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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Daily posts of baby on FB

283 replies

shebird · 22/07/2015 16:46

A family member had a baby 6 months ago. Since the day baby was born she posts at least 3 photos and sometimes videos of baby together with updates on baby's weight, sleep and how much she's has expressed Hmm I thought this might have dwindled out as baby got older but it's not looking likely.

I'm aware that I can hide her posts and I am not having a moan about how annoying I find FB. My concern is for the child's privacy. We are not talking the odd cute photo here, pretty much all of this child's life to date has been documented on FB. Do children not have a right to have everything shared online or AIBU?

OP posts:
rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 13:37

Basically, you went an exceptionally long way beyond claiming that a lot of people on Facebook are unthinkingly revealing details about themselves, like their dob, address, maiden name, etc, and started to claim that people are excluding their children from the chance of getting involved in shady, unnamed organisations that are the real power behind the throne and which are playing us all like puppets.

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 13:59

And talking of the world changing - do you really think someone's mother's maiden name is going to be considered a legitimate security question for much longer? Besides anything else, a large proportion of children today have mothers who never changed their surnames. Life changes and moves on and security procedures have to change to keep up with it. There is a lot I find annoying about the way life is going, but frankly, the options are increasingly to find life is made exceptionally difficult and inconvenient because you refuse to join in with the mass sharing of information, or to join in with it. Whatever you do, the most sinister organisations holding data about us are those which run our country or other countries; and those who can, at the flick of a switch, turn off our power supplies and communication systems.

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 14:03

This government seems particularly keen on finding profitable ways to use our NHS data...

phoenixrose314 · 25/07/2015 14:14

Having a new baby can be so overwhelming, and incredibly isolating. For me, the first of all my close friends to have a baby, I had nobody besides my mum to talk to about all these things that my baby was doing, everyone else was working and living their life and I felt... kinda shit. So, yes, I used Facebook to almost validate my existence, showing photos of "fun" baby groups etc, sharing things that made me smile... because I had nobody to converse with about them. My day would have otherwise been a silent one. I also used Facebook to gain advice from older family friends and colleagues who I hoped would have pity on me, and give me advice when I was up at 3 in the morning crying alongside my newborn son.

Just try to remember that everybody uses Facebook for different reasons, and at different times in their life. Maybe think about why your friend feels the need for Facebook - does she not have many visitors? Is she lonely? Is she suffering with anxiety or depression post-baby?

A little empathy goes a long way. And if you really don't like what she's sharing, just hide it.

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 14:22

It's quite a healthy sign, I think, that in this world of data excess, mistrust and cynicism, people still want to share information with each other for reasons of friendship, sharing the joys of life and to seek reassurance, help and support.

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 14:23

When people stop communicating with each other for fear of how their words will be used and twisted, we will know something has gone badly wrong with the world.

Pagwatch · 25/07/2015 14:35

I am never going to get an answer to the question about what possible damage excessive baby photo posting can do to that child's future employabIlity, am I ?

Is it classified

EllieFAntspoo · 25/07/2015 14:43

no, you came on here to crow about the idiocy of someone telling the world how often she is expressing milk for her baby... yet you have failed to come up with a single reason why that is dangerous information.

I never mentioned expressing milk or any such thing. I was responding to a post concerning someone who posts three photos and/or videos a day, cataloging her child's life, and the concerns the poster had for the child's privacy. You personally may not see any harm in having your life catalogied online, any you may have no issue cataloging your children's lives online, but that does not detract from the obvious dangers of doing so.

Some of us care about our children's privacy, and the OP has concerns enough about another child's privacy to have started a thread about it.

... and started to claim that people are excluding their children from the chance of getting involved in shady, unnamed organisations that are the real power behind the throne and which are playing us all like puppets.

Again, you may never have had a job where you have been profiled for candidacy, and you may never have known such things exists. You may be like the poster who claims supermarkets like socially available people to work for them, but some aim higher than that for themselves and their children, and more than one poster has mentioned that they socially profile candidates for their employer, and more than one poster has had to concern themselves with their online presence.

Just because such things are outside of your experience and/or station, and just because you do not believe they happen, does not mean that those who have posted such warnings are lying, nor does it mean that such things will not become more commonplace in the future.

... do you really think someone's mother maiden name is going to be a valid security question in the future.

That remains to be seen. The weakest link in any security is the link that gets broken. I have a 16 digit card number and a 4 digit PIN number for my bank account, but my bank will still give out personal details and grant telephone access to someone who knows neither of those security measures. And that is a bank. Not a utility company or a television provider. An institution that handles my finances, pays my rent and feeds my children. I have worked for two banks in my life, one a major player, the other a smaller one that was swallowed up in the 80s but is likely to be rolled out again as a PR exercise for its current owner. Banking security for retail customers is shockingly lax.

You don't give a shit, and you don't believe me, or the other posters who have posted similar informations. Fine. You wish to make decisions about your children's future and you don't believe they will live in a world where online security is any more dangerous that in is today, fine. Those are your choices. You are the only one who can protect your children, and if you get it wrong, you can just tell them those things happen.

But like many of the posters on here, I do see the risk of cataloging your babies life online. I do see the data that can be garnered from such posts over a period of time, and I choose to protect my family accordingly.

You can flame all you wish. If you don't believe the risks, post your name, date of birth, place of birth and mother's maiden name on FB and publish an open challenge. I can get most, if not all, of those things from a social media feed if I watch it long enough. Of course, given that most people are not presently at their time and place of birth, it's harder when they are twenty or thirty, but if their time and place of birth happened to be nicely archived and published online by their mothers, it would be a lot easier today.

EllieFAntspoo · 25/07/2015 14:48

Pagwatch Read the thread.

Ilovecrapcrafts · 25/07/2015 14:50

Ellie I'm not sure if you're being deliberately obtuse. But I do recruit for my (conservative) organisation, high level, professional recruitment. We use profiling extensively (any good recruiter knows this is only one very small element of recruitment and an unreliable one at that Hmm) yet I would not, in a billion years, exclude a candidate because his mum posted photos of him on the potty in 1984*. You seem
To be suggesting not only would I do this, but I would also potentially pay a third party to hack into his and his mother/ father/ grandmothers social media to check for potential information about him.

Which of course, I wouldn't. Neither would anyone else with a full
Time job and half a brain

*i know social media wasn't around in 1984, it's a comparable

Pagwatch · 25/07/2015 14:55

I read the thread.

Having spent much of the thread hectoring everyone about how dumb they are why don't you put it into a sentence that someone as stupid as me can understand

Resist the urge to slip into hyperbole and nose tapping ' I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you' nonsense.

Exactly what risk is the child in the op exposed to and what future will be denied her because her mother was a bit FB happy?

Kewcumber · 25/07/2015 14:56

Do you drape a sheet over your baby when you go out in public? Isn't total strangers seeing them more of an invasion of privacy than people on your facebook friends list (who presumably you know)? Confused

EllieFAntspoo · 25/07/2015 15:09

We use profiling extensively (any good recruiter knows this is only one very small element of recruitment and an unreliable one at that ) yet I would not, in a billion years, exclude a candidate because his mum posted photos of him on the potty in 1984

Clearly not, so what criteria do you use? And you are screening candidates who have chosen themselves to display their lives online. You are not yet screening a generation who's online presence has been predetermined for them by their social media eavy parents, and who have been brought up to believe such an open book policy is harmless.

You seem to be suggesting not only would I do this, but I would also potentially pay a third party to hack into his and his mother/father/ grandmothers social media to check for potential information about him.

I would never suggest any such thing. I am sure there isn't a single person an MN who would break the law of affront another human being. I merely point out that such companies do exists, they do provide such services, and obviously their clients are perfectly happy with the product they receive.

I have a friend who is a freelance journalist. He scrabbled around as a minor hack for minor news papers, and barely makes national average wage. But he is a hard working and honest man, and I would never dream of suggesting to him that he might have discovered something by having someone hack into someone else's voicemail.

Just because he doesn't, and just because you don't, does not meant it does not happen, and happen on a scale that keeps a decent sized industry liquid. Sadly, we cannot all live in a world where everyone is honest and moral and just, and I don't see us managing to build such a utopia for our children. I could pretend it exists by burying my head in the sand and encouraging my kids to do the same, or I can tell them the truth.

Pagwatch · 25/07/2015 15:10
Lioninthesun · 25/07/2015 15:20

captainproton how did your DH prove who he was and that he hadn't run up the bills? I think ID theft is so common now they must have ways to sort out the issue fairly fast?

Lioninthesun · 25/07/2015 15:22

I have to say I'm far more worried about someone getting on the tube with some contactless card scanner!

Ilovecrapcrafts · 25/07/2015 15:25

Don't you know what profiling covers? Team work, leadership, ability to work under pressure, reactions to conflict, managing change etc etc.

You know, work related stuff. Not whether his mum was a FB devotee or whether he wore a nappy.

Ilovecrapcrafts · 25/07/2015 15:29

Also, FB has been around for 10
Years. People who started using it young are in the workplace now. Sure plenty have parents who posted lots about their wayward teens

Lioninthesun · 25/07/2015 15:35

The whole idea of ID theft is far more risky for the hacker - it may affect me for a week while I sort out everything my end, but then everything is replaced, my credit score is back to normal - no more problems.

If dd doesn't get a job because I posted a pic of her in a bear costume when she was 3, then I would be rather relieved. Clearly the workplace had a severe sense of humour failure and is wasting money that could be going on wages on ridiculous ways to decline applicants for working for them. I'd not like her to work in a place like that - who knows what it might be next week. If they don't want to use her CV and see what she has actually achieved rather than what she may or may not like to do in her spare time, then more fool them.
The whole idea is farcical.

EllieFAntspoo · 25/07/2015 16:41

I have to say I'm far more worried about someone getting on the tube with some contactless card scanner!

And so you should be. Half the owners of contactless debit cards do not even know they posses them, let alone the risks of having them. Best use a purse or a handbag designed to block them, and you still need a PIN number to transact, although not to donate. If someone could lift your name, account number and sort code from your card, they could donate money from your account to charity without any further information. No checks are required.

They could also set up a number of online services and accounts in your name with a alternative address. Ultimately you'd get your money back, but you'd be frozen out of your accounts in the menatime, and it would leave a scar on your record at the credit reference agencies. Susceptible to fraud.

That DH from Top Gear didn't see the risk and rubbished the idea that your account was easily accessed. He posted his account number and sort code to prove a point, and found he'd donated £500 to a diabetes charity for his stupidity. Simple answer, do not accept a contactless card.

shebird · 25/07/2015 16:55

My reference to privacy in the OP was in terms of the intrusiveness of having everything about you shared online. I was considering the fact that these kids had little choice in this matter, rather than the data security aspect. I'm quite a private person so the idea of this makes me really uncomfortable. I wondered if these parents in the excitement of new parenthood had considered how their child might feel about this in the future. The personal security thing is a whole other issue, but obviously something others feel pretty strongly aboutGrin

OP posts:
rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 17:23

shebird - yes, I think if that level of posting went on through her child's life, it would be an invasion of her child's privacy. However, I think at this moment in time, your concern should be more for your family member and how isolated she may be feeling with a 6-month old baby at home and nobody to share a lot of the time with except that baby. Did she go into that level of detail about her life pre-baby? Or is this amount of posting a new phenomenon?

EllieFAntspoo · 25/07/2015 17:35

The whole idea of ID theft is far more risky for the hacker

Not really. His end is far more anonymous than yours.

... but then everything is replaced, my credit score is back to normal - no more problems.

More like six months, and during that time you're fucked if you want to do anything involving new credit agreements (move house, etc). Credit reference agencies also continue to flag up compromised identities forever. They are already known to be susceptible to fraud.

If dd doesn't get a job because I posted a pic of her in a bear costume when she was 3, then I would be rather relieved.

It is easy to frame OPs question and concern as posting a couple of pictures online. The concern is one of cataloging from birth, three pictures a day along with a diatribe. I would be surprised if her date of birth, name and place of birth were not already online for all to see, linked conveniently to her mother and grandmother, in all likelihood giving maiden name. I'd bet we could track down home twin and a 192 search would give us address and telephone number, and I'd guess she's not removed herself from the public electoral role, so we can corroborate the information. Maybe two moths into the world and we could find out more personal information about her child that we could find out about your average MN poster.

I may not be here in 20 years, I more than likely won't be here in 40. But all that child's personal information is already online, is in all likelihood already catalogued by a dozen or more servers around the world, and once added to a frauds terms information database of 'potential clients' will be there forever. As that child grows, and more information is collated with the records they already possess, a point in time comes when they become a viable target.

If they don't want to use her CV and see what she has actually achieved rather than what she may or may not like to do in her spare time, then more fool them.

Of, if you don't want to see her CV and read what she has said she has achieved.... The CV is the first chance a prospective employee has to 'sell themselves' to an employer. And like all selling, it is a dance if half truths and exaggeration, at best, and in some cases I have been presented with, a list of lies and omissions.

The whole idea is farcical.

I agree. That just happens to be the way the world works. With more than a thousand applications from 'qualified' people for every job offered at my last employer, we had to find ways of screening out the undesirables. At the first round of interviews we gave them a form to fill out while they were waiting, primarily to see what their handwriting was like, to see if they tripped themselves up, and as a social test. The person giving them the form would mark it A, B or C in the top right hand corner just to indicate his/her first impression of the candidate. They also underwent a credit reference check, a background check, a voluntary drugs test (voluntary, as in, if you don't take it, and you don't pass, you don't get a job), a compulsory medical, telephoning of references, professional and personal, and a psychometric test. Social background reports (including online footprint) were being evaluated when I left the business, and I understand they are now quite widely used throughout the City. It helps ensure staff are not susceptible to pressure from outside sources, and it gives you a window on their motivations and their likely personal behaviour whilst in your employment.

If you're one in a thousand going for a job at KwikMart, and your competition is illiterate, you have little to worry about, and your social footprint may well be a bonus. It proves you can speak legibly and are liked. If however you are one in a thousand university applicants wanting to work in London's Square Mile, and Daddy doesn't already smoke cigars with the CEO, a clean social background one less stumbling block.

Of course, you have to have the first in the first place. If you're only ever destined to work in retail banking, no amount of nepotism or social chastity will keep you in the City longer than it takes you to be found out. So, in that regard, I imagine abstaining from social media, outside of the basic security concerns, is moot. For most, their social presence is an irrelevance to their employer at present.

Let's hope it stays that way. I however, will give my children the option of having as clean a profile as I can maintain for them, and then let them do with that as they please when they are older. I'm lucky enough to be able to show them what social profiles can contain, and how that information is perceived. Not by KwikMart of course. They couldn't give a F.

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 17:39

Well, honestly, there is nothing that discredits the process you describe more than saying that it is used in the City - where corruption, drug abuse and theft are common...

rabbitstew · 25/07/2015 17:57

... and where people are so susceptible to pressure from outside sources that if one market sneezes, the rest of the world catches a cold....

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