Need help re kids behaviour

[Whattheuh]

They seem to lack any skills of behaving especially in public. For example we go to a cafe,one keeps walking around even tho asked to sit whilst eating his ice cream,the other sits beautifully whilst eating but proceed to jump around "like a gorilla" and try to climb on furniture.ignoring any telling off from myself.so we were there all of 10 min and they couldn't be good for that short time.then 2 year old starts screaming so decided to leave.I'm feeling down about it all,I have to shout their name so many times before they even answer,tell them to stop/not to do something is just ignored. We use time out(but never really been that effective)and take away screens etc but nothing changes.friends tells me all kids are the same,but are always mine the ones to misbehave all the time.and they can be very aggressive between them,7years old will hold his brother from the neck if he annoys him.feeling like crap at parenting.

Erm, why is punishment waiting for DH? (Not that I agree with smacking?)

Did he get a row for damaging the car? I don't mean shouting for five mins, I mean a proper, extremely firm voiced discussion about how selfish and appalling his behaviour was? Fod you tell him just you were furious? Did you explain how much it would cost to fix? Did you explain how long mummy and Daddy will have to work to pay for it?

A 5 and 7 yo should be able to behave in a cafe and a GPs (bollocks to 'adult expectations' quite frankly)

The absolutely key ingredient to well behaved children (assuming NT) is a really firm voice, you've got to sound like you mean it. If you threaten, you have to follow through. You have to explain the consequences of their behaviour (they won't be taken to cafés, no one will want them to play dates, Mummy and Daddy will be angry, embarrassed and disappointed.

I don't do sticker charts, I don't do naughty spot, I rarely shout. I'm extreme positive and cheery but the children know that misbehaviour (particularly in public) because the consequences (unhappy Mummy) are not worth it. Everyone had a much nicer time if they are following the rules. They are beautifully behaved, especially in public.

Before anyone says I'm just lucky with my kids, no one misbehaves on my house. I have very high standards and every child through the door is expected to meet them.
Y children are told nicely how they are expected to behave in advance eg 'Mummy has important things to say to the GP, please don't interrupt,

You need to raise your expectations of their behaviour, toughen up and take charge. (Sorry). If you can bring yourself to be really strict for a while, soon you won't need to be.

Btw no of course he shouldn't be going to his friends tomorrow, and he should know why - because he can't be trusted not to damage her belongings too.

I agree with Vatersay- I would hit the roof regarding the stone, def no play date tomorrow because he can't be trusted. It sounds to me like you need to be way firmer- yes all kids are grim sometimes, but they needed to behave at the dr, it matters- find a really awful, appropriate consequence and hammer it home.

Leaven it with loads of fresh air and exercise, and easy nice things to do.

Punishment wasn't waiting for DH.I explained why I was angry,sent him to his room,told him we won't be going anywhere as car is now "broken". I think I am quite firm,maybe I'm wrong.unhappy mum as a consequence...they won't care about that.I ll add explain expectations before going somewhere, thanks.firm voice,I tried,but didn't make any difference.

Definitely has to hold hands with you when he is out as a consequence, explain why, and only when you are sure he will behave himself, will he be able to walk by himself. Put himself in your shoes "how would he feel if someone threw a stone and it hit him? Or broke something precious of his?" I have two ds 12 and 9, and the 9 yr old still needs occupying in restaurants, Lego figures worked well for us. Don't stop going to places though, as they need to see how people behave in restaurants and cafes to learn themselves. Try child friendly places, and if it isn't your child, it will probably be someone else's

Whatthe . It's hard work.

A good firm voice does work but you need to be consistent and keep going with it. You need to be in it for the long haul. You need to make them believe it.

When I said 'unhappy Mum' I didn't mean crying on the corner unhappy I meant calmly pissed as hell.

Of course they should be bothered if Mummy is unhappy calmly pissed as hell no one is getting five more minutes in the park, an extra biscuit or tickles on the sofa (or whatever) when Mummy is cross. It's a cliche but 'if Momma ain't happy, ain't no body happy'.

Unhappy Mummy (in this house) tends find all sorts of hoovering/dusting/room tidying jobs for people to do too (I reckon their rooms are far too much fun for that to be a punishment).

Consider this - are your children truly happy if they are misbehaving to this extent? If they are in trouble every day?

You certainly aren't happy - and you deserve to be.

Vatersay smiling in recognition at the "unhappy mummy". I've explained that to DS a few times. Actually, she's known as "grumpy mummy" in our house.

The couple of hours of enforced tidying away lego pieces back into their boxes after he emptied all of them out while having a meltdown was possibly not best practice with a child with ASD, and it was pretty miserable, but actually he hasn't (yet) done it again.

For the car mirror, DS would absolutely hate going to sit and wait at the garage while it was fixed (assuming it's a while you wait thing), so I would do that at a time which impinged on what would otherwise be free/play time for him. Could your DH take him with him to fix it at the weekend, so that the other DC aren't penalised, but he is. And make it very clear that he is expected to behave well while waiting. He can choose one book to look at quietly or colouring, etc for occupation. No screens or electronics.

To me, this is a fairly natural consequence of his behaviour - making him aware of the time and effort that is involved in putting it right.

I have two boys and when they were smaller was basically a drill sergeant. All that talking and explaining - they hated it.

I barked orders, they obeyed. Still do for the 5 year old. Less often for the 11 year old.

So. Fucking around in a cafe? You get 'Sit, Now'. Doctors? 'Be quiet. Now'

Don't do as told? Well then your life just got a whole lot less pleasant.

Out of the cafe, tough luck isn't fair on the 'good one' he can blame his brother. And so on a so forth.

Find their 'currency' and use it. One of my most used responses to any whinging about consequences is 'If I have to be unhappy because of this, so do you'.

Really though, short, sharp and immediate.

The car? What does he love? Is there something he loves that costs money? Cancel it. And tell him it is because you have to fix the car.

Softly softly was met with scorn by my kids. They (and I) don't have time for that shit.

Morloth I was concerned that my approach might have been a little too direct. I am now suitably reassured. Thank you!

Morloth's post is too long to quote, but basically everything she/he? said.

Children need to know that you love them, but they also need to respect you and respect your expectations of them. Consistency is key too.

I would have been fuming at the stone incident and the punishment would have been severe.

I also worry about all this talk of "unhappy mummy". I wouldn't want my children to think that they are responsible for my happiness or sadness because it's too big a burden for a small child and not all that healthy. They should certainly know that I am very annoyed at what they have done though and that there will be consequences.

And what Vatersay wrote was spot on too.

fireside that's probably why I use grumpy rather than unhappy. I absolutely agree that my child is not responsible for my happiness, however he does also need to learn that certain behaviours are very likely to lead to certain (grumpy) responses in most fellow human beings.

I've got 5 Dc. 14,11,7,5 and 2. Without realising it, I have followed the 'calmer easier happier parenting' approach. I didn't read the book until I was looking for something to help a friend. My children are very well behaved at least 95% of the time. In fact, the way I would describe them is cooperative.

I refuse to raise my voice in public unless it is to stop immediate danger, like traffic.

I explain expectations when we are going somewhere. For example, on the way to the dentist I will say that we will be sitting quietly, speaking quietly, waiting patiently with no fidgeting. I remind them about their manners and as we go in I finish with, don't let me down.

Then when we leave they get a run down of all the positives. For example, great sitting DC3, you were very polite DC4. Thank you. You should be feeling very proud of yourselves. They don't get a reward. Good behaviour is expected. The reward is feeling good.

A 5 and 7 yr old absolutely should be able to sit in a café for 30 minutes with near perfect behaviour.

It works for us. It might sound like I am on their case all the time, but they are left feeling positive about themselves. They use phrases like, 'I'm a helpful girl', 'I'm an independent boy', 'I'm a hard worker'.

The great thing is the eldest dc now 'coach' the younger ones. They encourage them to sit nicely on the bus etc and set a good example. I am often complimented on their behaviour in public. I am shocked by some of the behaviour I see from children, but it's just children doing what they are allowed to get away with.

It is hard work and I find taking them out exhausting because I am forever 'on', offering praise and recognising every effort towards behaving well, but it is worth it.

Children are so different though and maybe I have no idea and it is all down to luck! It makes me feel better to believe I have an effect!

It was something the op said that prompted my comment about unhappy mummy, but you and others explained perfectly what it should mean.

I was also thinking about a friend of mine who used happiness/sadness to discipline her children and would withhold affection until they had suitably grovelled and made mummy all happy again. It wasn't nice to see.

Thanks for clarifying fireside I'm pretty paranoid about helping DS to develop a healthy sense of self esteem, so apologies if I came across defensive/overly invested

No you didn't at all IsItMeOr and it should be me who feels . I just didn't word it very well, which seems to be a problem with lots of my posts recently. Brain like mush these days.

That makes two of us! I also have an unhelpful knack of firmly grasping the wrong end of the stick, which seems to be happening a lot at the mo.

fireside when I say 'unhappy mummy' here it's in explanation / it's not a term used on our house.

My children aren't made to feel responsible for whether I'm 'happy' or not (eg they've never seen me cry) but they do understand that poor/substandard behaviour leads to disappointment/anger/unpleasant atmosphere.

I explained what I meant when I said that Vatersay and also said I agreed with everything you posted, including this:

When I said 'unhappy Mum' I didn't mean crying on the corner unhappy I meant calmly pissed as hell.

I was mostly concerned that the op might not because I've heard parents, when doing the calm chat about bad behaviour, use phrases like "you've made mummy very unhappy" and worry about how very small children process that.

That makes two of us! I also have an unhelpful knack of firmly grasping the wrong end of the stick, which seems to be happening a lot at the mo.

Personally I think it's spending too long on mumsnet and trying to chat using a keyboard. It makes sense in my head, but turns to gibberish on the screen and I keep skim reading and missing vital info. I'm seriously thinking of giving it a miss for a while in case I really upset someone.

Fireside I was just posting clarification of my meaning as I thought that you were right in that it could have been misinterpreted.

No offense was taken !

Fireside I think you may be over-worrying. Maybe stay away from the most obviously volatile AIBUs? (not this one - it is very measured!)

1,2,3 Magic here too - eldest DD with ADHD so its important for her to have strict boundaries and for us to be consistent.