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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To consider reporting this couple to S.S.?

110 replies

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 12:19

Im pretty new to MN so please be gentle

I'll try to keep it brief if I can. OH and our family moved from our home town a couple of years ago. One of OH's friends and his DP had a young baby when we left. She had never been an organised or tidy person, but at the point we left the town, it was worse than ever. I don't mean a bit of normal mess and clutter, it was actually hard to navigate through the clutter, and the oven looked so unclean, it would make you ill to eat from it. OH's friend worked 70+ hours a week, came home and found nappies stuffed behind the sofa, kitchen piled high, and baby handed to him as he came through the door while she went to bed.
I thought maybe PND, so offered (discreetly) to help with the baby if she needed a break, but they have a good extended family and HV, so said they'd were fine.

Fast forward a couple of years, we've just visited family and friends in our home town for the 1st time since. Talking to a mutual friend, it turns out the couple are in a worse state than they were before.
I asked where are his and her extended family in this- apparently one set of GPs had the baby for a week, while the other GPs gutted the house- but it's back in the same state again now.
The child (now nearly 3) is still in the Playpen he was in when we left the town, because (I presume) it's the only bit of the house safe to be in. He has been walking since 11 months, how is a Playpen enough space, or healthy for a toddler to be in all day?
DH's friend said the couple never take the child out to any activities or nursery, he just sits and watches TV programmes from his Playpen.

I only found all this out yesterday night, and don't know what to do. OH's friend we visited, said he was shocked to see it. It was the first time she'd answered the door to him visiting in a while.
I just don't think it's right, that a nearly 3 year old child sits in a hovel of a home in his playpen, watching tv with the curtains closed. I don't think I should ignore it.

What would you do? Thank you in advance.

OP posts:

TidyDancer · 21/06/2015 12:49

Sunny, I don't wish to go into details, but I'm absolutely certain in what I say. They were horrific.

Original poster

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 12:54

Yes wtfhaveidone I did ask him, he said that because he had just left their house a couple of hours before, he thought they would know it was him that had done so. He said he was wondering if to contact GPs instead.
I'm just quite worried and unsure what is for the best.

OP posts:

CremeBrulee · 21/06/2015 13:02

You know your own motives. If you feel genuine concern for the child then act on it.

Sounds like others who are in the know are either unable to see the extent of the issues or unwilling to report close friends/family.

You can make a difference to this child. Sounds like the mum needs help.

CalleighDoodle · 21/06/2015 13:05

I dont know why motives are improtant. Your own motives dont change the situation the child is in.

Whatthefuckhaveidone · 21/06/2015 13:08

Until you see for yourself you won't know.

If you called ss just now and told them that you heard a rumour that this is happening they might not take it seriously, maybe they would send a letter out telling them to call, it would give them warning to get themselves sorted, ss would show up at the arranged time,nothing much would be wrong and the couple would slip back downhill.

If you go over and see for yourself, you will either see that it's a case of different parents having different standards (for example a family member was slating another family members house to me, said they had a sink full of dishes, things piled up etc, in reality it was a couple of plates and cups in the sink and a bit of clutter, 1st family member lived in a show home, most people live in reality) or you will see it is that bad, but your report will hold more weight because you are reporting what you have actually seen, ss would be more likely to show up unannounced and see the reality of what's happening and act accordingly to help them.

It's a tough situation but I really wouldn't report anyone to ss on hearsay.

Athenaviolet · 21/06/2015 13:12

Your information is local gossip so you should bear that in mind. (As would ss if there was a referral)

The tone of your op is rather judgemental, which really isn't going to benefit anyone.

If the info you have given here is all true then it is obvious the family is struggling and is in need of some support. There is no shame in that. There could be lots of reasons for inadequate parenting, that you couldn't possibly know about.

But there is help out there for struggling parents. Professionals rather than local gossips can look at the causes of these problems and offer interventions such as home start, parenting classes, respite childcare etc.

That is the approach that is needed here, not village gossip, speculation and a hoiking of the judgypants.

MrsSquirrel · 21/06/2015 13:13

Please report it either to ss or NSPCC. You are right to be concerned. Doesn't matter that it's 'hearsay', you are not going to court. The first thing ss will do is to go and see for themselves.

Athenaviolet · 21/06/2015 13:18

Just noticed your latest post:

the home is just piled high with DVDs, plates, cups, PS4 games, curtains closed and the boy in the Playpen in his pyjamas at 4pm.

This^^ is a different ideas about parenting issue not a child protection issue. Seriously if you knew anything about what child protection workers see on a regular basis you wouldn't post this. If that was the basis of a referral they'd be laughing about you in the office before being resentful that their time is having to be taken up by all the admin and time this will cost when there are real children in need who aren't getting enough help.

A snapshot isn't an assessment. thank god

DJThreeDog · 21/06/2015 13:21

Honestly, yes I believe we all have a responsibility but I wouldn't report on the report of someone else!

Surely if your friend is concerned enough rather than putting it at your door, when you only have years old experience to go on?

DJThreeDog · 21/06/2015 13:23

Ok missed out a whole load of words there!

Surely of your friend is concerned then he should report, not leave it to you?

ashtrayheart · 21/06/2015 13:24

I think you should encourage your friend to report as he has seen it first hand.

Original poster

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 13:24

Athenaviolet this really doesn't boil down to (as you call it), local gossip. I saw it for myself 2 years ago, and tried to help.
The friend that mentioned it yesterday is also a friend of the couple, and has been for many years. He was genuinely concerned, and not just passing on tittle tattle for a conversation!
He grew up with my OH, and the man who is half of the couple.

FWIW, we did try to see them on Friday, the day before hearing about this. We can't just pop round again, we live 7 hours away now.

Certainly no judgypants, I am concerned, not judgemental.

OP posts:

NeedsAsockamnesty · 21/06/2015 13:28

If you do decide to refer make it clear when you do what exactly you have seen for yourself and what you have not.

You cannot make that call for someone else nor can you see through someone else's eyes.

You should be telling the person who saw it to report it themselves if they are that concerned,if they do not do so it looks very much like they were exaggerating and gossiping

DJThreeDog · 21/06/2015 13:30

I disagree Mrs. It is 'local gossip' if your last involvement was two years ago. And just because you tried to see them - but then didn't - doesn't really make a difference either. You are thinking about reporting them to SS on the word of a friend. Your friend had the concerns, your friend should report.

LaLyra · 21/06/2015 13:32

If you believe it's bad enough to merit a report to SS then please report it.

When I was a child endless streams of people considered reporting us to SS, but didn't. Mostly because my grandparents were still involved with us so thought it couldn't have been "that bad". However, they were relying on my Grandparents to report their own child to SS...

Grandparents are not always the best judge of how bad things have gotten. Especially if they see it on a week to week or day to day basis. Sometimes it's like your own child - everyone else thinks they've got really tall, but because we're with them every day we don't notice so much. After going on holiday for a week my grandparents came back, spoke to my brother, came into our home, took us for the "weekend" then never took us back. Only that break away made them able to see just how bad it had got. I was lucky, I was 7. My brother was almost 16 and making plans to leave home already.

Do you trust the friend? Is he close enough to them to know that they don't take him anywhere? Are you sure this child needs help? Because if you are sure then you should report it. Although I agree with others that you should encourage your friend to report it, but if he doesn't I would. Too often adults end up with their loyalty lying with the adult they are closest too.

Original poster

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 13:32

The home isn't the main concern tbh. As I live away, when I've spoken to friends and asked, "have you seen anything of and lately?", every single friend has dropped into conversation at some point, he child is in the Playpen, or was in his pyjamas in the daytime. That isn't gossip, aren't friends allowed to show concern for other friends? We are worried.
As I said, being the other end of the country, I can hardly pop round to see first hand.

OP posts:

DJThreeDog · 21/06/2015 13:39

Well, you obviously feel justified then so do it.

I just don't understand why all these friends that have seen this first hand are apparently leaving it to you, the only person that hasn't seen them in two years, to do it?

Whatthefuckhaveidone · 21/06/2015 13:41

If the home isn't a concern all you are reporting is that parents put a clothed (albeit in pjs) child in a safe playpen when friends come to visit

Original poster

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 13:46

Yes LaLyra the friend is a close friend of my OH and myself, and has known the couple as long as we have. He is trustworthy and the least gossipy person you could think of. He has tried to get the family to come on days out, just to the park, swimming, picnic etc, and said that the answer is always a different reasons why they don't want to go out. He mentioned visiting a couple of months ago, and the Mum was saying her Son (2) can name every character in Star Trek and Doctor Who now, and has seen them all as they are 'his' favourite programmes.

I'm not (as a pp stated) being judgemental.
I'm more worried that the couple have isolated themselves out of the real world, and as a result, their toddler doesn't go out of the house, and sits watching TV from a playpen.
I just think maybe they have got themselves in a real rut, and can't get out

OP posts:

Soveryupset · 21/06/2015 13:48

I also don't see there is enough evidence for SS.

Having said that, I would also be worried and would rally friends and family to see how you can help. Maybe someone could persuade the parents to sign the child up to a pre-school? 15 hours a week would be better than sitting at home all day, and the mum would get a break to sort herself out.

Original poster

MrsV2012 · 21/06/2015 13:51

wtf please, read my Op. The Playpen is the only place in the home which isn't unsafe for a child to play, due to the clutter. Again. Not being judgemental, I think they might need help.

OP posts:

Birdsgottafly · 21/06/2015 13:53

It sounds as though the Mum could have MH issues and everyone around her is enabling the neglect of this child.

The danger will be if they pretend that they are HSing and no-one then reports it.

I hope you all get your act together, if things don't improve.

cansu · 21/06/2015 13:55

You should not report based on hearsay. At the moment all you have is gossip. TBH all you have is gossip about a messy house and a child in a playpen. How your friend can know that the child never goes out etc etc I am not sure. There may well be a problem but you can't possibly know based on someone else gossiping and sniping. If you are genuinely concerned go and see them yourself.

Birdsgottafly · 21/06/2015 13:56

As for a 15 hour a week break giving the time for "the Mum to sort herself out", that really isn't going to happen.

This family needs intervention and everyone around them is suffering from the "Bystander" effect, which happens in every non intervened child abuse case.

Whatthefuckhaveidone · 21/06/2015 14:03

I did read your op, and your subsequent posts where you say the house isn't the main concern it's the playpen and pjs.

If you can't get it straight in your own head what the issues that a friend of a friend told you about are then how can you report them to ss with any clarity?

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