To think there are a lot of misconceptions about terminating a pregnancy

[fiveacres]

Obviously, about abortion, which is a contentious issue for some.

I am approaching the third due date of the pregnancy I terminated in the autumn of 2011 at 9 weeks.

I was a very pious sort once, who believed that abortions were morally wrong. i admit that freely. I still do feel that the best option is not to be in that position in the first place.

However, although I do sometimes think about it, I don't regret it. I've been pregnant twice since so it hasn't affected my fertility.

I paid privately. I did not have any counselling - I was undecided when I went for the initial appointment but I have to say it was very much 'assumed' that I wanted to terminate. The record of the abortion is not in my medical file.

You don't have to give a reason, although they did press me to have the implant, which I refused. They did do a scan, which was a bit upsetting.

It did not hurt. I was warned I would bleed a lot but I didn't. My periods came back in 6 weeks.

You are in a room with a LOT of other women after the procedure, which is upsetting.

Other than that, I felt good after having it done, relieved, happy, mainly relieved.

I do have the odd flash of guilt. I wouldn't do it again.

But, I was reading another thread and it crossed my mind a lot of people do not really seem to know what having a termination is like. My experience may be typical or it may not be, I don't know, but it would be interesting to see what the experiences of others are to try to dispel or to address some of the myths that surround this difficult but sometimes necessary issue.

FWIW
I remember a very interesting debate in uni (biology student) about whether viruses are alive.
We then moved on to discussion about the definition of life in a symbiotic relationship.
Finally we discussed animals in-utero.

It was a while ago bumbley but I have indeed come across scientists who believe life begins when the umbilical cord is cut. Lecturers, not just students.

A quick google will set you right on all the scientfic opinions on when life begins. Good luck finding your 'umbilical cord' theory!

No google, You're the one telling us what the scientists think, so you give us the actual science. We'll wait.
I haven't stated an umbilical cord theory. I've argued that the legal and societal definition of when life begins is also my own opinion.

From a Department of Health report published in 2011:

" ... the number of post-24 week abortions account for 0.1 per cent of the total.

Of the 136 foetuses terminated after 24 weeks in 2009, 18 were said to have had “chromosomal abnormalities” such as Down’s syndrome, which would likely lead to birth defects.

“Congenital malformations” of the nervous system accounted for 67 of the terminations with other defects, such as in the cardiovascular or respiratory system, making up a further 43 cases.

There were eight terminations as a result of “other conditions” including “maternal factors”, “family history of heritable disorder” and “multiple gestation”."

Essentially, if you don't believe in abortion then don't have one. It is nowt to do with you what anyone else does with their bodies and thank Christ we live in a society that values the choice of a living breathing woman over a collection of cells that can do neither.

FEijoa, as stated earlier, my stance isn't forced pregnancy and birth.

Winter - "You have, repeatedly."

Actually, no I haven't. I haven't given my opinion on abortion itself on this thread. You can read back if you like.

"you want unwanted babies to be born but then not protected from preventable diseases."

Oh dear. You're starting to scramble a bit now.

"legal and societal definition of when life begins"

You mean 'personhood'.

Pomeral, how interesting. I have never met any and let's just say I come across quite a few scientists on a daily basis.

"a collection of cells"

What stage of pregnancy is this?

I find it so interesting how many people who identify as pro-choice try to minimise when they talk about abortion. 'Foetus' when it's unwanted, 'baby' when it is. 'Bundles/collections' of cells, 'life doesn't begin until the umbilical cord is cut' etc. I have far more respect for those who acknowledge that they are actually terminating a life but that they just don't think it is as of as much value as the woman's right to choice.

to make a choice

Precisely. At the time most abortions take place, that life cannot continue without the host. And I feel that very little is more important than bodily autonomy and therefore, choice.

Most but not all ninky. Do you still support abortion when the life could actually continue without its host?

Pomeral, how interesting. I have never met any and let's just say I come across quite a few scientists on a daily basis.

NI is hardly the epicentre of scientific research.

A wanted baby is hopes and dreams, it is humanised/personified because it's mother wants to be a mother.

An unwanted baby has no such hopes and dreams attached to it and, clinically, it is just a collection of cells. The woman does not want to be a mother and, at base level, a pregnancy is a parasitic growth reliant on its host. If you're not having warm and fuzzy thoughts about a pregnancy then you're not viewing it as a 'baby' (and a pregnancy aborted pre-8 weeks, as the majority in the UK are, is far removed from being a 'baby').

I'm not in NI George :)

Although quite a lot of excellent research does come out of NI. You really shouldn't be derogatory. I work with some great people there.

Tonberry, how interesting. So you think someone's worth is determined by how much they are valued by another?

Really? I remember a thread you started in Chat a while back saying you were.

You're in Ireland though - same point made there as well.

I'm not derogatory about NI at all - I studied there myself. I'm realistic, though.

Well I haven't actually given my 'opinion' as such on this thread. Just asked a few question and engaged in a few conversations about terminology.

Disingenuous bumblymummy. Your opinion is crystal clear. Pretending it isn't doesn't do your position any favours.

So you think someone's worth is determined by how much they are valued by another?

No, I think there is a world of difference between a wanted pregnancy and an unwanted pregnancy. I think how a woman views her pregnancy depends entirely on whether or not it is wanted.

You ignored the question I asked you, Bumbley - you asked why you should care if anyone agrees with you or not.

Your entire stance is about getting everyone in the world to agree with you.

You don't think women should have a right to choose whether or not to continue with a pregnancy. You think all women should continue, regardless of their circumstances or wishes.

So then, of course you must care whether people agree with you. You should actively want them to agree with you, surely. Because not caring whether they do or not doesn't paint you in the most amazing light.

Why is it so hard for you to believe that people don't believe a foetus is alive?

I don't. I don't think it is alive. Call me a lier but I don't. Until birth it has the same status as the womb in my eyes - a part of the woman's body that uses her energy but is not essential to her survival. That she can choose to remove at any point, at which point it will cease functioning. I consider abortions the termination of a potential life, not an actual life.

I talked about 'the baby' when pregnant in the same way we talked about 'the baby' when TTC. It is not life - just hopes and dreams as a pp said. Calling something a baby as opposed to a foetus does not make it alive.

my advice: stop responding to bumbley.

anyone else care to share their abortion story? please and thankyou.

feel free to ignore me. bodily autonomy and all that ;)

I'm actually gobsmacked that people are in favour of abortion at will up to term and are arguing that the baby/foetus/whatever term is not alive until born and fully out into the world.

I'm really surprised that people wouldn't consider say a 35 week pregnancy something living. IMO, of course it is I think it's disengenuous to consider it a baby when wanted and a "lump of cells" when not wanted.

I am pro choice as stated upthread but would be very against increasing the 24 week limit (I'd actually prefer to see it reduced to max 20 weeks) and my personal cut off that I was willing to consider was 12 weeks.

I do see it as a life and I suppose the fact that many others on here genuinely don't probably accounts for a lot of the difference in our post abortion feelings.

I also have a personal cut off of 12 weeks, hence deciding to continue with this pregnancy when in all honesty I'd prefer not to be.

But, it's a personal cut off. Not one I have the right to impose on others,

I don't necessarily want to impose 12 weeks on others, but 20-24 weeks, yes I do. For me the viability makes a difference there.

The only person who really needs to have something imposed on them is the woman who is pregnant and does not want to be.

There are tiny, tiny amounts of abortions post 20 weeks and the circumstances surrounding these are generally pretty traumatic - I can't see any positives in adding to this trauma by forcing the pregnancy to term. But that is a matter for the woman to decide.