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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

How can you possibly believe in a benevolent God

886 replies

partialderivative · 30/04/2015 23:01

Once more, acts of 'god' have left communities blown apart.

Does any one really feel these vilages deserved it?

God's a bit of a cunt at times.

OP posts:

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:00

The DNA in a single flower alone contains information that is far beyond anything scientists could ever know.

Crap. You may be surprised at how much scientists have unravelled. I have worked in the field of DNA technology for many years. Synthetic genes can be built in a laboratory, I have build many such strands myself. Gene function and expression is a runaway science at the moment and our understanding of the information within DNA is increasing at an alarming rate.
To say that the genome of a flower contains information that is "far beyond anything scientists could ever know", is wooly, short sighted, ignorant and arrogant.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:05

Theoriginalsteamingnit that is so true. I often think of a book I read years ago about two Dutch sisters who were in a nazi concentration camp. Apart from all the other sufferings they went through one of them got lice. It was that that horrified her more than anything else. Her sister, who had a great faith in God told her to let the lice be for a reason. She managed to get her moved to the sick room. Somehow or other they survived the war and as far as I can remember set up a recuperating hospital. So for her, there was a reason for the lice.
I suppose now everyone's going to rush to say what about all the other Jews who didn't get saved. Nobody knows all the answers, but it wasn't God who built those death camps.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:08

fullto the brim no it's arrogant and ignorant to pretend you know otherwise. You sound like just another angry atheist.

BigDorrit · 05/05/2015 18:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:10

So ebola is for what purpose millyrose? All the children who have died- it's easier to explore the theories behind the big bang than to understand the mind of a murdering sadistic maniac that some call god..

Chiggers · 05/05/2015 18:10

Sister, at the moment, we may not know exactly how it happened, but in the future, I'm sure scientists will find that out and be able to create copies. Don't forget that Dolly the sheep was cloned, so there is scope for other things to be cloned.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:14

Bigdorrit well we are being picky. I'm sorry, I didn't purposely leave out the words you required, I thought my post made it clear. Yes, he created ugly things as well. Like I said everything has a purpose.
Fulltothebrim
God didn't create Ebola.

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:15

Who created ebola millyrose?

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 18:17

From years of reading atheists' posts on Mumsnet I am convinced that atheism is the belief that there is no god.

I struggle to see how telling atheists what they believe or think - and in particular saying you know better than atheists what they think and believe - is any less offensive than an atheist saying that Christians believe in fairy tales. It is unbelievably arrogant.

I've said this repeatedly. I don't believe in any gods. That's it. If someone were to come along and make a convincing case for the existence of a deity, I'd consider that case. In the meantime, I don't believe in any gods. I also do not believe in dragons, yetis, and the Loch Ness Monster. I am not equating these in any way to gods or religion, just listing further things in which I do not believe but if presented with evidence of their existence, I would consider their existence.

Belief in gods is not the rational, neutral or default state. Belief in a particular god - let's say the Christian god for the sake of argument - is certainly not the default state, as demonstrated by global demographics. Therefore suggesting that atheism can only be an active disbelief in God is an unbelievably narcissistic and self-centred view of the world in which you see your position as the default.

I can see why people end up thinking that, in a country with such entrenched Christian privilege. It's easy not to think properly about these things.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:20

fullto the brim sounds like you think there must be a God. You surely wouldn't call anyone that didn't exist a murdering sadistic maniac. If there is no God, why do you get so mad. Just get mad at nothing then. What a sadistic,murdering, manic bastard of a planet earth is.

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:22

I am not mad- I am trying to understand your perspective milly.

And you haven't answered my question- who created ebola?

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 18:24

Sister, when you set up an argument in which the existence of beautiful things = evidence for the existence of God, you set up some issues - did God also make the ugly things? If the existence of natural beauty is evidence of God's existence, why isn't the existence of ugly and abhorrent things in nature evidence of his non-existence? Why didn't he make the ugly things beautiful, as well? why does God get credit for natural beauty, but does not bear responsibility for natural horror?

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:26

www.everystudent.com/wires/Godreal.html
Very interesting article about DNA

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:28

Who created ebola milly?

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 18:32

fullto the brim sounds like you think there must be a God. You surely wouldn't call anyone that didn't exist a murdering sadistic maniac. If there is no God, why do you get so mad. Just get mad at nothing then. What a sadistic,murdering, manic bastard of a planet earth is.

Oh dear, are we back here again? How dull, this has been dealt with ad nauseum on this thread.

Last time I answered I got into trouble for mentioning Voldemort, so I won't do that again. How about I just repeat: it is entirely rational and valid to have an opinion on the nature of a construct that is widespread in our culture, without believing in the existence of that construct.

I believe that the Christian God has been written about extensively, talked about a lot, taught in our schools and promoted in our culture. I therefore have an idea of what that construct consists of in the popular conception - moreso because I have read extensively. I can therefore have a view on the nature of that construct. I do not believe the construct is real.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:32

Well I'm certain Ebola is something that has evolved probably from an ordinary flu virus. Who do you think created it fulltothebrim .......God? well at least we'd be agreed there is one then.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 18:35

Jassy I was speaking to Fulltothebrim. As for it being dull you don't have to keep coming on this thread you know.

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 18:36

Why's that article interesting? Clever man who has developed a lot of evidence has an opinion about that evidence, but that is not supported by any evidence.

That's hardly groundbreaking. Scientists (and others) do it all the time. They set out with 'this thing exists/happens, and my theory is that this is why'.

It doesn't become fact until they come back and say 'I've tested the theory, and here are the retires of those tests that show my hunch was right.

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 18:43

I know who you were speaking to. I just wonder why you keep going over the same territory? It comes across like not wanting to deal with the argument, so you'll play discredit the atheist instead, in a way that doesn't really stand up.

Do you disagree with what I said - or just object to the fact I said it?

Well I'm certain Ebola is something that has evolved probably from an ordinary flu virus

Leaving aside the virology of Ebola, flowers evolved from algal mats via gymnosperms. Why do you give your God the credit for the flowers, but not the virus?

Honestly, I don't mind a but what you believe. It's when you start calling things 'evidence' without basis that I have a problem, because I care an awful lot about evidence.

fulltothebrim · 05/05/2015 18:49

I concur with jassy's view millie. She is right- I am commenting on the christian construct. I have read the bible- it is there for all.
Your god has done some pretty dreadful things.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 19:38

why does God get credit for natural beauty, but does not bear responsibility for natural horror?
On a post that that is all about an earthquake that God is being blamed for (and all the other terrible tragedies in the world) I find that statement quite bizarre.

Sistermillyrose · 05/05/2015 19:44

Jessyradlet oh dear, I'm going over the same things because I keep getting the same old things said to me, or my posts being deliberately misread.

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 19:47

Why?

I'm simply questioning the logic of what you said, your own position - if in your view, God is responsible for evolution that leads to beauty (so flowers are evidence of God), why is God not responsible for evolution that leads to negative things, such as ebolavirus, again in your view?

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 19:48

Sorry - who has misread or more presented your posts? I apologise if it was me.

JassyRadlett · 05/05/2015 19:57

*misrepresented

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