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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

about leaving bagged dog poo to collect later?

171 replies

SquigglyLine · 14/06/2015 07:41

I am partially sighted and have recently (a few months ago) got my first guide dog. We have a routine where he 'spends' (i.e. poos) at home before we go out. He needs to go twice in the morning.

Occasionally he's not ready to do his second one before we set off on the school run, or occasionally needs to do an 'extra' one. It happened quite often when I first got him, but as we've settled into the routine it's only occasional - it happened last week, but hadn't happened for over a month before that.

Anyway, when that happens, I bag up the poo and leave it out of the way, up against the wall, to collect on my way home. There are no bins on the way to school (residential streets) and I can't take it into school with me. I always take careful note of where I place it (as my sight's not good enough to just notice it on the way back), and I always collect it on the way back.

On Thursday there was a dog walker coming past when I was bagging up the poo and putting it against the wall. The DC said that he stared at me and said something but they didn't hear exactly what he'd said. I didn't notice him.

On my way back, the poo bag wasn't there. I know it definitely was missing and not just me not seeing it, because DC2 was with me (not well enough to go to school but had to walk with us). I am now a bit worried that the dog walker (or someone else) thought I was just abandoning the bag!

AIBU for bagging and leaving to collect on return? It is always well out of the way tucked in where no-one would accidentally tread on it, and not left for very long.

OP posts:
NoahVale · 14/06/2015 09:36

i have started doing this, dog walking area, if it was residential, I guess I would do same, dont know.
cant you put it in your pocket?
not read the thread, dont know what it disintergrated into

or sometimes, depends where I am, I wont even bag it, but aim to bag it on the way home

NoahVale · 14/06/2015 09:37

in fact i was on a dog walk the other day, on the way back chatting to another dog walker, came across my bagged up poo, she picked it up, and I said, Oh that's mine,
so some dog walkers will pick it up for you by the look of things.

NoahVale · 14/06/2015 09:41

going for a walk in the woods the owner specifically told us not to leave filled poo bags lying aorund, they are bad for the wildlife, he would prefer it that the poo is left unbagged if not taken, as it disintergrates anyway

but again not residential

MikeEhrmentraut · 14/06/2015 09:41

I love how so many people on this thread seem to be completely ignoring the OP's personal circumstances.

The important thing is, you are bagging the poo, it's the people that don't who are out of order. From what you say, it isn't really possible for you to carry the poo. Just do what you're doing and everyone else can mind their own business. Surely they can see that you have a guide dog anyway and be prepared to make concessions? If you're really worried, maybe you could leave a note on the bag?

ScrambledEggAndToast · 14/06/2015 09:42

YADBU OP. It's really gross to leave dog poo by the side of the road. In the time of it being there someone could easily step on the bag and split it. And for someone who has regularly had to clean dog poo out of DS's studded football boots, I can tell you that it not a fun job. Your dog's poo, your responsibility.

Patilla · 14/06/2015 09:47

I really dislike bagged poo left places. It's a complete pain to avoid while pushing a pushchair/watching a child on a scooter. One of these days one of us is going to "pop" a bag and end up sprayed with the contents.
If it's offensive to carry then generally it's offensive to encounter on the pavement.

NoahVale · 14/06/2015 09:47

YANBU OP
You can be forgiven
in fact the man might have been saying, do you want me to take that for you or even somethign about your lovely dog.

please dont worry about one misheard communcation

NoahVale · 14/06/2015 09:48

would it be safer to leave it in the road?

MyCarHasBrokenDownAgain · 14/06/2015 09:50

Just don't leave the bagged poo in someone else's recycling box, as some rank bugger did to me! Angry No idea if they were coming back for it or not, as I removed it -ugh!

dramaqueen · 14/06/2015 09:55

YANBU, people need to cut you some slack. Everyone round here does this in our dog walking fields and no one complains. We all clear it up.

Squiggly, I'd happily pick your bag up for you, and I'd also be giving your guide dog some admiring looks! Don't worry about what others think, you are doing your best.

LotusLight · 14/06/2015 10:12

I had to go out on an errand. On the way back found 2 filled poo bags by (yes right by) one of the bins we residents pay to have emptied. I stopped my car and put both of them into the bin. When I got home I washed my hands with hot water and soap.

The point is it is a criminal act to leave the bagged poo to collect later. So what about a bag hanging down from the rucksack of children's stuff you carry so it's not squashed a bit like back packers use for pots and pans below their big back pack?

The Sunday Times has a big article in the magazine about CCTV monitoring which can now in places zoom right in - they found that lady who put a cat in a wheelie bin via CCTV and that man who pooed his pants and decided to dump them very close to a bin rather tha in the bin! The council they spoke to spends £140,000 a year just clearing up dumped stuff. It has to stop. We must become a nation where this kind of thing is beyond the pale.

Also could you buy something to tie around the animal to catch the poo just like you can get for horses?

PanGalaticGargleBlaster · 14/06/2015 10:14

What I don't get is when people hang said bag of dogshit from the nearest tree or bush as if it is some kind of helpful gesture to the phantom local authority dog turd collector. Seriously, what is going through some peoples minds to think this is acceptable. Low and behold the same bag(s) are still there weeks later, nicely fermenting in the sun

LotusLight · 14/06/2015 10:17

I know Pan. I once went to look at a gorgeous property in Northumberland by a reservoir miles from anywhere. Hung along the metal fence were about `100 bags of dog poo , one every few yards. That (and other reasons ) meant I did not buy the property. It was absolutely disgusting. These people need ASBOs and public naming and shaming.

NoahVale · 14/06/2015 10:24

no doubt they hang them up as a reminder to collect them later

StackladysMorphicResonator · 14/06/2015 10:53

YABU - sorry OP, but saying your hands are needed for other things is a cop out. You are legally obliged to clear up the shit immediately, and it's pretty gross to leave it lying around, bagged or not. You need to double- or triple-bag it and take it with you in your pocket.

Haggisfish · 14/06/2015 10:57

Stack op is not legally obliged to pick it up-blind and sight impaired people are only ones not legally obliged to pick it up.

HawkEyeTheNoo · 14/06/2015 11:20

Lotus, i would love to know what planet you are on?!?! Let's stick a bucket round the dogs arse so when he squats it will injure him?!?? OP does not even have to pick up her dog poo, but she does! She is not BU! Anyone who is legally obliged to and does not is BU

LotusLight · 14/06/2015 11:30

I just don't see why the vast majority of people in the UK have to tolerate the mess of a very few who ruin so many places for the rest of us with these unpleasant things.

And no the 100 bags on the railings in the reservoir were not left by 100 current dog owners who would be back in 5 minutes to clear it. They were left by little louts who deserve an asbo and commit an offence for leaving the bag there.

Klayden · 14/06/2015 11:31

YANBU but I don't see why you can't hang the poo off your rucksack? Surely it would be better for all involved.

BlueBananas · 14/06/2015 11:32

I never knew bagging a poo up and leaving it till later was even a thing! I've carried around my pretty pink poo bag for over an hour before as I came across no bins, hmm you learn something new every day

Smellyoulateralligator · 14/06/2015 11:37

I make common cause with muslims on this one. Would like the UK rid of all dogs so I am not the best person to answer this but I am certainly not alone

Lotus, for the record, 'Muslims' (that homogenous group of a billion people) do not think this. Not the point of the thread, so sorry OP.

SaucyJack · 14/06/2015 11:42

I should imagine blind people are not legally obliged to pick it up because many of them would not be physically able to see to find it.

I don't think the OP's visual impairment is any excuse whatsoever for leaving a bagged shit on the pavement tbh. Sorry.

coolaschmoola · 14/06/2015 11:44

Stack needing both hands free to control a guide dog is not a 'cop out' - it's a valid reason for someone who has a GUIDE DOG! Nor is the op 'legally obliged' to pick it up immediately - as the dog is a GUIDE DOG the op is legally exempt from having to pick it up at all.

Have you actually read the thread Hmm.

coolaschmoola · 14/06/2015 11:46

No Saucy, you're right - it's not an excuse. It's a REASON.

LotusLight · 14/06/2015 11:48

Dogs and Islam

"Al-Bukhaari (2145) narrated that Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever keeps a dog, a qiraat from his good deeds will be deducted every day, except a dog for farming or herding livestock.”

Muslim (2978) narrated from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever keeps a dog that is not a dog for hunting, herding livestock or farming, two qiraats will be deducted from his reward each day.”

Muslim (2943) narrated from ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever keeps a dog, except a dog for herding livestock or a dog for hunting, a qiraat will be deducted from his good deeds each day.” ‘Abd-Allaah said: Abu Hurayrah said: Or a dog for farming.

Ibn ‘Abd al-Barr said: This hadeeth shows that it is permissible to keep a dog for hunting and herding livestock, and also for farming.

Ibn Maajah (3640) narrated from ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The angels do not enter a house in which there is a dog or an image.” Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Ibn Maajah.

These ahaadeeth indicate that it is haraam to keep a dog, except for those which were exempted by the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).

The scholars differed as to how to reconcile between the reports which speak of one qiraat being deducted and those which speak of two qiraats being deducted.

It was said that two qiraats will be deducted if the dog is more harmful and one qiraat will be deducted if it is less so.

And it was said that that at first the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said that one qiraat would be deducted, then the punishment was increased after that, so he said that two qiraats would be deducted in order to put people off from keeping dogs even more.

The qiraat is an amount that is known to Allaah, may He be exalted, and what is meant is that some of the reward for a person’s good deeds will be deducted.

See Sharh Muslim by al-Nawawi, 10/342; Fath al-Baari, 5/9

Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen said in Sharh Riyaadh al-Saaliheen, 4/241:

With regard to keeping dogs, this is haraam and is in fact a major sin, because the one who keeps a dog, except those for which an exception has been made, will have two qiraats deducted from his reward every day.

It is by the wisdom of Allaah that like calls to like and evil calls to evil. It is said that the kaafirs, Jews, Christians and communists in the east and the west all keep dogs, Allaah forbid. Each one takes his dog with him and cleans it every day with soap and other cleansing agents. But even if he were to clean it with the water of all the seas in the world and all the soap in the world, it would never become pure! Because its impurity is inherent, and inherent impurity cannot be cleansed except by destroying it and erasing it altogether.

But this is by the wisdom of Allaah, and the wisdom of Allaah is that like calls to like and evil calls to Shaytaan because this kufr of theirs is by the inspiration of the Shaytaan and the command of the Shaytaan, for the Shaytaan enjoins evil, immorality, kufr and misguidance. So they are slaves to the Shaytaan and to their whims and desires, and they are also evil and love vile things. We ask Allaah to guide us and them. End quote.

Secondly:

Is it permissible to keep dogs to guard houses?

Answer:

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) made only three exceptions to the prohibition on keeping dogs: hunting, guarding livestock and guarding crops.

Some scholars are of the view that it is not permissible to keep a dog for any reason other than these three. Others are of the view that it is permissible to draw analogies between these three and similar or more likely cases, such as guarding houses, because if it is permissible to keep dogs to guard livestock and crops, it is more appropriate that it should be permissible to keep dogs to guard houses.

Al-Nawawi said in Sharh Muslim (10/340):

Is it permissible to keep a dog to guard houses, alleys and the like? There are two points of view. The first is that it is not permissible, because of the apparent meaning of the ahaadeeth, which clearly state that keeping dogs is forbidden except for farming, hunting and herding. The more correct view is that it is permissible, by analogy with those three cases, knowing that the reason that is understood from the ahaadeeth is necessity. End quote.

The view that was classed as saheeh by al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him), that keeping a dog to guard the house is permissible, was also classed as saheeh by Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) in Sharh Saheeh Muslim. He said:

The correct view is that it is permissible to keep a dog to guard the house, because if it is permissible to keep a dog in order to benefit from it, as in the case of hunting, it is more appropriate that one be allowed to keep a dog in order to ward off harm and protect oneself."