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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to expect parents to control children even in the likes of Pizza Express

287 replies

Jewels234 · 04/05/2015 14:23

I know it's more of a family restaurant, but there are children all around me going mental. Screaming, having tantrums, standing on chairs. It's horrendous.

I am probably being unreasonable being here in the first place, but I love a leg gera salad.

OP posts:
Sirzy · 05/05/2015 15:23

Exactly fanjo

tobysmum77 · 05/05/2015 15:25

I agree fanjo which really was my point about drunk people in restaurants..... no one goes on about them making a bit of noise.

fortunately · 05/05/2015 15:26

I would tobysmum.

JacquesHammer · 05/05/2015 15:30

I agree fanjo which really was my point about drunk people in restaurants..... no one goes on about them making a bit of noise

I would - if my meal was being ruined by a group of loud drunk adults I would complain.

In regards to the banging I did say if the children in question were NT I would expect it to be dealt with and I stand by that

SuperFlyHigh · 05/05/2015 15:36

fanjo not all banging children have SN. And as you or another parent said you can also control a SN child within reason. Also you shouldn't have to (though it's a good idea) just pass Ipad etc onto DC for them to behave. They should by a certain age know what is and isn't acceptable at dinner table. My mum by the way wrote a book (I think you can still buy it, called 'Mother Show Me How To' - one of these was 'how to eat'. eg how to hold a knife and fork, how to use a soup spoon etc. Not an etiquette book but just simple manners. Sold all over the world in 70s and 80s. PM me if interested or look on Amazon).

I know a teen boy on autistic spectrum but he knows enough to be quiet or well behaved at dinner table.

Even my neighbours DC at just over a year and 3.5 years know how to behave at dinner table or when out or as their parents tell me, they take them out to another room or home.

Sirzy · 05/05/2015 15:40

So you know ONE child with autism so that means you can judge? It's fantastic that he can behave in that situation but please don't assume that is the same for everyone.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 15:45

Superfly yes sirzy is right.

ASD is a spectrum and also can come with learning disabilities which means it's extra hard to learn behaviour.

Also..I was answering a poster who asked if the children we were discussing in the post she QUOTED had SN
The answer was yes.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 15:47

Incidentally my DD is 8.5 and would not understand that you are meant to sit quiet in certain places yet. And may not for a while. Maybe as a teenager but not sure. She might be quiet because we keep her happy but she won't understand the concept of being quiet because it's what you do in a restaurant.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 15:48

Part of it is she has NO imitation skills whatsoever. So mother could show her whatever mother wanted but it wouldn't work. It's a spectrum.

The book sounds great for helping NT kids to learn though.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 15:53

JACQUES you might have a point with expecting the banging to be dealt with if kids were NT but you wouldn't necessarily know they were. That's why people with SN post on these threads. Not because they have to make everything about Sn but because people can't tell their kids aren't NT so they get judginess and comments. So they see a chance to ask people to be understanding. I even get judginess about DD who has severe non verbal SN and makes noises walks in odd manner and waves a shoehorn around. So it's even harder for people with young kids.

It's a difficult one. Am no way saying all kids running about etc have SN. Some might. Every parent should do best with what they have to work with and everyone judging should bear in mind the possibility that the parents might be dealing with more than they think. IMHO.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 15:53

Sorry for the essay Blush FWIW little kids running round a restaurant annoys me a bit too.

lambsie · 05/05/2015 15:55

A child with high functioning asd is very different from a child with asd and severe or profound learning difficulties.

morage · 05/05/2015 15:58

Kids shouldn't be running about if they do have SN. It is not safe to do so.

lambsie · 05/05/2015 16:02

I don't know anyone with s child with sn who thinks it is ok for them to run. It is especially unsafe because they can have less awareness of danger. Sometimes they do make a break for it though.

Goldenbear · 05/05/2015 16:04

It's not 'fatalistic' it's 'realistic', frankly, if you want a meal in absolute silence you don't go to pizza express you sit at home, presumably child free in a house, flat or tent in the middle of nowhere. No social interaction for miles and miles then you have nothing to 'moan' about.

balletnotlacrosse · 05/05/2015 16:08

There's a happy medium between an absolutely silent restaurant (which is intimidating and uncomfortable) and one where kids are tearing around the place, screaming in high chairs and banging into people's seats. Or, indeed, where adults are shouting into phones, talking at top volume and guffawing loudly every few minutes. I find sitting next to a drunken office party just as annoying as sitting near toddlers being allowed do what they like.

Buxhoeveden · 05/05/2015 16:14

Gosh. Only a very odd person would expect absolute silence or some kind of perfection.

My contention was that at the other end of the scale only a very odd person (parent) would metaphorically shrug their shoulders and announce "children don't have a control panel" as though that were an answer to it all.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 05/05/2015 16:17

I cant imagine dd running around a restaurant. She would grab people's food and cutlery

oddfodd · 05/05/2015 16:26

My son is 8.

He cannot use a knife and fork properly
He does not understand that you have to be quiet
He doesn't understand that you have to sit still
I can keep him quiet and still but only with an ipad and headphones.

So either we can stay in or I can give him the ipad and headphones and he doesn't disturb everyone else.

What should I do?

Goldenbear · 05/05/2015 16:34

In what way is it 'odd' to point out that children don't have control panels? However hard some parents try, it is not always enough, there are some days where no amount of 'control' works because very young children in particular are impulsive, random, tired, hungry- you cannot expect adult reactions and behaviour from 1,2,3,4, 5 year olds - it is a learning process. I find it baffling that people expect the 'process' to be complete by 18 months!

Buxhoeveden · 05/05/2015 16:36

So you would leave the restaurant, wouldn't you?

Not make the glib odd observation that the DC don't have control panels?

They don't NEED control panels. They have parents.

YouTheCat · 05/05/2015 16:42

It's parents who do nothing about their children's behaviour that bug me. If someone is trying their best, then fine. If someone is resorting to a tablet and headphones, also fine.

If parent is sat dicking about on her phone/chatting to mates and child is running amok - not fine.

We didn't get taken out much when I was a kid. Going to the Wimpy in the 70s was the height of sophistication as far as we were concerned. And I can never ever remember being told to behave because it was never necessary.

SmartiesMakeMeNaughty · 05/05/2015 16:57

I rather resent the implication that all childless people are joyless grumps who loathe kids in general and think they should never be out in public unless the can behave like silent little Victorians.
I'm childless by choice and came to mumsnet so I could gen up on what life is like for parents as my friends started to have kids in order to be realistic and considerate without always having to ask them dumb questions.
I love spending time with the children of relatives and friends and this extends to (I hope) a nice, child-friendly disposition towards kids in general.
Of course I draw the line at NT children behaving dangerously in restaurants unchecked and I can't say I'm delighted if I find myself sitting next to a championship NT screamer whose parents don't seem to be doing anything to dial down the noise level but still, I'm not a dick - I don't make my displeasure known as I'd rather suck it up myself than make a stranger feel shit.
The flip side is that my much loved, ridiculously posh SIL, MIL and DNs are essentially the fucking Fulfords and create an obnoxious riot wherever we go. And yes, they have made at least one trip to PE a hellish experience for everyone else in attendance.
My NT DN will let out an ear-bleeding shriek to which SIL/MIL will "aw, cute little screamies!" As I die a little inside and try to look at the other diners with a face which says "I'm sorry - I know, but he's not mine."
Sorry for the essay but I just think it's important to say that not all childless people are miserable judgy bastards!

Enidblytonrules · 05/05/2015 17:01

Oh I have bad memories of an evening at Pizza Express. Went for a meal with a friend late evening and families were finishing up and leaving with their dcs. Started nice quiet meal when at around 9.15 pm couple turned up with dd aged around 15-18 months. She screamed constantly, climbed on the table and the dps just sat looking at their ipads - did not even put her in a high chair or have any entertainment/toys laid on for her!

Meals arrived for dp - dd was not given a meal so she ran around the restaurant screaming whilst they ate their meal. Occasionally they gave her a crust from their pizzas - like feeding a dog!

The DD kept coming to our table and we sent her away back to her dps - why did they come so late at night - would have been easier to get a takeaway and eat at home? Lots of eye-rolling from the staff and we beat a hasty retreat!

6Musiclover · 05/05/2015 17:49

My niece works in one if the pizza chains at the weekend (not PE) She says it's the middle class mummies who are the worst at controlling their kids, and many make no attemp at all to temper little Oscar and jocasta's behaviour..