Who is unreasonable? Me or friend for saying that is the reality for many so suck it up?

[brownpaperbag2]

A friend lives in a very nice 3 bed semi in a great location, lovely commuter village in South East with good schools etc. she pays £370 a month for her council property, where as mp the average for a 3 bed semi to rent here is £1400 a month.

I have always told her she is lucky. She has lived there 12 years and has 2 cars, goes abroad every year, pays for private tuition etc. her husband earns £34,000 a year and she earns £4000 a year part time school hours. Her husband has just gone for a promotion to earn himself £45,000 a year.

This years budget means she is likely to have to pay full market rent, thus more than tripling her rent. She is freaking out and saying that it isn't fair as her family will suffer. She has 2 children and pays for tennis lessons, tuition, football club etc

I said that this is what other families have to pay, including someone 3 doors up in the exact same house so why should she pay less and have a better lifestyle than her neighbours who also have 2 children and both work full time.

Clearly it fell on deaf ears.

[brownpaperbag2]

I sounded terrible. Sorry. Before the budget I believed it was unfair for some people to pay triple or quadruple her rent for the same house. However, I believed the private rent was too much, not thar SH rent should be higher!

[TripTrapTripTrapOverTheBridge]

So why the insensitive comments to her? The 'suck it up' ? The 'clearly it fell on deaf ears' comment?

[Cornettoninja]

Although I'm in your position and see very much were you're coming from, I still think sympathy is in order.

anticipating that kind of impact on your budget is a massive worry for anyone. I would still be thinking that until she has official notice of what the rise will actually be to hold fire on making any knee jerk changes. I suspect that even market rates will still be a good deal for the area and jumping ship too soon could mean she's worse off.

My position is that social housing stock needs to be improved. Not just for prices but security. Even managing market rate rent doesn't translate to managing a market rate mortgage, deposits still need to be found and maintenance costs are a factor. Cheap rents don't equal a long term benefit the way ownership does and the perks of social housing still mean a lack of security and assets. It's not like affordable rents don't come at a cost to those receiving them.

[RedDaisyRed]

She should get a full time job like most women have and pay her own way.

[BathtimeFunkster]

And were you really always telling your much poorer friend how lucky she was?

[RedDaisyRed]

My daughter just called me feeling a bit fed up and tired. She sets her alarm for 5.45am every morning for work and works 12 hour days. More people around where she lives than not are just on benefits (London zone 2) living in properties subsidised by the state in bits of London many others cannot afford to live in. Last night between 4 and 6 there was some kind of night riot or party so my daughter got about 3 hours sleep. Those on the streets could go to bed at 6am for the day. Every morning she catches the tube with early rising hard working Eastern Europeans who commute in because they cannot afford live near where she does unlike the benefits claimants around. I really don't see why they can't live in Milton Keynes or Luton or other places which are not very far away or Watford. I don't see why the workers have to commute into London but the benefits claimants can live in £300k flats and £1m houses because they cannot be moved away from mother.

[Lurkedforever1]

And as an act of friendship you thought you'd share those details with internet randomers? Can't say I generally repay people's trust by posting their private details on the web

[howabout]

I do not think your friend should pay £350,000 for the house (discount of £70+k on "market" price). Rent of £1,400 pm equates to 5% of discounted figure gross and this is barely enough to cover mortgage and related property ownership costs. If her DH salary is indicative of the area then unless there are a lot of non-salary reliant buyers I think property prices are unsustainable and likely to fall given likely upward trend in interest rates and budget squeeze on BTL, HB and intention to encourage sell off of LA and HA stock.

Rents are only too high because property prices are too high and the BTL market is reliant on capital gains and incumbents with large equity stakes.

YABU for being unsympathetic but your friend is being unreasonable since as pointed out by pp she could have been saving up till now and can use her inheritance to subsidise earnings until she either works more, buys or moves.

[BathtimeFunkster]

So London should be able to dump all its poor residents in Milton Keynes and Luton?



Brilliant idea.

[Lurkedforever1]

Of course bathtime we should put them all in tents in places they won't offend the 'decent hard working tax payer'. We could even just give them food and rags clothes to save them wasting money on beer and fags as 100% do. ( as shown by the mail university of social research) Now, just need a name that sums up my progressive social plans, erm, ghetto perhaps? No I've got it, we can make them labour to show their gratitude for our benevolence, and we could call it a 'workhouse' for me and my modern day socialism principles.

[nicoleshitzinger]

"So London should be able to dump all its poor residents in Milton Keynes and Luton?"

I live in zone 5 in London. We've had quite a few benefits claimants move to our area from zones further in to the centre. This has put a huge strain on local stocks of affordable housing (because even zone 5 in London is expensive) and school places.

Whole swathes of the SE are becoming inaccessible to those on minimum wage. Christ knows where the millionaires who now occupy almost all of central London will get their cleaners and skivvies from soon.

[Happyringo]

I'm amazed that you seem to know such minute details about their finances, why does she feel the need to tell you quite such detailed figures? Or do you ask?

[EhricLovesTheBhrothers]

If I were living in a council or HA place I would have been saving like mad and would put down a deposit on my own place when this new budget comes in.
I guess that's what the government is hoping will happen for a lot of families.

[gamerchick]

It's not the right time for these threads. Give it a couple of years, ramp up the council house programs, get the letters out, sort out the admin headache of checking SH tenants finances and wind up the real frothing over council house freeloaders taking money out of the taxpayers personal pockets and then the replies might be a smite different
Maybe places like central London will aim back to the time where accommodation is provided with jobs. Some pocket money and a half day off a week might look attractive more than living in a tent

[BathtimeFunkster]

What the government were hoping for with this pointless policy was to get a few favourable headlines and convince the stupid and envious to focus their begrudgery on people like them rather than the ones that are really milking the system.

That has been achieved.

They were probably also hoping to put a further dent in whatever was left of the idea that social housing wasn't just for people who were on their uppers.

Probably also achieved.

[RedDaisyRed]

It's utterly wrong that we support people who choose not to work in areas of London where even 30 years ago I could never afford to live. Utterly wrong particularly those of us who work very hard and have had to move hundreds of miles from all family support networks to find work. Thankfully the nation spoke at the election but even so the benefits cap is far far too high.

Hardly anyone has been moved out. Zone 2 is still teeming with masses of the idle. They even drop litter every day in my daughter's hedge as if they didn't have time to find bins. It doesn't take an income to walk to a bin. She runs after them with it.

[BathtimeFunkster]

Zone 2 is still teeming with masses of the idle.



That sounds great.

Idleness is much underrated.

These are the avant garde - have thrown off the harmful "look at me, I'm soooooo busy" culture of today, and are exploring and embracing the underemployment of the future!

We have much to learn from the idle masses of London, zone 2.

[Fredfish2]

All she has to do is put the tenancy in her name, on £4k a year the rent will not change.

[RedBlu]

We gave up our HA flat last year as we saved up and bought our first house. If we had still been living in the flat, we would be expected to pay "market rent" as we earn around £38k between us. We worked hard at our jobs/careers to get to the salaries we currently have and I would have been really peed off if we were told "oh you earn too much, get out or pay more".

We always knew we didn't want to stay there forever, despite having a lifetime tenancy. However, when we gave up our flat we paid rent on, albeit reduced rate, the person who got "our" flat is someone who doesn't work and is on benefits so now the HA is getting no money at all in rent.

[annandale]

Teeming sounds a bit energetic for the idle.

[The5DayChicken]

Haven't yet read the comments so don't slate me please but I pay more than that for my 2 bed flat in the north west. And my flat is quite cheap.

Your friend has been very fortunate for quite some time to have been paying so little for a 3 bed semi in the south east, especially when they have what looks to me like a very healthy household income.

On that income, if they can't re-jig their budget to stop their children from missing out after they're forced to pay the going rate then they can't afford to live in the area they do as their outgoings are too high to accommodate their rent.

YANBU

[ouryve]

She's been lucky, but the change is still going to be a huge shock to her and her family.

[ouryve]

RedDaisy, you have some ishoos there, don't you sweetheart [headtilt]