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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think allowing our sons to play rugby is irresponsible parenting?

318 replies

AddToBasket · 04/05/2015 11:40

There's another article in the Times today about Professor Allyson Pollock's attempt to get people to understand how dangerous school rugby is. She's been abused on Twitter, stonewalled by other parents, ignored by Rugby's professional bodies. (Link here but behind paywall)

Basically, a combination of parental peer pressure and the Establishment mean people won't listen to what she has to say. Rugby as it is played at school at present is not safe.

AIBU to think we aren't protecting our sons? Why are we allowing this compulsory sport to put at risk so much for our boys?

OP posts:
NickiFury · 04/05/2015 12:28

So there's one Rookie. I'm sure there's a few about. I was trying to address the previous claim that we are raising a generation of lazy sloths who prefer to be on the computer.

BolshierAyraStark · 04/05/2015 12:28

No it shouldn't be compulsory but it should be an available option for those who wish to play.
YABVU to call it irresponsible parenting Hmm

rookiemere · 04/05/2015 12:28

I agree orlando there are other sports, but few that are as accessible for DS as rugby and also that his mates are involved in.

We have tried quite a few of the other ones, and as I say I'm glad it's cricket season now.

PeachyPants · 04/05/2015 12:28

YANBU, it shouldn't be compulsory. Some fantastic examples on this thread of people who can't seem to grasp the difference between anecdote and scientific evidence.

SunnyBaudelaire · 04/05/2015 12:29

LOL Pan I do hope so

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:30

There's not many sports where you have to try to use your body to make someone fall over,when scrums and mauls collapse and you've got bodies on your neck. The neck is quite important.

It's fun for some and I would want to encourage people who enjoy it. But I have every sympathy with a child who has no desire to play such a game when there are alternatives which are less "physical"

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:31

I don't think cricket is that physical.

If you're batting,you are waiting for your turn.

Fielding. The ball might come to you and you have to return it.

A bit like rounders. Wait at a base until someone bothers to throw the ball to you or sit on the grass chatting.

BackforGood · 04/05/2015 12:37

YABU (or she is). She has had something happen that has swayed her view.

Cricket - that genteel sport played by thousands, sadly lost an international Australian player last year because of the way the ball hit him during a match.
F1 (and no doubt most motor sports) - sadly there are fatalities and also horrific injuries on too regular a basis
Skiing - countless injuries - it's almost expected
Horse riding - I have no figures, but suspect that would be high up in the 'dangerous sports' list
Mountaineering - lives lost every year
Rock climbing
Trampolining
Gymnastics

The list can go on and on, but if you avoided anything without any risk attached you would have a fairly mundane and sad life.
As others have said, there are risks attached to sitting in a car, on a plane, walking down the street, sitting in your own home - think of all the gas explosions we've had over the last couple of years and there seem to have been a spate of cars driving into houses near us. Living your life does incur risks. Yes, we should do all we can to negate the risks, yes, look at the case reviews and see what can be changed, but ultimately I want to live my life.

iklboo · 04/05/2015 12:38

More people are killed & seriously injured or otherwise hurt falling down stairs than playing rugby.

PeachyPants · 04/05/2015 12:40

iklboo How many people do you think use the stairs each day vs how many play rugby. Also how practical do you think the avoidance of stairs is vs the avoidance of playing rugby?

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:41

Yes, we should do all we can to negate the risks, yes, look at the case reviews and see what can be changed, but ultimately I want to live my life

Yes - but should you be forced to do something which has dangers in when you don't have to.

As an adult, I have the choice to say "no, I won't do that. I have weighed up the risks and I think it's too dangerous for me. You do it"

A child at school does not really have that choice. I think that's wrong.

PanGalaticGargleBlaster · 04/05/2015 12:45

Unfortunately at school we all have memories of being forced to do a sport that we hated. In my case it was football and cross country running, utterly loathed them, thankfully I fell in love with rugby. I finally hung up my boots last year after a playing 'career' lasting 32 years. Do not regret one bit of it, yes I picked up some knocks along the way, some minor, some major, but it was all worth it. Have made some life long friends through the various clubs I played with, made me very close to my father at a young age when I started to play mini rugby, it taught me the value of teamsports, respect, not just for myself but for team mates and opposition like, I have experienced the agonies of losing a final by a point after you have pushed yourself beyond what you thought was possible. I have experienced the highs of winning the league and the immense pride that all the hard work you put in with your team paid off, I have maintained a high level of fitness, learned about nutrition and healthy eating, I have with my club mates raised thousands for charity and helped in the community. Yes, I drank a lot of beer too, had some crazy nights in the clubhouse that we still talk about today. It is a great sport in so many respects, yes there are risks and proper coaching is required from a young age but the positives outweigh the negatives.

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:48

It is a great sport in so many respects, yes there are risks and proper coaching is required from a young age but the positives outweigh the negatives

For you. That's your experience. You can't say that's true for everyone.

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:50

I could say exactly the same about sailing. It taught me loads and was character building.

But I don't expect everyone to have the same view nor do I expect everyone to sail because I enjoy it.

PeachyPants · 04/05/2015 12:51

Spot on OrlandoWoolf

bigredtractor · 04/05/2015 12:51

I wonder whether peoples perception of rugby is colouring judgement? E.g. TAG is completely non contact and played up to age 10 (sometimes older). Touch is played all the way to adult - no scrums, tackles or high speed collisions.

There's also been a lot of new work done on matching players on size & physical maturity, not just age because of the massively different way that children mature. NZ is leading the way with this but the N Hemisphere is certainly catching up.

There are v specific laws (in rugby) and rules (set by governing bodies) about the ages that kids can scrummage, or push, or lift etc. all designed to control risk and make the sport safer.

If your a parent with a DC playing rugby I'd challenge you to ask their teaches / coaches how up to date their qualifications /safety refreshers are. In Scotland its mandatory every year, whether you're coaching 6yos or grown men.

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 12:55

Tag rugby is great. I've taught it at school. Very fast, everyone involved - it's a bit like.....Rugby League (dare I mention that word Grin )

Original poster
AddToBasket · 04/05/2015 12:58

Bigredtractor - the links you've posted are a rugby forum and a researcher writing for the New Zealand rugby team. Do you have any less biased 'demolitions' of the Professor Pollock's research?

And to those people listing Formula 1 or Mountaineering as being dangerous Hmm - I also think it would be irresponsible to make those compulsory for 13yos too.

However, the point is not that there are risks in sport. The point is that Rugby is significantly more dangerous than other school sports. Also, that by being an Establishment sport, parents overlook the palpable risks that their children face when playing it.

OP posts:
JacquesHammer · 04/05/2015 13:00

Rugby should not be compulsory in schools. Rugby should be an option in schools.

It it VERY unreasonable to call it irresponsbile parenting.

Oh and daughters play rugby too - so for that you are VERY unreasonable Grin

I would prefer schools to teach rugby league - less contested scrums means arguably the greatest risk - scrum collapse - is all but negated

OrlandoWoolf · 04/05/2015 13:02

I would prefer schools to teach rugby league

Now that would go down like a lead balloon in some schools Grin

bigredtractor · 04/05/2015 13:02

Why are they biased? Surely they're writingwith relevant direct experience? In the second one her own research partner says he cant understand why some points have been jumped on by the media.

Original poster
AddToBasket · 04/05/2015 13:06

Jacques - I definitely did not mean to exclude girls from the discussion. I explained upthread that the issues of compulsory sport/parental peer pressure don't apply to the dd's game. More importantly, because of the lower weight/speed the risks to injury, while present, do not seem to be as manifest as in the ds's game.

OP posts:
FryOneFatManic · 04/05/2015 13:08

But there is risk in everything we do.

At school many years ago I inadvertently broke another girl's ankle during hockey, in an accident that could have been avoided if the other girl had been paying attention.

We had the usual sports, eg, football, rugby, hockey, netball, cricket, rounders, etc. And I'd say the accident rate was similar for all of them, with netball as the exception.

Original poster
AddToBasket · 04/05/2015 13:09

There might be a risk in everything that we do, but as parents shouldn't we assess the risks and rule out activities with high ones? Or ones where very serious consequences would result from something going wrong?

OP posts: