Should I say something to the gym staff?

[Snowballschanceinhell]

I went to the gym earlier and noticed a girl there who I have seen a few times in the past two weeks. She's painfully thin, but I obviously cannot diagnose any kind of eating disorder because I don't know her.

The past few times I've seen her push herself quite hard (I admit I do watch her only because the first time I noticed her I was shocked by the size of her frame) running to the point of exhaustion on the treadmill.

The same happened today, and when I finished, I ended up walking behind her toward the changing rooms. She looked quite unsteady and almost 'collapsed' onto a bench in the changing rooms. I got unchanged (kept looking over at her as we were the only two in there) and the whole time she was leant forward with her head between her legs, like you'd do if you were feeling faint. As I left, I touched her shoulder and asked if she was ok, but she just waved me away. She looked dreadful, no colour in her face and obviously struggling to even speak.

I didn't want to meddle, but have been thinking about it all afternoon. Should I have said something to the gym staff? I assume they do some kind of induction/fitness assessment when new people join to ensure they're healthy enough to work out.

WIBU to not say anything?

RainbowFlutterby I'm not sure whether I'd say anything or not in the OP's situation, but isn't the difference than anorexia is an active mental health illness whereas obesity may be due to many factors?

I'm not sure what would be a similar situation with another illness, maybe someone who you know to have self harming issues buying razors or something? That's not a great comparison either though and I'd probably take it up directly with them rather than the staff.

Sorry Downwith - I missed it (must pay more attention).

JinglyJangly - you don't know that the lady mentioned in the OP has anorexia though, it is just an assumption, and you can probably be extremely thin for as many different reasons as you can be extremely fat.

Err, directors fiduciary duties are owed to the company and its shareholders.

Id be interested to hear the name of this supposed case that decided gyms owe a duty of care to slim looking users who train hard, and that there was a causal link between any resultant injury and loss which was actionable.

Because sensible legal advice would be a standard form contract with disclaimer, make everything the clients own risk and avoid acting in loco doctor/health care role, which would then make any subsequent injury highly foreseeable due to an increased duty if care.

Rainbow - I agree that people can be very thin for a number of different reasons (as they can be fat), however, what the concern is here is that this person by using the equipment was in a state which was of concern.

I personally would feel the same way if it was an extremely fat person who was pushing themselves so that they were at the brink of a heart attack.

It is not so much thin/fat, it is the fact that the Gym should have a duty of care to those who use the gym and if necessary help. That is the reason why a medical check is carried out prior to use?

Chocolate - that does make the difference a little clearer to me, thank you. Would people be as concerned about someone exhausted after a workout if they were a "normal" size? Concerned enough to mention it to staff? Or would people think "Blimey - she's worked hard."? I must admit that I've seen plenty of people completely knackered after a class but they've all been "normal size" and I've never really given them a second thought.

The Chandler - UCTA - death/ personal injury 101. Can't make the client assume responsibility where the health club is negligent - whether that's for insufficient supervision or proper maintenance of machines. Question is whether this is insufficient supervision / monitoring of the gym by the (trained / professional) staff or someone training for long distance runnign with a runner's physique and it's not up to other punters in the gym to know the difference but it sure as hell is the business of the professionals running the establishment and as much as anything, heart attacks on the treadmill are bad for business and they should care for that reason as much as anything.

I think you can say something about specific instances eg "I've just left the changing rooms, there's a woman in there who doesn't look well right now and I'm worried because she's on her own" rather than a general "I've noticed this woman is really thin and seems to over exercise". I think it would be easier for staff to act on this sort of report too

the more you report, the greater their burden of responsibility too - so what Closer said. Make it their problem.

I think reporting that someone looks unwell is probably fine, but from my point of view... If I'm totally honest I probably was that person once, or similar anyway. I was constantly being accused of being unwell and/or having anorexia and while I did have some health issues I was livid when people kept questioning me.

Tranmere - what becomes their responsibility? The fact that someone does a hard workout and looks underweight to an untrained eye? I think Closer has it right. Mentioning it is fine, reporting it when you don't have any facts is (imo) wrong.

I've got a bit of spare time on my hands today so out of interest looked up the t&cs for David Lloyd - the onus is well and truly on the customer to report their own health concerns to management but nothing about management or other users expressing concern.

LA fitness has nothing at all (or something so small I missed it)

Easygym has a small sentence one point about it being the member's responsibility to judge whether you're fit enough.

I had never really thought about it, but I'm amazed there's nothing in the t&cs around over exercising or sensible levels or "occasionally we may request something from your go to say you are fit enough to participate" - although I suppose that's a minefield.

Gp not go.

If they were bit unsteady could you say a simple - 'you ok? - you looked a bit unsteady there?'

Some of these long distance runner do look very thin? but as people have said this is often a tool for people with eating disorders.

Down - they can say that in their T&Cs however no business is permitted to exclude liability for death or personal injury that is caused by their negligence. To be negligent, they're going to have to miss some pretty obvious signs but the more those signs are pointed out to them in the way Closer suggests, the greater their responsibility becomes. In the same way they need cctv or lifeguards for a pool, they need to ensure that they are providing a safe environment in the gym and that users are working out safely. Not just thin / fat people pushing themselves, but people using weights inappropriately (though they'd have to take a significant degree of contributory negligence if they were lifting beyond their capacity without someone spotting). The more the gym are made aware of potential unsafe use, the greater their responsibility for checkign and if they ignore it, then they are negligent. In the casinos / gambling addict cases, the Ritz Casino wasn't responsible for the Saudi princess who (a) was not gambling (for her) large sums and (b) had never informed them that she had a problem with gambling - they weren't therefore negligent. The courts look at whether the casinos were aware of the gambling problem - so would be the same with a gym - did the continue to allow unsafe use of their facilities by someone they were aware had a problem?

If a morbidly obese person began visibly making themselves ill whilst in a restaurant then yes probably (eg. To the point where they were vomiting or ready to faint). Likewise if a very drunk person was past the point of intoxication. The OP was originally concerned that the girl had pushed herself so hard that she was on the verge of collapse.

Damn... Didn't realise there had been a whole other page of posts rainbow sorry

Jinglejungle, Anorexia doesn't mean an active mental illness. Anorexia can be due to a whole range of physical medical issues, not mental health. I had anorexia due to stomach ulcers, my late dh due to cancer. Anorexia nervosa is a mental health condition. We aren't sure which one she has, and even if she does have one.

Some gyms will act. I've been banned from a gym before. It doesn't help (it's embarrassing and you just go elsewhere) but I guess it saves the gym from any issues of liability if someone gets ill or dies on their premises.

So, on balance, I think YANBU to say something. Depending on the gym they might do something about it.

Tranmere while its interesting what you write, you need to remember that we have a clear separation of powers in this country (thankfully) and that the rule of parliamentary supremacy contains the power of courts to make law. Yes, we have judge-made law, and the common law, but that is always subject to the superior law-making powers of parliament.

There is certainly no power for judges to make law by deciding on a related mixed question of law and fact a rule that extends by analogy to similar questions. The law does not work in practice like a problem type question in an exam!

Yes, UCTA 77 prevents the exclusion of liability for death or personal injury resulting from negligence, but negligence requires a great deal more than a duty of care to be proven, and very foolish would be the business that still doesn't have an exclusion clause.

I wouldn't mention her weight but I would alert the gym tot he fact that she pushes herself so hard she looks like she's about to drop dead faint. Her weakened heart might not take the strain.

Fair point, sorry Mermaidhair

Ah, posted to soon, I'm sorry to hear about your DH

In defence of David Lloyd and LA Fitness mentioned in a previous comment I have worked at both these gyms and they will ask for a Doctors cert confirming that the individual concerned is fit to use the gym. Class instructors have the right to ask them NOT to attend class (anorexic generally try to miss warm up and cool down sections to avoid the instructor/max cardio element). Inform the gym you are worried and uncomfortable, Death by Gym is not good for any business

Thank you, jingle. Very kind I needed that