UK mum separated by force from newborn in Spain. AIBU to be shocked this is taking so long to resolve?

[wigglylines]

Poor woman, poor baby too. I can't imagine what she's going through.

Why would they drag it out so long? How long does it take to get a DNA test FFS?

Story here www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/03/british-woman-says-she-was-separated-from-newborn-daughter-in-spain

[Petition link removed by MNHQ as we don't allow them in AIBU or anywhere other than our Petitions topic]

No if you have a baby that arrives before term most people would take the child to be checked out straight away, ( even if by midwife) not wait till the next day.
Most people would not wait till that far along and then plan to travel home.
This does seem very weird.
The fact that the authorities are keeping her waiting is telling.
Most likely they are investigating and running very in depth tests.

Exactly kali the talk of a right to translators when the mother lived in Spain. It is all smoke and mirrors.

I don't believe a word of it. Malaga hospital is massively high tech and multilingual and state of the art.

I don't like how it is being painted as a baby stealing metropolis, it is SO far from the truth.

Go there with a stomach ache and 5 hours later you will be out with a CAT scan, blood tests, heart monitor, the works. You don't need to speak a word of Spanish either.

If you unexpectedly give birth at home, quickly, with no medical professional present, you call an ambulance. She said there was no time? come off it, its not just about deluvering the baby, whst about the placenta, and getting medical attention for the baby as well? Youre 38 weeks, in a foreign country with just your mum there, and you wait until thr next day to go to a hospital?

No wonder they are treating her with suspicion, its all a bit suspicious!

How can they get maternal consent for anything, or respect the needs of mother and baby if they do not know for certain that this woman IS the actual mother.

Surely that is the purpose of the DNA test. If she is the mother it will show and she will be able to give consent and will have rights. If she isn't then that will also show, and she will have no rights at all.

The whole thing seems very fishy, and we only have this woman's word for what is supposed to have happened. A woman who, at almost full term pregnant, apparently saw travelling from the UK to Spain to help her mother look for a place to live as perfectly normal. Then whoops, she gave birth slightly prematurely in Spain but failed to attend hospital until the next day!! Are we supposed to just unquestioningly believe that? The Spanish authorities are clearly suspicious and being cagey about it. Rightly so IMHO.

If this scenario happened in the UK I suspect it would play out the same way tbh. At the very least social services would be called.

It is really not usual behaviour to seek no medical attention at all in the immediate aftermath of a birth in a western country. It is going to set alarm bells ringing. It could be seen as neglectful.
Would someone really do all the cord clamping and cutting, placenta delivery and disposal by themselves?
The only times I have known of this are where the woman had concealed the pregnancy. Obviously that is a scenario where she is likely to need help and support.

I know a number of women who had unplanned home births but they all called the ambulance to do those bits straight afterwards and to get themselves and the baby checked out. That is the usual behaviour of a responsible parent.

The "mother" claims the hospital destroyed the placenta, which she says she took with her.

Again, we only have her word for that. She might not have had a placenta with her, and even if she did, in the heat of a Spanish summer then unless she refrigerated or froze it properly I don't like to think about what state it may have been in.

Why would you take it with you? Unless maybe for proper disposal?

It isn't in the UK but it isn't completely unusual in the U.S. I'm guessing it is very unusual in Spain considering their reaction.

I am interested to see how this story unfolds. I don't understand the assertion that the baby came before an ambulance could come; it takes a couple of minutes to call an ambulance, and it's certainly something that you do once you realize the baby is coming, isn't it? Even if the ambulance got there after the baby, it would still be there to take the mom and baby to the hospital and make sure everything is ok.

As far as taking the placenta to the hospital, I would have taken it so that it could be examined by a doctor to make sure it was intact. I'd be concerned that some of it was left behind.

I feel like there might be more to this story than what the mom is telling, but I do agree that they've had more than enough time to process the DNA test. It's been a couple of weeks now, they certainly should have expedited the testing, given the unusual circumstances.

the linked Guardian article says:

"The mother said she had been in touch many times with the British consulate in Málaga, but was told diplomatic staff had no influence over the case. “In the end, they recommended I go to the press,” she said.

"A Foreign Office spokeswoman said it was aware of the woman’s case and was looking into it: “We can confirm an incident involving a British national in Málaga on 16 June. We are providing consular assistance at this time.”

It's always true that the British Government has no influence over a case. They can check that the British person is being treated in accordance with the law of the country they are in, and can provide things like lists of English-speaking lawyers and interpreters so the person can have appropriate representation. But they don't pay for stuff; nor provide any form of get-out card from an investigation, if a national of the country concerned would be investigated in the same way.

So I don't think there's any need for petitioning to get her translation services. Aside from the comments above that it's a hospital where care can be offered in English anyhow, it's hard to imagine that FCO haven't provided a suitable list. Don't most travel insurance policies include cover for legal representation?

I spotted that articles are saying that the courts, the police and social services either could not be reached or have refused to comment. Which hints at their involvement, but doesn't actually say so explicitly.

I think if they are doing SS investigation they should tell her rather than keep her waiting on a DNA test but then again they may have done already.

I heartily disagree with the sentiment that what she did was weird/irresponsible so she shouldn't get a translator/access to a lawyer. It's important anyone subject to a dispute in a foreign country get proper advocacy. If she hasn't been offered these things or given a proper explanation and she is being prevented from breastfeeding I do think the hospital is behaving badly.

Women from my husband's ethnic community regularly travel home late-term to be with their parents for the birth - going from a 1st world country to a 3rd. They then stay there for several months afterward. I am sure that not a few of them give birth at home too.

It doesn't appear that Stacy Cottlins is objecting to the DNA test at all, she is objecting to the length of time it is taking to get the results and the measures to prevent her seeing her child. if she had something to hide, I very much doubt she'd be taking it to the media. She needs to get legal help and an independent DNA test done.

There's definitely something fishy here, but a lot of the comments on this thread are a bit odd too.

She took a flight before the normal 36 week cut off for flying - nothing especially odd in that. She may come from a culture that makes less of a big deal about pregnancy and childbirth than we do in the west. If her first baby was born at term she might reasonably have expected the next one to be too. Still stupid to travel without adequate insurance and no plans re what would happen in an emergency of course.

Why didn't they call an ambulance? Well, probably because outside the UK you may be asked to pay for one! And many British living in Europe are not adequately insured. They also, mostly, do not speak the local language.

I would be utterly astonished if race was not a factor here.

Of course there has to be more to this. After all, they can't keep the baby there indefinitely so presumably there will be an outcome.

Given ss have refused to comment I wonder whether the mum was actually known to SS in the UK and had left the UK in order to get away from them?

I think she was very lucky her 40 minute labour happened in her mother's house, and her mother was able to deliver the baby, and the afterbirth, and clamp and cut the cord etc etc without assistance.

If it had happened 36 hours later, she'd have had her baby at the side of the road in France, delivered by her brother, watched by her three year old.

"She may come from a culture that makes less of a big deal about pregnancy and childbirth than we do in the west. "

It says she comes from East London.

And I think ambulances are free in Spain. Plus there's a law which obliges taxi drivers to give emergency transport those with urgent medical need. Her mother is resident in Spain, she would know that.

I think a lot of people are missing the point.
whether or not there is anything 'fishy' about her actions is irrelevant. Are there grounds fur concern? Is she the mother?
Get the DNA test. Stop mucking about. Get the DNA test and then move the case on.
Whether she arrived at 36 weeks, did or didn't phone an ambulance, etc etc. May or may not be odd. But that can be looked at latter.

Just get the test. If she is not the mum, then the real mother needs to be found. For the real mum and the baby's benefit.
And then this woman can be dealt with. Firmly!

But if she is the real mum, then she, AND her BABY have been very badly treated.

I agree with a previous poster. I don't see HER as fishy. I see it a very very fishy that the DNA test is taking so long. There is simply no justification for that now.

The hospital haven't commented, though, so we only have her word (as reported in the Daily Mail) that the only problem is the DNA test.

I'm pretty sure that in Britain, if someone showed up at a hospital more than 24 hours after giving birth, having not attempted to get any form of medical assistance prior to that, social services would be involved.

She is breastfeeding the baby - why would the hospital let her do this if they have real concerns she's not the mother?

She's allowed to see the baby too.

Definitely more to this.

As a social worker in child protection i am almost certain there is more to this story than has been reported in the press. I have worked on many a case that has been reported in the papers and the press story is almost always just a tiny slice of what is actually happening. Sometimes, shock, horror, the press just make things up or embellish thing in the absence of true facts. Police/health/SW are all very good at keeping things confidential if need be. They are trying to protect the baby and get to the bottom of what is going on. The DNA test is likely to be just one facet. I imagine the authorities are trying to gather more information so they can try and work out what is going on.

"Just get the test."

Media reports to date state that the test is underway, awaiting results.

I don't think initiating another one now is going to add anything.

Well, it's all taking an age isn't it? The DNA test results SHOULD have been in days, if not weeks ago.
And if other information was required, other investigations etc, then that too should have already been either completed, or well under way.
The time delays are extremely damaging. For everyone. There is simply no excuse for things taking this long.
Initial reviews should have already been completed. Other ongoing investigations may take some time. We can all appreciate that. But it would 'appear' that some of the basics have not even been done.

I can't wait to see someone try and justify THAT!

"Basic tests take 12-72hours.
Sibling tests can take a week. Some more complex tests can take a bit longer.

Most test results come back within 5 days. "

I just looked that up. Sounds reasonable.

You still think it's reasonable that she hadn't had her DNA test results? Really?

It's probably all taking an age because they need to get it right, whatever the outcome. I don't think, unless you have been involved in work like this, that people realise just how long it can take. I have no idea what is going on behind the scenes, none of us does. If the mother is being kept in the dark then I suspect there will be good reasons for this. I hope they resolve it soon for the sake of the baby.