To think men have no right to stand outside abortion clinics and do this.

[QuestioningStuff]

Posted before about my pregnancy. I am having a termination today. This is not a decision I've made lightly.

I've arrived at the clinic and there is a middle aged man and his young teen son standing outside with camp chairs and flasks. Putting up awful pictures and signs. Trying to hand out leaflets.

I think women who do this are also scum but how on earth could a man think he has any right to do this? Turn up at a place where women are at their most scared and vulnerable and try to bully them?

It's really really upset me. I hate them so much right now.

I want to go and tell them exactly what I think of them but don't think that would be helpful at this time.

That's needlessly pernickety, SDT.

My point is that men are not the ones who have to physically carry babies. And if they don't want to find themselves in this position they should only ever have sex with women who, if pregnant, would wish to keep the baby.

NB the last part wasn't entirely serious.

You're right, it was overly pernickety - sorry.

Everyone is entitled to a opinion. No one is allowed to choose for another.
you don't agree with the law. Then take your protest to where the law is made/cam be changed.
protesting outside of a clinic does nothing more than to cause emotional damage to women .

I have to play devils advocate abit and say it really shouldn't matter the gender of the protesters. Abortion is a tricky issue because it entirely depends on what someone considers life, if I considered life to begin at fertilisation i'm sure i'd consider abortions horrid, can a man not believe that as well? I think to say its men trying to control women's bodies would be as ridicioulous considering they're many women who are trying to do it aswell, let's not make this out to be some sexist conspiracy. People are entitled to they're beliefs even if you and I disagree with them.

However I do think they're is an argument for exclusion zones around clinics, if you disagree with abortion you should go on a march through Westminister not in front of people who are potentially going through very difficult personal circumstances. That i do find quite disrespectful man or women.

To be precise Peppermint: If it's not your uterus involved you don't get a say. You can have an opinion - so can anyone - but it is not important.

ScoutandAtticus - no, I'm certainly not trying to create a war of the sexes. I'm very much pro-life and I believe that every abortion, male or female, is an avoidable tragedy. And I believe that men are entitled to oppose abortion at the very least on the basis that male babies are being terminated. I don't agree with harassment, intimidation or violence.

very abortion, male or female, is an avoidable tragedy

Avoidable in what way, Irishdad?

I hope you're okay Questioning

I am entirely pro-choice. I don't see how anyone could not be. This, by a PP summed it up for me:

A man cannot make the decision for a woman when it comes to abortion. And neither can a woman - except the one concerned. It's a democratic decision with only one qualified voter.

IrishDad79 No, every abortion is not an avoidable tragedy. It is an act of choice by a woman for whom it will probably be part of a human and personal tragedy but that does not make it avoidable. It's not for you or me of any other person, man or woman, to judge.

I believe that men are entitled to oppose abortion at the very least on the basis that male babies are being terminated.

That's one of the most ludicrous (and divisive) arguments I've heard. How stupid.

OP, lots of compassion and strength to you.

Yanbu op, there should be an exclusion zone and I will sign the petition that was earlier in the thread.

If those who claim to be 'pro life' feel so strongly then they should protest to their mp or maybe you know do something to help women. Support a domestic violence charity or refuge, help to eradicate poverty and inequality etc all things that impact on a woman's choice to terminate. But ultimately it must always be the women's decision,her uterus, her body, her life.

It's very easy to be 'pro life' when it's not you that has to be pregnant, give birth etc.

I also meant to say that, although on a personal level I'd like to spit in the faces of people who protest outside abortion clinics, they do have the right to do it and I believe that, as a citizen, I have to respect that right even though I abhor their actions.

'I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it' and all that.

Either your against it or your not. gender of the foetus doesnt matter does it?

are only male lives worth fighting for?

Every abortion of a viable human being is a death. Sometimes that will be done to save the life of the mother and in various other circumstances is a choice one might make for the good.

Still, it makes me view abortions for convenience as something different to what others might, and abortion figures as a tragedy of unimaginable proportions.

Sadly a pregnancy is not something I will ever experience and abortion is not a topic I will ever face, so I butt out and don't interfere with others having to deal with it, but I think protesting against it is a pretty small and measured response, really, and am not surprised people feel moved to.

And I believe that men are entitled to oppose abortion at the very least on the basis that male babies are being terminated.

That is either the most misogynistic MRA argument I have ever heard or the most illogical and quite frankly stupid. Which one do you want to lay claim to?

Every abortion of a viable human being is a death.

In the UK, abortion is not legal past viability. Except in very serious cases of illness.

And one woman or man's 'convenience' is anothers life shaping disaster.

"That is either the most misogynistic MRA argument I have ever heard or the most illogical and quite frankly stupid. Which one do you want to lay claim to?"

It's clearly neither, but a statement that abortion is not gender specific in terms of the persons terminated.

"And one woman or man's 'convenience' is anothers life shaping disaster."

How trite.

Abortions for convenience? You're not "butting out" with that turn of phrase. That nails your colours to the mast.

Being broke and trapped in a poverty trap for about 14 years + or linked to an abusive man for the rest of your life is more than an inconvenience.

'Abortions for convenience'?

Fuck me sideways .

No, it's not trite. A baby is a BIG deal. A very big deal. It grows in to a person, that needs care 24/7. A dependent for the next decade plus very definitely can be a disaster.

Why will you never experience a pregnancy, srogo?

Irishdad You don't have the right to make a decision on a woman's body and you should not have that right. If you wish to ensure the continuation of your gene pool ensure you only have sex with someone of the same opinion as you, otherwise, do not sit in judgement on another's body. An abortion is not a tragedy, in any sense of the word, it is a choice, a sometimes extremely difficult and painful choice, but that choice is none of your damned business.

abortion is gender specific in terms of the person bearing all the risk/pain/sacrifice/worry of an unwanted pregnancy

hth