and it's about something that interests him (hoovers, trains etc.). But sometimes he will simply ignore any attempt at conversation or revert to babbling (despite his brilliant vocabulary).

Support wise, I have my parents. My dad works all the hours of the day, practically and clearly has ASD himself so is not much help (as much as he'd like to be). My mum is amazing but I can't ask more of her than she's already doing. She has her own things going on (my grandad has cancer, my grandma has Alzheimer's, my dad has depression and is in hospital for tests for some elusive condition, and I already mentioned about my sisters and their MH problems). DH tries but I also strongly suspect he has ASD (I know, I know - I guess I sought out what I knew?) and struggles massively with the noise aspect of the boys and is at work a lot of the time. I don't have any friends in the area but am on groups on Facebook etc.

Not in London (though, DH does work in London).