To have reported the shouty self-appointed piano police to the actual police?

[PeppermintCrayon]

I am half-expecting to be told I'm being U for posting a thread of the "please validate this thing I already did!" variety...

Recently I was at St Pancras Station. There are several pianos for public use there. They're a bit knackered; one of them has a few keys that don't work.

Some kids were playing one of the pianos, about eight or nine maybe. They were having a fun trying to play different tunes. They were banging the keys quite hard. A man of maybe 55, 60, suddenly appeared and started yelling: "WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU'RE DOING, YOU NEVER BANG A PIANO."

I went over and said I didn't think yelling at children was very nice and that these kids probably didn't have a piano at home and did he want to put them off music? He started huffing and puffing about how the pianos had to be tuned because of people messing about. I said perhaps he could have said: "Look, this is how you play a piano," and explained nicely instead of yelling. He then started yelling at me.

He then went back to sitting at a nearby cafe table glowering at anyone who went near the pianos, so I went and found a transport policeman and told him this man had been shouting at children for playing the piano and he went to have a word.

I don't think I was being U, but...

isntthatafont, I tend to agree that I wouldn't have asked the police to intervene in this case. But, on what I accept is a totally pedantic note, I don't think you can necessarily say that the man's behaviour wasn't criminal, there would be a case for saying it fits the definition of threatening behaviour. So technically it does come within a policeman's area of responsibility and would justify a few quick words of advice.

Honestly, this thread is glorious. This piano has been abused, destroyed, bashed, mistreated and a variety of other things.

By a child with the strength of a child pressing the keys quite hard.

Poor delicate ickle pianos.

Twinkle, yet again, these children really were not "abusing something that didn't belong to them" and the suggestion that they were "cheeky little shits" is offensive. These pianos are put there for anyone to use - there is nothing whatsoever dictating who can use them or how they are to be used, beyond the obvious requirements of the criminal law. "Banging the keys quite hard" is not abuse. If your 8 year old plays the piano, I would hope he does bang the keys quite hard sometimes, that's what the word "fortissimo" in a piano score means.

Icimoi things such as the pianos are put out for the public to use respectfully. The children weren't doing that and at 8/9 are bloody old enough to know better. So you might find it offensive but in my opinion they are cheeky shits. I started learning piano when I was eight, it doesn't take a genius to work out you don't thump or wallop the keys, I didn't need anyone to tell me that.

I really don't like seeing or hearing pianos being abused, maltreated or bashed. I don't think I would have shouted at them but I might have had a word and said "you really don't need to bang the keys so hard to get sound out of them"

I suppose the man was in the wrong for yelling at them but I have sympathy with him.

I agree yelling at someone is not the best way to get a message across.

But so many kids nowadays just rudely ignore adults who request them to keep noise down or whatever, or back answer and give cheek. In many cases they are supported in this behaviour by their parents.

Small wonder that some people have just given up trying to reason with kids or make polite requests of them and just resort to angry telling off. I'm not saying it's right but it's understandable.

If more kids were taught to behave properly in the first place, these situations wouldn't arise nearly so often. Kids would know how to behave in public and respond to interventions by adults, and adults wouldn't be so wound up and 'on the attack' when they see kids doing something they don't approve of.

"If more kids were taught to behave properly in the first place, these situations wouldn't arise nearly so often. "

But FFS, how is "bashing out a tune loudly" "not behaving properly" and deserving of chastisement? From the OP, all these kids did was play a (public, for anyone to have a go) piano in a train station in a manner that caused one chap to start shrieking at them that they were damaging it (which they almost certainly weren't).

Also finding the hyperbole on this thread hilarious. Poor delicate ickle pianos indeed.

When I was in church once as a child, I turned round in the pew and had a good look at the people around me, then stood up on the pew. The elderly lady behind me gave me a short sharp tap on the leg, at which if went bright red in the face and sat back down properly absolutely steaming with embarrassment and hoping that my parents hadn't witnessed the events. I never did it again.

I now see of course that the awful episode probably put me off church for life and is probably the reason I'm now atheist. If only someone had called the police.

"I really don't like seeing or hearing pianos being abused, maltreated or bashed."

I have the names of several free improv musicians you should never go and see... :)

The point I'm making Leedy is that far too often nowadays kids are defended against any kind of telling off, encouraged to constantly stand up for their 'rights' against any adult making a request for consideration and generally taught no manners or respect for anyone by their parents.

It leads to situations where fed up adults often over react to annoying behaviour by children, because they've learnt from bitter experience that polite requests often receive blank uncomprehending looks, or sniggering cheek.

I'm not saying it's right, but it's so often a product of one encounter too many with spoilt brats who don't understand the meaning of the word 'no'. (Not saying the kids playing the piano were necessarily spoilt brats, just that bitter experience has discouraged many adults from making polite and reasonable interventions).

But, susan,

1. from what the OP says, the kids weren't doing anything wrong, and
2. again from what the OP says, the adult in this situation did not make a polite and reasonable intervention.

Also, if it makes a difference there are several pianos in St Pancras (3 or 4) and they are not audible from more than about 10 feet away due to the size of the hall and the general noise levels.

Did you read my post theycall

I said people often 'over react' when kids are being 'annoying' because of so much bitter experience of being rudely back answered or ignored when they have politely or calmly intervened in the past.

I have had days where I have been beleaguered by a crowd of cheeky brats sitting on my wall, screaming, throwing litter into my garden and ignoring all requests to get down, keep the noise down, dispose of their crisp bags properly etc. So when the next group of kids come along I speak very sharply to them because I'm stressed and fed up of kids who have been ignoring my reasonable requests all afternoon. It's human nature.

Gosh, what a lot of angst and over reaction. It's a public piano, in the middle of a very noisy concourse, put there specifically for people to play.

The worst that happened is that the kids were a bit over enthusiastic. So what? No one in their right mind would put a fragile instrument there, the piano in question is going to have to stand up to a bit of 'abuse'.

OP he sounds like a nut.

I wonder if everyone who is so worried about the piano ever step in to stop real situations. I wouldn't stop kids playing a piano that is put there to play w but twice I have stepped in when a gang of kids were attacking another child. People passing by advised me to stay out of it as it was dangerous to get involved. I have also intervened when a group of 13/14 year olds were vandalising a tree. I think we need to pick our battles.

I also think it's ridiculous to excuse the children on the basis that the piano is old and knackered. So what? That's not going to make it any less likely to get damaged from misuse. Quite the opposite. It's there to be used not destroyed. If the aim is to keep it there for continued use clearly people should treat it when reasonable care.

Children obviously can't be expected to distinguish between what's valuable and what's not- even if that were a reasonable argument in this instance. They should be taught to respect other people's property, and not to pointlessly wilfully damage, or behave in way which might damage, any object. And any passing adult in a civilised society should be able assume that the children already know this, that the parents and everyone else agree with this.

susanstryingterm, don't you think that is bad behaviour from the adult. The second group of kids are being punished because of something the first group did, think the adults need to behave like adults.

Why would an eight year old playing a piano damage it? I can understand it might get on your nerves listening to it, in which case moving would be a good solution. Aren't pianos designed to be played?

I wonder if grumpy old man would be quite so mouthy if it was a group of drunk 18/19 year old really doing something wrong?

I didn't say it was good behaviour granny. I said it was an understandable over reaction in a world where so many parents let their kids do what they like, teach them to ignore polite requests from members of the public, or angrily defend them against all complaints and criticism.

I used to go regularly to a local auction house which often had pianos up for auction.

The porter put a sign on it saying this:

'If you CAN play Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata then please do

If you THINK you can play Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata then please don't.

amicissimma maybe we should organise it for them, shame if some of them miss out on the benefits of being shouted at by strangers. You can do afterschool classes in most things now, I was amazed to find out kids went on courses to learn how to ride a bike, I don't mean the old cycling proficiency but actually how to get the stabilisers off and ride a two wheeler, so I am sure we could arrange for grumpy old men to get paid to shout at random kids so that they can learn how to cope with it.

Wonderful world MN.

You're being ridiculous granny. In life, people will sometimes have a go at you unfairly about something. We all had to learn to cope with that. Rushing in and defending kids and going to the police over a bit of shouting with no threats physical or otherwise involved, is wrapping kids in cotton wool.

the point is.

the children weren't abusing the piano, they were just being a bit enthusiastic.

the man had NO NEED to yell at them like he did,

he certainly had NO NEED to then yell at the OP when she said a gentler touch might have been better.

He then DIDNT NEED to sit by them glaring at anyone who went near them.

op is nbu.

He had no right to shout at those children. As you suggested he should have quietly had a word with them.

Im not sure about involving the police officer, but I wasn't there and don't know exactly how he behaved. But if you felt he was being overly aggressive then I agree with what you did.